Benefits Of A 3v Brew Rig?

[Nick JD]

3V brewing is like putting a turbo and a loud pipe on your Hyundai.

You think you're cool but you've just got to B, from A, like everyone else who did it less obnoxiously.

 

[Brewman_]

Here is a lifting device that I use. It is a two pulley on top and a single pulley on the bottom. This makes it easier and safer, but anyway back to the OP....



Fear_n_loath

 

[DUANNE]

3V brewing is like putting a turbo and a loud pipe on your Hyundai.

You think you're cool but you've just got to B, from A, like everyone else who did it less obnoxiously.

that must make k+k the greatest thing in the world. why woud you bother with being obnoxious heating water and mashing and boiling when all you had to do was dump water and some goo in a bucket and still get to the same destination at the end, beer. still got you from a to b didnt it? or really just buy a case of vb its still sorta beer in the end, beats ******* around making it, you get straight to your destination without disturbing anyone. i would rather take my time be obnoxious and enjoy the journey cruising in a nice car rather than treat the ride as just a means to an end and taking the train.

 

[Bribie G]

that must make k+k the greatest thing in the world. why woud you bother with being obnoxious heating water and mashing and boiling when all you had to do was dump water and some goo in a bucket and still get to the same destination at the end, beer. still got you from a to b didnt it? or really just buy a case of vb its still sorta beer in the end, beats ******* around making it, you get straight to your destination without disturbing anyone. i would rather take my time be obnoxious and enjoy the journey cruising in a nice car rather than treat the ride as just a means to an end and taking the train.

I get half price on the train. When I move to NSW I will get 1/n price on the train with my pension card where n is a large number.

 

[rotten]

I chose to go 3V because the process appealed to me and made sense. The 4-6 hour brew day doesn't phase me at all. It all flows nicely and the extra cleaning is only a mash tun as the HLT doesn't need cleaning.

Electric temp controlled HLT, tech ice mash tun, spiral burner keggle FTW :lol:

 

[Thirsty Boy]

Im a little over having 5litres loss to trub so im thinking about heading this way.

EDIT: anyone know if the BIAB Liquor to grist ratio or presence of bag and false bottom will effect setting a grain filter bed?

Thing is - if you have a mash tun, you then lose more liquid to both deadspace in the MT and also to the wetter spent grain. As a matter of interest.... it basically evens out. The amount extra you lose in the kettle in BIAB, is about the same as the amount extra you lose in the MT in a 3V system, give or take a little either way depending on your set-up. so you are just trading places for your losses, not actually reducing them in any significant way. BTW - 5L is too much... you're doing something wrong.

The L:G ratio wont matter for setting a grain bed, read a little about no-sparge brewing in the 3V world. It ends up (and sometimes starts) with the same L:G ratio as BIAB anyway. The bag over a false bottom will effect the way the system drains and the way your lauter runs. A bag over a FB is essentially the same as having a FB with the same parameters as the mesh in the bag. Its not ideal - BUT - not ideal isn't the same as saying its not workable, or even not good. Plenty of people lauter with a bag over a FB, or lauter through FBs that are a chunk away from ideal. It'll work fine if you decide thats what you want to do.

edit - the bit about liquid losses, is for batch or no-sparging. Its not true for continuous sparging.

 

[Wolfy]

... plus i can do 2 batchs in a day easier.
Mash in one Keg with a false bottom and Bag for easy cleaning, Get to mashout, vorlauf till clearish, rack to Boil Kettle.
Raise bag and Start mash 2 while brew one is boiling.

It takes me no more than a couple of minutes to scoop out the spent grain and give the mash tun a rinse with water, I'd suggest it's quicker and easier than lifting/draining/moving a bag full of grain.

 

[adryargument]

3v - easy.
If you don't work in a brewery, the closest experience your going to get is managing a 3V system.
Standing over a bucket with a bag doesn't really achieve the same sensation.

To me - that alone is worth going 3v.

 

[MHB]

I think I have brewed on every type and configuration imaginable, at present Im brewing on a Braumeister; it was the arrival of the Braumeister on the scene here in Australia that kicked off the whole BIAB thing. Dont get me wrong I love my Braumeister and it will probably be how I brew for the rest of my life, but the win lotto dont-have-to-work-no-more-too-much-time-on-my-hands rig would be a 4V system, a seriously sexy cereal cooker/decoction pot, a well made rims with something remarkably similar to a Braumeister controller managing the mash programme.

Until you have experienced the control you get with a well engineered system like a Braumeister you dont know what you are missing, I couldnt go back to a rig that didnt give me the to the minute and degree C repeatability that I now have. Remember that a lot of my brewing nowadays is recipe development and testing and that repeatability is vital.

Every system has its pros and cons and I dont believe any one option is the be all and end all, a system that allows you to consistently make good beer, that you can afford and that allows you to brew the beer you want to drink is the best system for you/me.

Thirty years of it and I still love brewing
Mark

 

[glenwal]

So why doesn't the bag count as a vessel?


BIAB is really a 2 tier gravity fed system. You mash in the bag, then lift the bag and gravity transfers the sweet liquor from the bag (MLT) to the kettle.

 

[Barley Belly]

You get to slag off at and look down your nose at anyone who hasn't reached the dizzying heights of brewing excellence that can only possibly be achieved by 3V brewing!

Anyone else should just buy VB and drink it hot, out of a used ashtray and it'd still taste better than any non 3V brewer could ever hope to produce.

Non 3V time wasters.

I don't even know why we let them on OUR (the 3V elite, that is) Forum.

 

[MHB]

So why doesn't the bag count as a vessel?


BIAB is really a 2 tier gravity fed system. You mash in the bag, then lift the bag and gravity transfers the sweet liquor from the bag (MLT) to the kettle.

vessel (vsl)
n.
1. A hollow utensil, such as a cup, vase, or pitcher, used as a container, especially for liquids.

Bags dont contain liquid!
Mark

 

[stef]

I have always been a BIABer (well, since i started brewing a year or so ago). For me it was the cheapest, most convenient option.

I am, however, currently building an esky mashtun. I'll continue to BIAB most of the time, however i wanted a mashtun for those occassions when:

1) i wanted to brew high gravity beers. I know eff. will drop on any system, however i'm pretty limited by my BIAB pot size
2) i want the time savings of mashing one batch while boiling another (i dont have another HLT, so i'll have to work something out yet...) as i brew back to back 90% of the time.

Stef

 

[Nick JD]

vessel (vsl)
n.
1. A hollow utensil, such as a cup, vase, or pitcher, used as a container, especially for liquids.

Bags dont contain liquid!
Mark

Vessels also hold seamen.

 

[glenwal]

vessel (vsl)
n.
1. A hollow utensil, such as a cup, vase, or pitcher, used as a container, especially for liquids.

Bags don't contain liquid!
Mark

contain
Verb:
1.Have or hold (someone or something) within.


I'd say the bag definately has liquid within it (It however doesn't restrain the liquid)

 

[iralosavic]

I was BIABing for a while, but have recently switched to a three tier gravity system (which I plan to add HERMS capability to in the future.

My reasons are as follows:

1. Despite following all instructions appropriately, the stick element in my BIAB keggle kept scorching the work. Mark went to some length to clarify the cause being a poorly suited heat density of the element. Now I could have got an electrician to connect better suited element up, but this was only the first reason.

2. The keggle would NOT whirlpool, so if the pick up didn't block up, which it often did (and I tried various pick up designs), then I'd be lucky to lose any less than 3-4L to trub. Now this is more vessle specific than a failing of BIAB, but nonetheless being able to whirflic/brewbrite etc is something that I'd place a reasonable significance on for a BIABer.

3. I discovered that simplicity and takingy mind out of the task was the opposite to what I wanted. When I'm not at work I'm chasing after two kids under 2, so when I get to my brewery I want things to be as mentally stimulating and time consuming as possible, simply to justify the time out and to get the biggest "hobby factor" out of it. I enjoy the extra steps and the capacity for greater control and fine tuning. You can't really muck around with grist:water in BIAB, for example.

Is 3v necessary? No. It just comes down to what your objectives are. There's really no need for anyone to get defensive or offensive to justify their preferences as we all have our own reasons. So my advice is to figure out your own goals and go down the path that best suits.

 

[Bada Bing Brewery]

I did 50+ BIABS and loved it. I'm now a 3V and use the HERMIT from Nev. It allows precise mashing times and temp control and step mashing is the go. I tried step mashing a few times with BIAB but it was difficult (not impossible). Go the HERMIT bro !!
Cheers
BBB

 

[pk.sax]

@ Charst

I've tried the bag + fb a few times. What I found was that trying to get the grain bed to happen IN the bag was a waste of time. As TB points out, the bag is the fb. The pores are too small to allow effective drainage and recirculation to clear.

If you are having to lift the bag to gen it to drain then what is the point? Really.

I have simply dialled back the crush on my mill one slot and won't use a bag in there whatsoever. While it makes grain removal easier it defeats the bring small bits to the top of the filter bed objective of fb construction in a mash tun. It's like a 1 stage air filter in a car, it gets clogged up eventually and continuously. A fb is like a snorkel, yes, it picks up dust/water but that settles out of the way of the air intake and is removed. Roughly speaking.

That all said, if I make a change it'd prolly be a braumeister. Life is too busy and I've not brewed in more than a month, kegs aren't empty yet because I don't drink enough!

 

[manticle]

vessel (vsl)
n.
1. A hollow utensil, such as a cup, vase, or pitcher, used as a container, especially for liquids.

apostrophe/əˈpstrəfē
Noun:
A punctuation mark (') used to indicate possession (e.g., Mark's Homebrew, Mark's Kegable soft drinks)

Cite
   sahyt/saɪt
verb (used with object), cited, citing.
1. to quote (a passage, book, author, etc.), especially as an authority: He cited the constitution in his defense.
2. to mention in support, proof, or confirmation; refer to as an example: He cited many instances of abuse of power.


sight

saɪt
n.
1. The ability to see.
2. The act or fact of seeing: hoping for a sight of land; caught sight of a rare bird.
3. Field of vision.
4. The foreseeable future; prospect: no solution in sight.
5. Mental perception or consideration: We lost sight of the purpose of our visit.
6. Something seen; a view.
7. Something worth seeing; a spectacle: the sights of London.
8. Informal Something unsightly: Your hair is a sight.
9.
a. A device used to assist aim by guiding the eye, as on a firearm or surveying instrument.
b. An aim or observation taken with such a device.
10. An opportunity to observe or inspect.
11. Upper Southern U.S. A large number or quantity: A sight of people were there.
v. sighted, sighting, sights
v.tr.
1. To perceive with the eyes; get sight of: sighted land after 40 days at sea.
2. To observe through a sight or an optical instrument: sight a target.
3. To adjust the sights of (a rifle, for example).
4. To take aim with (a firearm).
v.intr.
1. To direct one's gaze; look carefully.
2. To take aim: sighted along the barrel of the gun

 

[Crusty]

that must make k+k the greatest thing in the world. why woud you bother with being obnoxious heating water and mashing and boiling when all you had to do was dump water and some goo in a bucket and still get to the same destination at the end, beer. still got you from a to b didnt it? or really just buy a case of vb its still sorta beer in the end, beats ******* around making it, you get straight to your destination without disturbing anyone. i would rather take my time be obnoxious and enjoy the journey cruising in a nice car rather than treat the ride as just a means to an end and taking the train.

Yeah for sure but once we reach our destination (beer) we would like to be able to drink the stuff. My neighbour makes K&K & is quite proud of his efforts but he admits my AG shits all over his beer. He can't be bothered with the extra effort to make AG so settles for the stuff he makes & is happy to do so, poor soul.