3rd Party Request for Hop Rhizomes in Bulk (?)

[antiphile]

Good afternoon all.

I know nothing (as Sgt Schultz said), but there was a request recently on the Coopers Forum (link here) for someone who was after rhizomes. I'm not offering to be a intermediary, but thought I'd draw attention to it if anyone is interested in supplying some as requested.

Cheers
Phil

 

[Whiteferret]

Dwarf cluster? never heard of it.

 

[Yob]

Cough...

Sigh.


Look up the ADHA website

 

[hoppy2B]

You have often stated that we don't have dwarf hops in Australia Yob. I wonder if dwarf hops are just tetraploids. :huh: That would mean that we actually do have dwarf hops in Australia because we do have tetraploids here.

 

[Yob]

Not engaging.. Please look up the ADHA website for info. I dint believe any cluster is listed.

It's not the first time I've mentioned this.

It's irresponsible for you to pass off these as a dwarf variety.

 

[Whiteferret]

Damnit, no ninja smilies on mobile

 

[hoppy2B]

It is only a name Yob. When I put it under the microscope and verify that it is a tetraploid, I'll be sure to let you know. It has morphological differences when compared to Australian Cluster. It is not a stunted Australian Cluster and it is somewhat irresponsible to suggest it is if that is what you are inferring.

The point I am trying to make is that it probably has a dwarf habit due to it being tetraploid. I'm also wondering if dwarf hops are tetraploids. It would be quite easy to breed tetraploids and create new dwarf varieties.

 

[Yob]

I put it to ypu that YAFOS

by all means, prove it to me, until that point I reserve the right to remain super sceptical.

 

[hoppy2B]

These photos show the leaves of the variety that I call Dwarf Cluster. This variety typically has leaves with lots of lobes. I thought it might have been an american wild hop influence that caused the many lobe habit.

 

[hoppy2B]

This photo is of a leaf from an 'Australian' Cluster. I have never seen a leaf with more than three lobes on this variety, and I obtained rhizome from more than one source for this variety.

 

[Yob]

Hardly quantifiable evidence though is it?

 

[hoppy2B]

Nah you're right, the only way to prove it is a tetraploid is to put it under the microscope. The theory I have is that the doubling of chromosomes has caused an increase in the number of leaf lobes. There is data suggesting that tetraploids can have a reduction in internode length.

 

[Mr B]

In the spirit of Breaking Bad

"We need some Science *******"

or

"We need some Science, *******"

I'm good either way, as I like hops, science, and the other one (I cant say it again....).

 

[Yob]

I'd just be happy to stop the effing assumptions and spreading effing rumour of unsubstantiated waffle

 

[panspermian]

Tetraploid just means 4 sets of chromosomes. I doubt there would be any noticeable trait to distinguish it.
Many plants are tetraploid.

Humans are diploid.

 

[Yob]

Nah you're right, the only way to prove it is a tetraploid is to put it under the microscope. The theory I have is that the doubling of chromosomes has caused an increase in the number of leaf lobes. There is data suggesting that tetraploids can have a reduction in internode length.

Please provide links to this data. I could do my own search, but I want to read the same info that you have clearly well researched and see if the line can be drawn.

 

[Stu Brew]

This was me btw....got 6kgs of Rhizomes today....Dwarf Cluster is a breed done by an SA grower....maybe...not sure who exactly it is. Anyways....the coops forum post basically says what Im after. Still probably need another 3-4kgs of something that crops heavy in SA we have a spring on the property so water is no problem at all!!

Cheers anyways I think Ill hang around here Coopers forum isnt what im into now in terms of brewing....or hops growing!!

 

[Stu Brew]

Cough...

Sigh.


Look up the ADHA website

Australian Day Hospital Association Ltd?

The bloke who sold it to me HoppyB2 hasnt put it under a microscope but I will.....give me a couple of months though. Only got the rhizomes today...plus I was looking for a 'dwarf variety'...which is near on impossible to find in Australia since its a big US thing....I dunno I cant find much into on hops in SA before 1938...but I have a good book about the industry before bittering hops took over everything. Im a horticulturalist so everything is going to be documented from growth habits to flavours and aromas....and I was planning on getting some samples sent to Tassy to get them ID'd by the uni down there and put on the list...or at least they'll be able to tell me exactly what parents they come from! If I was a major noob do you think Id even be trying this kind of thing??? I grow plants for a living now....jsut dont have any space....

 

[Yob]

Ha.. Yeah that's the one

http://www.adha.us/varietals/azacca-adha-483

For example..

 

[hoppy2B]

https://www.scienceopen.com/document/vid/5f4a5e85-f4a8-4ffe-b71a-ed87d24cb213;jsessionid=NzJej0HeYUEO9bn-1

I'm not sure if the above link will work - hopefully it does. I'll check it as soon as I post and if it doesn't work I'll delete.

I have it bookmarked and I normally click on the images and it goes to the main article. The article has a bit of a description on how to put hops under a microscope to test for polyploidy. It should be of interest to you if you are serious about breeding hops Yob.

Most of the traits described for tetraploid hops are applicable to the hops I call Dwarf Cluster. The Dwarf Cluster has thin bines, short internode length, notable aroma characteristics, fat cones etc. In the article there is a different leaf type from the one I described earlier in this thread but I don't expect results to be exactly the same for each sample one puts through the process of ploidy manipulation.

As stated earlier, the only way to be sure a hop plant is tetraploid is to subject it to the appropriate testing. I'll do that when I get enough time. I need to take my microscope apart and clean it and get some slides. Not sure when that will be. :blush: