Adding Extra Yeast - Gravity Stable But High

[manticle]

I've got two kit/ extract/bit brews on at the minute. Both made at the same time (9 days ago)

One is a chocolate/coffee stout made with a coopers stout base + a tin of Morgan's chocolate malt, some honey, a kilo of dextrose, 200g lactose and a 1 kg packet of house stout mix from cellar plus (liquorice and other things).

Some hops added late in the extract boil, made to 20 L. I used a brew cellar ale yeast, nutrient and threw in some ground coffee and organic dutch cocoa (done this last bit with a stout before and it was mighty tasty).

That's more sugar than I've used before and after a week the hydrometer was still sitting at 1040 (I have a crappy brigalow one so 1040 is it - could have been much higher at the start and I wouldn't have known). Krausen and bubbling/gas occured in the first few days so I knew fermantation began - however after a week I would have expected less gravity. Two days ago I threw in some extra yeast with a bit of nutrient- fermentation seems to have kicked off again, some nice subtle banana smells coming from close by and the high bitterness which I attributed to hops, coffee and cocoa seems to have lessened. Gravity has moved to 1030 so action is happening. All seems good. I'll probably leave it another week or two then bottle.

The other brew is my attempt at a belgian strong dark ale - recipe here: http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=29916 (6 or so posts down). That started off nicely and the flavours are really nice (aromas too) however it seems to have been stuck on 1020 for about 5 days. I've read that some Belgian ales will finish quite high but this seems too high. I'm likely to leave it at least another week in primary anyway (maybe two) but my question is should I add a second ale yeast if it doesn't drop in two or three days? I did add about 300g extra dextrose to help with the abv and to dry it out a little as well as a teaspoon of nutrient to wake up the yeast but any thoughts? Would a second yeast be harmful? Wasteful?
Pointless?

Sorry for the longishness and if any questions about hops, boil time etc are relevant I'm happy to provide more info.

Temp for the Belgian has been fairly consistent (around 20) and the stout between 20 and 24. Neither are in a ferment fridge. I spent a bit of time and money on this one so I'm keen for a tasty drinkable result.

Cheers.

 

[unterberg]

The other brew is my attempt at a belgian strong dark ale - recipe here: http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=29916 (6 or so posts down). That started off nicely and the flavours are really nice (aromas too) however it seems to have been stuck on 1020 for about 5 days. I've read that some Belgian ales will finish quite high but this seems too high. I'm likely to leave it at least another week in primary anyway (maybe two) but my question is should I add a second ale yeast if it doesn't drop in two or three days? I did add about 300g extra dextrose to help with the abv and to dry it out a little as well as a teaspoon of nutrient to wake up the yeast but any thoughts? Would a second yeast be harmful? Wasteful?
Pointless?


Cheers.

Well you made it up to 18l and probably had something like 1090 SG. So from looking at your ingredients I wouldnt really expect it to drop much further then 1020 anyway.
I would probably increase the temperature for a few days to 24C and if you still have the same SG reading its done fermenting. Sometimes increasing the temperature towards the end of fermentation does help the yeast to use up more malt in those high gravity brews.

 

[manticle]

I meant to post this in 'kits and extracts'.

Would a mod mind moving it there and deleting this last post (the one you are reading now - obviously not the original question)

Thankyou.

 

[buttersd70]

I won't even bother calculating on the belgian, I'll just take Unterbergs findings as read....
with the stout, though, if that gets down below 1030 it will be a minor miracle. I make the OG at >1.1...and many of the adjuncts used are either not fermentable (as in the lactose), or have low fermentability (as in the choc). The stout mix I'm not sure....I would presume that it has a goodly whack of moderately fermentable or even non fermentable in there, given that it is for a stout.

If your going to be brewing big beers....get a hydrometer that has at least a remote possibility of taking a reading.

 

[manticle]

Well you made it up to 18l and probably had something like 1090 SG. So from looking at your ingredients I wouldnt really expect it to drop much further then 1020 anyway.
I would probably increase the temperature for a few days to 24C and if you still have the same SG reading its done fermenting. Sometimes increasing the temperature towards the end of fermentation does help the yeast to use up more malt in those high gravity brews.

At the moment it sits in an old concrete laundry tub and thus the temp stays reasonably consistent. To increase temp (my methods are rough as guts at the moment - as I get more experienced I'd like to combine my 'pinch of this and a dash of that' mentality with some actual knowledge but good things in good time) should I just take it out and leave it next to the other which seems to be closer to 24 (considering the thermometers were originally from K-mart)?

Answers seem slightly obvious reading that back but we all have to start somewhere.

And yes I do need a better hydrometer (only found out from this forum that they go beyond 1040 yesterday). Kits are a good start but the amount of information I'm currently finding out from here and other extract/partial sites is astounding, intimidating and inspiring. I'll be all grain brewing in 23 years or so for sure.

Cheers for responses so far.

 

[unterberg]

Dont be so pessimistic. You got to believe in yourself and start aming at 23 month for AG rather than 23 years!

And that new hydrometer of yours will give a much better idea about whats actually going on in that vat of yours. With those strong brews its not really surprising to get those high gravity readings but actually to be expected. I wouldnt worry about it too much as Butters said. Give them both 3 days of warmer temperature cure at 24C and then bottle.

 

[manticle]

Dont be so pessimistic. You got to believe in yourself and start aming at 23 month for AG rather than 23 years!

Joking about the years. It may take me that long to understand the jargon but I used to work as a chef so learning the science of flavours and combining it with the aforementioned pinch of this etc mentality is an unavoidable part of my personality. I like to take things slowly but as each experiment teaches me something new, it's likely I'll be looking at the next step.

I'm now busy studying the chemistry of paper and related artistic materials and techniques (books, etchings etc) in order to conserve them so learning how things work will be part of me till the last brew is sunk.