BIAB CHINOOK IPA

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For accentuating hop profile, calcium sulphate/gypsum is the salt you want to look at.

Personally though, while I really like chinook, you won't (in my experience) get much fruitiness or character many associate with hoppiness. It's great for bringing resin to balance fruir - you want fruit to balance the pine.

Chinook/cascade, chinook/amarillo, chinook/citra or even chinook/styrian goldings. Combinations and permutations of the above work well.
 
For accentuating hop profile, calcium sulphate/gypsum is the salt you want to look at.

Personally though, while I really like chinook, you won't (in my experience) get much fruitiness or character many associate with hoppiness. It's great for bringing resin to balance fruir - you want fruit to balance the pine.

Chinook/cascade, chinook/amarillo, chinook/citra or even chinook/styrian goldings. Combinations and permutations of the above work well.
I put some cascade, but not nearly enough. I didnt have any more left... :(
Note for future me: don't be so cheap with the hops

Gypsum!
One thing more to read about
Thanks!
 
@manticle @Dan Pratt

Lots to read about water:
https://byo.com/bock/item/1478-the-elements-of-brewing-water
http://howtobrew.com/book/section-3/understanding-the-mash-ph/balancing-the-malts-and-minerals
https://www.morebeer.com/articles/treating_homebrew_water
http://howtobrew.com/book/section-3...h-ph/using-salts-for-brewing-water-adjustment
http://brulosophy.com/2016/08/08/water-chemistry-pt-5-boil-ph-in-an-ipa-exbeeriment-results/
http://brulosophy.com/2014/09/18/a-pragmatic-approach-to-water-manipulation/


This is my water profile: (http://www.sydneywater.com.au/web/g...ments/document/zgrf/mdq0/~edisp/dd_044731.pdf):
- PH 7.8-8.0 --> a little bit alkaline / basic
-Total dissolved solids: 100-136, so it's quite soft

About the other components, I don't think I understand this report...

30-39 Calcium hardness
... or 11.4 - 17.3 Calcium ???
18-27 Magnesium
???? Bicarbonate (HCO3-1)
7.4-8.8 Sulfate (SO4-2)
12.3 - 19.0 Sodium (Na+1)
25-35.5 Chloride (Cl-1)

For an Indian Pale Ale, I should try to mimic the Burton-on-Trent water which according to this article (http://howtobrew.com/book/section-3/understanding-the-mash-ph/balancing-the-malts-and-minerals) it has:
352 Calcium (Ca+2)
24 Magnesium (Mg+2)
320 Bicarbonate (HCO3-1)
820 Sulfate (SO4-2)
44 Sodium (Na+1)
16 Chloride (Cl-1)

They don't match at all! But the Calcium, Sulfate and Bicarbonate (which I'm still to identify in the water report) are in a way different range!

So for making a proper IPA what should you do about the water? Which is the proper PH ? 5.4? if my PH isn't right what should I do to change it? Modify the grain proportion? add acid malt? use kilos of gypsum? phosphoric acid? is that even legal in Australia? What's the proper way to calculate all of this?

What do you think of this kit:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Homebrew...hash=item1ece942440:m:mQGXEo0uCqYJLo2RtMcw1Lw

I think this deserves a full post!

Weird idea: Dissolve the priming sugar in water and infusion some hops, like a very sweet hop-tea (more like a hop-syrup :p), filter the hops and use a syringe to prime the bottles with it! EXTRA HOPS DIRECTLY INTO THE BOTTLE! jejejeje
 
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So many questions Hez.
All relevant though, to a point. Yes there should be another post, and you can probably sift the forums for all the answers.

What should you do about the water?
At an extreme, buy or make distilled / reverse osmosis water and build the profile from scratch.
Adding the ppm per mineral/compound you need. To get the profile you need.

getting the correct pH for the mash, i think is around 5.4 is important too, you can do a few things but kilos of gypsum is not one of those things you should try. you can use acid and phosphoric is easily available. and you too can use acid malt.
if i were you i would try on 100mL of distilled water, whatever you want maybe acid is easiest, dose the water and see what you results are, then scale them out.

you would need to do a proper check that with preboiled wort first though, just to see how it pans out.

proper pH for finished beer (IPA) de-gassed mind you, should be 4.0 or even lower, around 3.5.

for now, tick it up to learning, water chemistry may arguably be more important than controlling fermentation temperature.

good water makes good beer is a good rule of thumb.
i wouldn't worry about the ebay thing at the moment.
a good pH meter might be a better investment.

and again, going back to the root of the issue, no real hoppines, you have make sure to keep O2 out of the finished product too.
 
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So many questions Hez.
All relevant though, to a point. Yes there should be another post, and you can probably sift the forums for all the answers.

What should you do about the water?
At an extreme, buy or make distilled / reverse osmosis water and build the profile from scratch.
Adding the ppm per mineral/compound you need. To get the profile you need.

getting the correct pH for the mash, i think is around 5.4 is important too, you can do a few things but kilos of gypsum is not one of those things you should try. you can use acid and phosphoric is easily available. and you too can use acid malt.
if i were you i would try on 100mL of distilled water, whatever you want maybe acid is easiest, dose the water and see what you results are, then scale them out.

you would need to do a proper check that with preboiled wort first though, just to see how it pans out.

proper pH for finished beer (IPA) de-gassed mind you, should be 4.0 or even lower, around 3.5.

for now, tick it up to learning, water chemistry may arguably be more important than controlling fermentation temperature.

good water makes good beer is a good rule of thumb.
i wouldn't worry about the ebay thing at the moment.
a good pH meter might be a better investment.

Quote from this article: http://brulosophy.com/2014/09/18/a-pragmatic-approach-to-water-manipulation/
"I tend to view water manipulation as more of a final step in a homebrewer’s development where already tasty recipes are taken to the next level by honing in on a specific water profile. Water is a polishing agent and you can’t polish a turd."
First of all I have to be able to make something worth honing and polishing. But I'll keep on studying the water chemistry. I will put another post when I know more!

and again, going back to the root of the issue, no real hoppines, you have make sure to keep O2 out of the finished product too.

Tell me if I have it right, please...

1- After the boil you have to try not to expose the beer to the air in order to avoid contamination (bacterias, fungus, wild yeast...): I cover my kettle with the lid when the amount of steam/vapor starts to reduce and when it's at pitching temp I pour it quickly (without strainers or anything else) from the kettle to the fermenter.

2- Before pitching the yeast, you have to oxigenate as much as you can the wort. I don't have an oxygen tank, so the cheap alternative is to shake the fermenter to try to "mix some air inside" the wort. Another cheap alternative is to put an aquarium air pump. Both ways (shaking and pumping air) will have the same risk in terms of possible contamination, wont them?

3- While fermenting, the airlock allows the air to escape from the inside of the fermenter. This will be the air captured when closing the fermenter + the C02 the yeast produces. The CO2 is heavier than air, so at some point all the "air" inside the fermenter will be almost 100% C02. For dry hopping you need to open the fermenter and drop your hop sock inside. While you do that, you might capture some air, but again, the co2 has a high density, so this cheeky air is not likely to reach the beer itself, anyway, the fermentation is still going on, so new C02 will expel the unwanted air from our VIP CO2 environment.

4- After fermenting I bottle using a "wand" (springloaded valve ) directly connected to the fermenter, and once the bottle is full I cap it right away. The air captured inside the bottle will remain closer to the cap due to the same old tune.. new CO2... higher density bla bla as well as the air that goes inside the fermenter when you remove the airlock for filling the bottles.

I don't do bulk priming for these reasons:
- I don't have another container with a tap/spigot than the fermenter and I don't want to buy another thing I have to clean, sanitize and store which I'll have to dump in less than a year (because I'll be leaving Australia).
- I only brew 10L batches. Priming 30 bottles is not that bad. And my modified syringe for calculating different amounts of priming sugar method works like a treat.
- I don't beleive having the turb inside the fermenter affects the beer, I agree with Larry (https://beernbbqbylarry.com/2017/04/29/why-i-dont-rack-to-a-secondary-fermenter/)
-> Transfering the beer from the fermenter to another container would expose it to air and thus to oxidation and possible contamination.

I have pretty clear the causes of the non-hoppiness in this beer:
1st main cause: I put less than half the hops I should have used for dry hopping
2nd main cause: I didn't do a proper 0' addition
other causes that might affect: fermentation temperature, PH, minerals, water filtration, etc. etc. etc.

All in all, I don't think I had a lot of oxydation due to my process. The problem is my recipe was wrong and I was a cheap with the hops.

Thank you!
 
From what i have just read you are heading on the right track....researching information. Each batch, try to apply some of that information to brew better beer.

The water is a very important part of brewing and a quite complex part but within time it will seem standard to make adjustments to suit the beer you are trying to make. The water you do have is very soft, great for lagers which after the IPA adventures you will find your way to them as a valued style to brew.

To provide some simple input for your IPA water, don't go overboard with the Burton on Trent you can achieve the desired outcome with less ppm targeting sulphate at 250-300ppm and your chloride at 50-70ppm. The pH of the beer at 25c should be around 5.4. Mash temperature also will be a key part to getting those hops to pull through, something to consider.

So in all honesty to get that hoppy character, you do need some attention on other brewing skills but you do also need alot more late hops, hop-stands, whirlpooling and dry hopping and like much like Manticle said, pair it with another hop or run with a much fruitier hop like Amarillo or Citra or Simcoe.
 
From what i have just read you are heading on the right track....researching information. Each batch, try to apply some of that information to brew better beer.

The water is a very important part of brewing and a quite complex part but within time it will seem standard to make adjustments to suit the beer you are trying to make. The water you do have is very soft, great for lagers which after the IPA adventures you will find your way to them as a valued style to brew.

To provide some simple input for your IPA water, don't go overboard with the Burton on Trent you can achieve the desired outcome with less ppm targeting sulphate at 250-300ppm and your chloride at 50-70ppm. The pH of the beer at 25c should be around 5.4. Mash temperature also will be a key part to getting those hops to pull through, something to consider.

So in all honesty to get that hoppy character, you do need some attention on other brewing skills but you do also need alot more late hops, hop-stands, whirlpooling and dry hopping and like much like Manticle said, pair it with another hop or run with a much fruitier hop like Amarillo or Citra or Simcoe.
Thank you!

With all your advices my next IPA will be amazing! ;)

I'm drinking one right now and it's quite good... Piney! The piney-ipa! Jejeje
 
I encourage you to read and research water chemistry so you understand it. However, as a very simple fix for your next ipa or even apa , use some cascade or amarillo or citra in higher amounts for later hopping, up your dry hops and just put a small level teaspoon of calcium sulphate/gypsum into the kettle. Think of it as seasoning a soup.

Mash pH, calcium levels, etc can all come later.
 
I encourage you to read and research water chemistry so you understand it. However, as a very simple fix for your next ipa or even apa , use some cascade or amarillo or citra in higher amounts for later hopping, up your dry hops and just put a small level teaspoon of calcium sulphate/gypsum into the kettle. Think of it as seasoning a soup.

Mash pH, calcium levels, etc can all come later.
Thank you! I currently have a 100% citra american amber ale which turned into an english brown ale with IPA and Chinook on the go, but my next IPA attempt will be citra/Amarillo
 
Forgot you do half batches so 1/2 level tsp - you can add but you can't take away
 
I already have the recipe for my next IPA. It's not my own, so no questions really...* I simply adapted the most accepted recipe for this clone, the Zombie Dust:
https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/5916/zombie-dust-clone-all-grain
to what I have and what I like and I wanted to share it with you.

These are the only changes I've made:
- incorporated @manticle 's magic (1/2 teaspoon gypsum)
- increased the late 1' hop addition (0' doesn't work in the calculator)
- increased the dry hops (the original recipe asked for 3.8g/L, I've amost doubled it, to me that doesn't work)
- increased the carbonation because I like it that way

I've already bought a bigger 25L pot (boiling kettle)! It will arrive hopefully next week, but I'm not going to brew this one until I try the Amber/Brown Ale I brewed last week (I'll bottle it this weekend, so at least 2 weeks more). I still want to brew a hefeweizen-bavarian-style (with more colour/flavour), a REAL amber ale (the one I've made is going to be too roasted/brown, I think :S) and a belgian/french saison (i'll probably do that one in summer, I still have to study a little more about that style, and I think I've never tried one! :S ) so I don't know the order yet... we'll see.

*Well yes, I have a question: what about the mash temp? Is 67º ok? and 10' mash out or no mash out?
IPAs aren't suposed to be very dry and being a bigger beer if I raise too much the temp I won't have enough conversion, will I ?


ZOMBIE DUST CLONE - AMERICAN IPA - BIAB - 10L BATCH

GRAIN:
2860g 81.0% Pale 2-Row
280g 7.9% Munich - Light 10L
130g 3.6% CaraPils 1.8L
130g 3.6% Crystal 60L
130g 3.6% Melanoidin 25L
TOTAL: 3530g

68% efficiency
SRM: 8.84
Preboil OG: 1.039
OG: 1.061
FG: 1.017
ABV: 5.75%

BOIL:
60' 7.4g Gypsum/Calcium Sulphate (1/2 teaspoon)
60' 8g Citra -> 25.75 IBU
15' 10g Citra -> 15.97 IBU
10' 1/2 tablet Deltafloc
10' 10g Citra -> 11.67 IBU
5' 10g Citra -> 6.42 IBU
1' 27g Citra -> 3.75 IBU (steep 30' before chilling)
DRY HOP: Citra 60g

IBU: 63.55
TOTAL HOPS: 125g !!!!

MASH:
80' 67ºC <- 16.30L (TOTAL WATER 21.3L - SPARGE 5L)
10' 75.5ºC
sparge 75.5ºC <- 5L

FERMENT:
Fermentis / Safale - English Ale Yeast S-04
15º - 23.8ºC (pitch @20º)

CARBONATION:
3.0 CO2 Vol.
2.9g Table sugar

WATER CALCULATIONS:
Batch: 10L
Grain absorption: 0.73L/kg
Boil-off rate: 4.48l/hour
Trub: 2L
Kettle size: 25L

TOTAL WATER NEEDED 21.30L
STRIKE WATER TEMP 68ºC
TOTAL MASH VOLUME 23.65L
PREBOIL WORT 18.72L
POSTBOIL WORT 12.00L
 
Hi I plan on brewing the Zombie Dust clone this weekend. I've been studying a little bit more about water chemistry. If you're interested I posted into and old post of this forum:
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/threads/sydney-water-profile.55767/#post-1482857

Minerals/salts summary:
Chalk/Calcium Carbonate CaCO3: 2g
Baking Soda/Sodium Bicarbonate NaHCO3: 5g
Gypsum/Calcium Carbonate CaSO4: 10g
Epsom Salt/Magnesium Sulphate MgSO4: 1g
Canning Salt/Not Iodized Table Salt NaCl: 2g

PH adjust:
2g Citric/Tartaric Acid
or substitute 100g of the pale malt for acidulated malt (2.8% of the total grain bill)
 
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Gypsum is calcium sulphate. I recommend you leave both sodium bicarbonate and chalk out and just go calcium sulphate and calcium chloride with more sulphate than chloride.
 
Gypsum is calcium sulphate. I recommend you leave both sodium bicarbonate and chalk out and just go calcium sulphate and calcium chloride with more sulphate than chloride.
Yes, sorry, it was a typo.
I think I agree with you on that, I don't see the point on trying to emulate Burton on Trent water.. I don't think that's what they do to brew this particular beer anyway...

So, only gypsum/calcium sulphate but I don't find the calcium chloride.. would it be advisable to put the non iodized table salt?

About the acid which one do you recommend citric, tartaric, malic or acidulated malt?
Thank you!
 
Phosphoric, lactic or acidulated. Go easy on sodium/table salt. A pinch at most.
 
@manticle, It's not that I don't trust you is that I have interest and I want to know it by myself. You were almost spot on! Half a teaspoon of gypsum is pretty much it! A teaspoon of gypsum in grams (https://www.aqua-calc.com/calculate/volume-to-weight) is 7.4g

I looked around and it seems this is the more accepted easy-water-calculator:
http://www.ezwatercalculator.com/

According to this one, I could increase a little the Gypsum and still be on the range and I could add some non-iodized-table-salt (NaCl) but... well, let's see how this one goes and maybe next time I do the exact same recipe I try changing one more thing...

About the melanoidin malt, I've read it's "like munich on esteroids", it's more acidic than munich, so I set it into the water calculator spreadsheet as "roasted/toasted", so with the gypsum and without the other alkaline/basic salts (chalk and sodium bicarbonate) it looks my PH will be exactly in the middle of the range: 5.48 (recommended 5.4-5.6), so... I don't need acidulated malts!

I think I'm happy with that, I'll do the shopping later! jejeje
Thank you very much!



These are all the water chemistry calculations:

Starting water profile:
Ca+2 14.35 mg/L
Mg+2 22.50 mg/L
Na+ 15.65 mg/L
Cl- 30.25 mg/L
SO4-2 8.10 mg/L
HCO3- 41.5 mg/L

16.3L Mash Vol.
5.0L Sparge Vol.
2860g Base 2Row
280g Base Munich
130g 60.0L Crystal Malt
130g 1.8L Crystal Malt
130g Roasted/Toasted (melanoiden)

Adjust Mash pH DOWN:
Mash:
9.0g Gypsum/Calcium Sulphate/CaSO4
0g Calcium Chloride/CaCl2
0g Epsom Salt/MgSO4
Sparge:
2.8g Gypsum/Calcium Sulphate/CaSO4
0g Calcium Chloride/CaCl2
0g Epsom Salt/MgSO4

Adjust Mash pH UP:
0g Slaked Lime/ Ca(OH)2
0g Baking Soda/ NaHC03
0g Chalk/ CaCO3

Ca: 140 <- Palmer's recommended range 50-150
Mg: 23 <- Palmer's recommended range 10-30
Na: 16 <- Palmer's recommended range 0-150
Cl: 30 <- Palmer's recommended range 0-250
SO4: 316 <- Palmer's recommended range 50-350
Cl to SO4 Ratio: 0,10 <- Below .77, May enhance bitterness

Alkalinity (CaCO3): 34
RA: -79
Estimated pH (room temp): 5,48 <- Palmer's recommended range 5.4-5.6
 
I'm going to brew tomorrow the "Zombie Dust Hopped Up Clone"...

I've bought MORE hops and changed the hop schedule.
The calculator doesn't work with 0' additions, that's why the last one is marked as 1', but I plan to do as @Thefatdoghead told me in my last Amber Ale, steep for 30' when the wort is around 80ºC before chilling.
I've increased substantially the amount of hops at 0' and the dry hops. I don't know why, maybe it's the water, or the size of my batch, but every time I've tried to do a hoppy beer I've failed, I hope this time with @manticle help for chemistry and the massive 0' hop addition and dry hop it works out. I'm still learning... do you think it is too much?

Remember my batch is 10L + 2L trub.

HOP SCHEDULE:

60' 6g Citra 13.8% AA -> 20.15IBU

15' 10g Citra 13.8% AA -> 16.66IBU

10' 1/2 tablet Deltafloc
10' 10g Citra 13.8% AA -> 12.18IBU

5' 16g Citra 13.8% AA -> 10.71IBU

1' 45g Citra 13.8% AA -> 6.52IBU (steep 30' @80ºC before chilling)

DRY HOP: Citra 80g

IBU: 66.22
TOTAL HOPS: 167g !!!!
 
I finally brewed it on saturday.

My new bigger kettle (25L) is a major improvement! Now I have more space for the grain, and I don't have to keep adding water to the boil. But the boiloff calculation I made wasn't right. With my old kettle (15L) it was around 4.2L/h so being 2cm wider in diameter I calculated it would be 4.4L/h, but it turned out to be 4.1L/h. Maybe it is like that because the air humidity or because using more water on a bigger kettle with the same burner results in a weaker boiling? I don't know.

I also calculated wrong the grain absorption. Previously it was around 0.7L/kg of grain and this time it was 0.37L/kg. I increased the amount of sparge water from 3L to 5L, maybe this is one consecuence, the sparge water washes all the sugar and the water "stuck" to the grain diminishes.

Even with the extra water (from boiling and grain absorption) the OG was 1063 instead of the calculated 1061, meaning I've improved my efficiency 2% from a very shitty 68% to a just shitty 70%. I wonder what would happen if I increase the sparge water to 7L, will I have 72%?
The minimum amount of water I need for the mash (so the grain if fully submerged with my bag/kettle setup) is around 13L and my initial water is around 20-21L (depending on the recipe), that leaves a maximum sparge water of 7-8L (40%). I've seen people doing sparge with more water than the initial mash water, so I'll try that next time (use 40% of the total water to sparge).

This is also the first time I've done any water adjustements affecting the PH so I guess this must have helped too.

After two failed attempts of making a hoppy IPA (they were ok but not hoppy) I decided I wasn't going to be a cheap with the hops again. My homebrew supplier gave me a discount on the second container of hops so I went crazy. The 45g 0' addition (remember I do 10L batches) left a very strong scent. I will do a 80g dry hop using two hop-socks and some marbles to keep them well submerged. This IS going to be a really hoppy beer por mis cojones!

About the fermentation... :S after 1 day the airlock was bubbling a lot. They say US-04 is not as active as US-05 but I don't think so.
I don't have a fermentation fridge, so I use the t-shirt method. It worked nice with my last amber ale but yesterday it was so hot! It reached a maximum of 24º for a couple of hours, eventhough I used the pond pump to recirculate the water and I put some ice and an esky block to cool down the water a little. I would say it is at 20º most of the time with little periods of 22º and an isolated maximum of 24º yesterday. The temperature is going to go down a little for the rest of the week, so I think I will be able to keep it under 20º until the fermentation is done, but I had bad luck yesterday. :(
According to safale specifications US-04 range is 12-25º but recommended 15-20º, so either way, the yeast has been "on its range" and I should have a healthy beer.. BUT...
I hope I won't have too much "fruityness".
I'll keep track here in case someone is interested.
 
just a couple of things to add:

That higher fermentation temp will throw esters into the beer, which you may be able to dull somewhat with the dry hop of citra - tip: get temperature control fridge for femrntation!!

Speaking of dry hop - don't use socks, just throw them all into the top of the beer, let them get 100% coverage and contact with the wort. they will expand and sit at the surface for a day or two and then start to drop into solution. before you package, make space in the kitchen fridge, cold crash the beer to 4c overnight and all the hops and yeast will drop out before you package the beer.

Don't get hung up on efficiency, find what your system does and target that amount each brew. if you really need to improve, increasing the mash out time to 30mins or higher tends to increase % because the wort can drain from the mash much easier.
 
just a couple of things to add:

That higher fermentation temp will throw esters into the beer, which you may be able to dull somewhat with the dry hop of citra - tip: get temperature control fridge for femrntation!!

Speaking of dry hop - don't use socks, just throw them all into the top of the beer, let them get 100% coverage and contact with the wort. they will expand and sit at the surface for a day or two and then start to drop into solution. before you package, make space in the kitchen fridge, cold crash the beer to 4c overnight and all the hops and yeast will drop out before you package the beer.

Don't get hung up on efficiency, find what your system does and target that amount each brew. if you really need to improve, increasing the mash out time to 30mins or higher tends to increase % because the wort can drain from the mash much easier.

I'd really really like to get a fridge for fermentation. I've already found the controler and everything, but my condition/situation in here is complicated. My company sent me here to Sydney for a project (I'm from Spain). I was suposed to go back this month but they just extended my stance until next year. I never wanted to buy big/expensive equipment here because I don't think I will be able to carry it back home when I leave and also I don't own a car here (I have a nice one in Spain :D ) ! But, ok, a second hand mini fridge for my 15L fermenter wouldn't be so expensive, I could simply give it away when I leave and I can always ask a friend for the car, but... my girlfriend is totally against it. I'll try to convince her harder.
So I guess until autumn I will experiment with wheat beers and saisons! In fact, I've been studying a little, and I'm preparing a new post for a saison.

About the dry hop, my fridge is really small and is always full, I don't know if I'll be able to do that. If I don't, what would happen with the hops? will they go to the bottles or will they settle down with the rest of the trub (I don't have a secondary fermenter, I bottle directly from the "primary", or in my case THE fermenter)?

About the efficiency, is not like I'm crazy about it... I have had 68% until this one! it's just one more thing. I want to improve my brewing technique, that's all. Thank you for the tip, I'll try that next time. Once I have a good technique I will have a consistent efficiency (better or worse) and that's it, I guess. I'm not planning on making weird stuff just for 1% more efficiency, grain is cheap when you do 10L batches.

Thank you very much, @Dan Pratt.
 

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