Banning Glassware In Pubs

[quantocks]

this is what we need:



unbreakable pint glass from the UK.

 

[alowen474]

I think the problem is that it has a quick easy name and now it is popular. If it had a name like 'attacked with the top of a broken glass by an assailant', then I think the problem would disappear.

 

[TidalPete]

I think the problem is that it has a quick easy name and now it is popular. If it had a name like 'attacked with the top of a broken glass by an assailant', then I think the problem would disappear.

beerforal,
Read my Post 38 more closely.

What we need is zero tolerence combined with maximum sentencing in all aspects of the criminal code.
Too many wishy-washy judges & magistrates in our system who may well be being instructed by those in power that because of lack of funding for more prisons, etc
to cut their sentencing rates (And time of incarcerations) down.
Ever wondered why criminals rarely get the maximum sentence? Not enough funds for more jails combined with the political interference of too many do-gooders\bleeding heart votes that polititions need to stay in power\win elections.

And Bonj,
As for pensioners & the like just rabbiting on & not having to pay for all this I would like to remind you that we have (In our working lives) paid for all\most of your education, health, protection (Where would have this country have been at the start of WW2 without the funding of those who had just retired? Good chance that we would all be on a rice diet by now),police, & all the infrastructure that a democratic country provides to it's citizens.
WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND. A shame that you did not take this into account.

This rant(?) is definitely over. :icon_cheers:
TP :beer:

PS --- Don't claim to know it all. This is just my slant on things.

 

[bonj]

What we need is zero tolerence combined with maximum sentencing in all aspects of the criminal code.

Zero Tolerance: Starving? Have no money? Stole a loaf of bread? Tough luck... it's a lovely trip to New South Wales for you.
These are PEOPLE we're talking about. Some with extenuating circumstances that lead them to commit crimes. Zero Tolerance makes no distinction between stealing a loaf of bread to feed a starving family, and stealing a loaf of bread to vandalise a car with. It is barbaric and completely reprehensible to fail to consider each individual case's circumstances. I'm not saying there are any circumstances where glassing someone in the face is tolerated, but you still have to take each individual's circumstances into account on sentencing. Take my example in my post above: It would be a far worse crime for the state to take a seriously ill baby's mother away. There are other ways to punish people than putting them in prison. Some may argue better ways. I know I would rather someone perform a punishment that actually benefits the community, than one that merely costs the community like imprisonment.

Too many wishy-washy judges & magistrates in our system who may well be being instructed by those in power that because of lack of funding for more prisons, etc
to cut their sentencing rates (And time of incarcerations) down.

Judges and magistrates interpret legislation and make decisions based on the legislation and legal precedents. If you want longer sentences, they are not the people to attack. They are just doing their jobs. Take it up with your local member. It is parliament that creates law. Who are these wishy washy magistrates and judges of whom you speak? And which are the decisions that you're unhappy with? I want names and cases. You must know them to be able to make such comments.

Ever wondered why criminals rarely get the maximum sentence? Not enough funds for more jails combined with the political interference of too many do-gooders\bleeding heart votes that polititions need to stay in power\win elections.

People rarely get the maximum sentence because rarely do people offend so heinously as to attract the maximum sentence. Queensland is regarded as being tougher in sentencing that most other states. Does it reduce the crime rate in comparison?

I love all the "do-gooder" bashing.... aren't they the ones you want in pubs? They're the least likely to be causing all the problems we're talking about.

And Bonj,
As for pensioners & the like just rabbiting on & not having to pay for all this I would like to remind you that we have (In our working lives) paid for all\most of your education, health, protection (Where would have this country have been at the start of WW2 without the funding of those who had just retired? Good chance that we would all be on a rice diet by now),police, & all the infrastructure that a democratic country provides to it's citizens.

Why is it that they become so vocal when they no longer have to pay taxes? Because they no longer have to worry about the repercussions in the next government budget?

WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND. A shame that you did not take this into account.

One may make the same argument back to you. The older generations must take part of the responsibility for steering the ship to its current location...

PS --- Don't claim to know it all. This is just my slant on things.

And everyone is entitled to their opinions. Just as I'm entitled to believe you're wrong.
I guess I'm one of those bleeding hearts you complain so much about.

 

[TidalPete]

Zero Tolerance: Starving? Have no money? Stole a loaf of bread? Tough luck... it's a lovely trip to New South Wales for you.
These are PEOPLE we're talking about. Some with extenuating circumstances that lead them to commit crimes. Zero Tolerance makes no distinction between stealing a loaf of bread to feed a starving family, and stealing a loaf of bread to vandalise a car with. It is barbaric and completely reprehensible to fail to consider each individual case's circumstances. I'm not saying there are any circumstances where glassing someone in the face is tolerated, but you still have to take each individual's circumstances into account on sentencing. Take my example in my post above: It would be a far worse crime for the state to take a seriously ill baby's mother away. There are other ways to punish people than putting them in prison. Some may argue better ways. I know I would rather someone perform a punishment that actually benefits the community, than one that merely costs the community like imprisonment.

Judges and magistrates interpret legislation and make decisions based on the legislation and legal precedents. If you want longer sentences, they are not the people to attack. They are just doing their jobs. Take it up with your local member. It is parliament that creates law. Who are these wishy washy magistrates and judges of whom you speak? And which are the decisions that you're unhappy with? I want names and cases. You must know them to be able to make such comments.

People rarely get the maximum sentence because rarely do people offend so heinously as to attract the maximum sentence. Queensland is regarded as being tougher in sentencing that most other states. Does it reduce the crime rate in comparison?

I love all the "do-gooder" bashing.... aren't they the ones you want in pubs? They're the least likely to be causing all the problems we're talking about.

Why is it that they become so vocal when they no longer have to pay taxes? Because they no longer have to worry about the repercussions in the next government budget?

One may make the same argument back to you. The older generations must take part of the responsibility for steering the ship to its current location...


And everyone is entitled to their opinions. Just as I'm entitled to believe you're wrong.
I guess I'm one of those bleeding hearts you complain so much about.

it's a lovely trip to New South Wales for you.

I hope not Bonj as NSW is the place you could not get out of fast enough

As for pensioners & the like just rabbiting on & not having to pay for all this I would like to remind you that we have (In our working lives) paid for all\most of your education, health, protection (Where would have this country have been at the start of WW2 without the funding of those who had just retired? Good chance that we would all be on a rice diet by now),police, & all the infrastructure that a democratic country provides to it's citizens.
WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND. A shame that you did not take this into account

As for the rest of your sad interpretation YOU ARE, as you say, a bloody bleeding heart

& I feel sorry for you.
Full stop.

TP :beer:

 

[bonj]

I hope not Bonj as NSW is the place you could not get out of fast enough

So you agree that punishment would be too harsh.

As for the rest of your sad interpretation YOU ARE, as you say, a bloody bleeding heart

& I feel sorry for you.

The fact that I actually care about people I have never met, is not an insult to me.

 

[bradsbrew]

Bloody hell I didnt see this topic on Inciders poll.

IMO unreasonable violent acts should be dealt with to the maximum penalty. And any person that has contributed to the growth of this GREAT nation should be respected for their contribution and not be cast aside once they no longer pay taxes. WE TREAT REFUGEES BETTER THAN WE TREAT OUR PENSIONERS. I am not saying that we should not help people to build a new life in our great nation but we should support the people have help build this great nation.
IMO rules, regulations and political correctness is letting our younger generation down- eg. a parent cannot smack (I say smack not flog) their child for cracking a tantrum and disrespecting without fear of legal action, yet when that same child gets to say 14 and attacks a pensioner whilst wagging school the parent is to blame.

 

[peas_and_corn]

Look, they will come up, so I might as well get them out of the way.

"dude, you're just like Hitler"

"There's some total censorship going on here"

"Political correctenss gone mad!!!"

"I saw this story on ACA"

 

[InCider]

This thread has gone too 'Derryn Hinch' and 'John Laws'.

Drink at home and be responsible for yourselves instead of pontificating about other people you self righteous bastards.

Get a sheep and stay home.

Baa,

InCider.

 

[ham2k]

WE TREAT REFUGEES BETTER THAN WE TREAT OUR PENSIONERS.

http://www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/s2191987.htm

hoax.

 

[PostModern]

This thread has gone too 'Derryn Hinch' and 'John Laws'.

Drink at home and be responsible for yourselves instead of pontificating about other people you self righteous bastards.

Get a sheep and stay home.

Baa,

InCider.

It's a political discussion. Debate is what makes democracy and it doesn't start in parliament.

 

[bradsbrew]

http://www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/s2191987.htm

hoax.

So youre saying that its a hoax that some sectors of the community dont get more benefits such as food vouchers and half price cab fairs when the retired widowed pensioner doesnt. Not to mention the hard working person that has retired and has to sell their house to fund a spot in a home because they are ill.
What was this post about again :unsure:

 

[peas_and_corn]

the spaghetti monster.

 

[ham2k]

So youre saying that its a hoax that some sectors of the community dont get more benefits such as food vouchers and half price cab fairs when the retired widowed pensioner doesnt.

it's a hoax until you do more than capitalise a statement to make it true.

Not to mention the hard working person that has retired and has to sell their house to fund a spot in a home because they are ill.

Home ownership is not a right. You build asset wealth for a rainy day.

What was this post about again :unsure:

Too right. This is getting silly.

 

[quantocks]

Bloody hell I didnt see this topic on Inciders poll.

IMO unreasonable violent acts should be dealt with to the maximum penalty. And any person that has contributed to the growth of this GREAT nation should be respected for their contribution and not be cast aside once they no longer pay taxes. WE TREAT REFUGEES BETTER THAN WE TREAT OUR PENSIONERS. I am not saying that we should not help people to build a new life in our great nation but we should support the people have help build this great nation.
IMO rules, regulations and political correctness is letting our younger generation down- eg. a parent cannot smack (I say smack not flog) their child for cracking a tantrum and disrespecting without fear of legal action, yet when that same child gets to say 14 and attacks a pensioner whilst wagging school the parent is to blame.

it all comes down to what I've honestly always believed. We should look after ourselves before we try and look after everyone else.

A drinking glass or bottle was the weapon used in 994 assaults across the state last year

of that 411 were in Wollongong, Newcastle or elsewhere in NSW other than Sydney.

James Arvanitakis, a cultural researcher at the University of Western Sydney, said the glassing statistics supported the theory of a rise in some violence-specific offences linked to time poverty, competitiveness and stress.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/glassi...4472834838.html

 

[drsmurto]

beerforal,
Read my Post 38 more closely.

What we need is zero tolerence combined with maximum sentencing in all aspects of the criminal code.
Too many wishy-washy judges & magistrates in our system who may well be being instructed by those in power that because of lack of funding for more prisons, etc
to cut their sentencing rates (And time of incarcerations) down.
Ever wondered why criminals rarely get the maximum sentence? Not enough funds for more jails combined with the political interference of too many do-gooders\bleeding heart votes that polititions need to stay in power\win elections.

And Bonj,
As for pensioners & the like just rabbiting on & not having to pay for all this I would like to remind you that we have (In our working lives) paid for all\most of your education, health, protection (Where would have this country have been at the start of WW2 without the funding of those who had just retired? Good chance that we would all be on a rice diet by now),police, & all the infrastructure that a democratic country provides to it's citizens.
WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND. A shame that you did not take this into account.

This rant(?) is definitely over. :icon_cheers:
TP :beer:

PS --- Don't claim to know it all. This is just my slant on things.

TP, to say you paid for my education is downright insulting? 7 years after finishing uni i finally paid of my uni debt and to do so had to pay 8% more tax during that time. And i got thru when 4 years cost you the tiny sum of $10K (thats just the HECS, not the running costs). The students that followed me wont be so lucky, this affects our ability to get mortgages, car loans etc. My little brother has a debt 3 times that and will be close to 40 by the time he pays it off.

Paid for my education?

I stacked shelves (at night) and pumped petrol (on weekends) for 4 years in addition to studying.

I dont recall receiving a 'brass razoo' from you TP.

 

[Daniel.lear]

Too right. This is getting silly.

+ 1 all becoming completely out of context


I say Glass Him!!!






VVVTIC of course... :icon_cheers:

 

[TidalPete]

TP, to say you paid for my education is downright insulting? 7 years after finishing uni i finally paid of my uni debt and to do so had to pay 8% more tax during that time. And i got thru when 4 years cost you the tiny sum of $10K (thats just the HECS, not the running costs). The students that followed me wont be so lucky, this affects our ability to get mortgages, car loans etc. My little brother has a debt 3 times that and will be close to 40 by the time he pays it off.

Paid for my education?

I stacked shelves (at night) and pumped petrol (on weekends) for 4 years in addition to studying.

I dont recall receiving a 'brass razoo' from you TP.

The 'brass razoo' that you received from me & all other taxpayers of my generation was spent at the whim of the government in power at the time so don't come the raw prawn with me sunshine. :angry:

I spent 5 years on an apprenticeship wage at starvation levels with none of the benefits that you now get from the government when doing a university course.
I also stacked shelves at Coles to keep my young family going in the early years of my marriage & did all the odd jobs I could find to make things better for them so get over it.


In my day university education was free to all so don't try to put it on to us poor bastards who never voted for the government who introduced university fees in the first place.
I am very proud of my three sons, two of whom got through university (And are now very successful) in spite of the fact that I could not afford to pay for their university education (Just like you they did part time work also) & the other who is completing an advanced course in public relations at his own expense (I suppose he could teach me a few things there? )
They (And countless others) are not crying about paying off their Uni debt.

TP :beer:

 

[Tony]

I'm convinced that the glassing/bar violence thing is very much a socio-economic phenomenon common to feral scum & idiots who's highlight of the weekend would be hurting someone. Normal people don't behave that way, and my experience is that if there isn't a glass, it will be a chair. Or a table or something else. Because when someone is in a state to do something like that, what they do it with is not the concern, it'll be whatever's available to hand. I've even seen someone taken out with a pepper grinder off a table from the restaurant next door... anything can be a weapon.......it's kind of up to the assailant....we can't go removing things simply because it might become a weapon.

100% aggree. Its almost become the "fashionable" crime and the dickheads that will do it will not think about jail time or punishment of any sort if they are full of drugs or piss while rubbing a broken schooner glass in your face.

YEars back when Johny thought spending millions on changing gun laws and taking guns used for sporting purposes from law abiding citizens like me with licences ect (in stead of spending the money on education and prevention) would stop dickheads going nuts and shooting people (martin Bryant moron), i was heavily involved with the SSAA (Sporting Shooters Asociation of Australia) and attended many protests ect.

For all the money spent they got around 4% of all the Semi Auto and pump action weapons imported into the country (legaly that they know of) in the last 20 years.

What a waste. For no gain. I could still go the the pub and buy a Colt 1911 .45 auto for the right price from the right person. But i wouldnt and i didnt and never will...... as well as 99.999% of people, so the laws were pointless for money spent.

My point is.......... massive knee jerk reaction to sensationalist journalism and small minority "goody goody" groups calling for actions that penalise the good people who will never do the crime, but solve none of the problems solve nothing!

There are so many root causes of the problems in society that cause phenonenoms like this.

Drugs like ice ect, excessive alcahol consumption, Social (how did these people doing this grow up???) issues, media blowups that make it as i said before..... fashionable among the dickheads out there that will do this sort of thing. Christ..... there are a million nasty dark aspects of society that you could blame on this. What i see from my perspective and its a very very small %age of people out there do this thank god but the big question is............... is taking glasses away from the 99.999% of drinkers that are enjoying themselves, going to stop the one fool who will?

Would Martin Bryant have still found a gun? A sickening compareson i know but the violance is not far off the mark in my book

I also see a lack of fear from people that may do this.... Its terafying to think it happens so often. This is what keeps me from pubs..... along with the 50c schooners at home

The local pub up from my place renently had a female police officer kicked and injured....... i wont go there now..... people that will kick lady cops in the head will glass you too, without a thought.

scarry :huh:

It's all bloody John Howards and the Liberals fault....

That's why we should never vote the scum sucking leaches back into power

Rook

read above

 

[Insight]

TP, to say you paid for my education is downright insulting? 7 years after finishing uni i finally paid of my uni debt and to do so had to pay 8% more tax during that time. And i got thru when 4 years cost you the tiny sum of $10K (thats just the HECS, not the running costs). The students that followed me wont be so lucky, this affects our ability to get mortgages, car loans etc. My little brother has a debt 3 times that and will be close to 40 by the time he pays it off.

Paid for my education?

I stacked shelves (at night) and pumped petrol (on weekends) for 4 years in addition to studying.

I dont recall receiving a 'brass razoo' from you TP.

This is getting quite OT now, but its worth a quick comment. The university education you (and I many moons ago) received Dr Smurto was heavily subsidised by the Australian taxpayer. Since you only paid $10k for your 4 years at uni, I presume you (like me) were eligible for a commonwealth supported place (CSP). If you take a look at the costs for a full fee paying international student, or a domestic student not eligible for a CSP you will find their bill is 4-5 times yours. eg. Computer Science at Monash this year is $6500 vs $25000. The government is making up the shortfall for CSPs.

You (like me) may also have been eligible for the Ausstudy allowance, and rent assistance. All taxpayer funded. It wasn't a nice time at uni having to do crappy jobs just to make ends meet, but I sure as hell wouldn't be where I am today without it.