Yeast Farming For Dummies

[Nodrog]

I've read the yeast farming guide which has been airlocked, and think i've got the general idea. Just want to make sure I'm on the right track before I try the below.

My next brew will be only 10litres, and I have a sachet of S04 which cost far too much to justify keeping on buying one for 10litre brews. So what I aim to do is:

1. Make up 100mls of sterilised wort by dissolving DME in preboiled water.
2. Put 5mls into each of these little sample tubes, see attached, that I've also sterilised. I'll do 10 or 20 i think
3. Make sure it is 18 Deg C
4. Then i'll drop a few granules of the dried yeast into each tube, sterilsed tweezers I think.
5. Block end with cotton wool, or maybe gladwrap and an elastic band?
6. Let it do its funky stuff for a day or so, at room temp, until I get some foam forming.
7. take out cotton wool and seal tops of jars
8. Refrigerate.

Then when I need some S04 i plan to:

1. Plan ahead a few days !!!
2. Take a sample out of the fridge and let it warm up slowly.
3. Pitch it into 50mls of sterised wort (10:1 ratio)
4. Let it work its majic, wait until i get some foaming going on.
5. Pitch the 50mls into 500mls (10:1 again)
6. Then I'll have what I think is a 500ml starter bottle that can be pitched into my next brew, and access to a whole heap more.

I know S04 isn't so expensive and most may not bother, but i'm a tight arse, and its good practise for later.

So some Questions:

1. Will this work? (if i do it right !)
2. When I make up the 5ml sample tubes do I have to use DME to make Wort, or can i just use sugar here? Will be heaps easier if i can, and will be much diluted before it gets in a brew.
3. How big a starter bottle is required for a 10 or 20 litre ale brew?
4. This seems much easier than 'harvesting' the yeast from the bottom of the FV, and in case there is a limit of using only 3-5 generations this skips the 1st generation. What's the disadvantage of doing it this way?

Have I forgotten anything?

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Make a 1ltr starter with all your yeast, then when it is foaming, split it into smaller lots...

5ml starters wont work without stepping them up a few times

 

[Screwtop]

I've read the yeast farming guide which has been airlocked, and think i've got the general idea. Just want to make sure I'm on the right track before I try the below.

My next brew will be only 10litres, and I have a sachet of S04 which cost far too much to justify keeping on buying one for 10litre brews. So what I aim to do is:

1. Make up 100mls of sterilised wort by dissolving DME in preboiled water.
2. Put 5mls into each of these little sample tubes, see attached, that I've also sterilised. I'll do 10 or 20 i think
3. Make sure it is 18 Deg C
4. Then i'll drop a few granules of the dried yeast into each tube, sterilsed tweezers I think.
5. Block end with cotton wool, or maybe gladwrap and an elastic band?
6. Let it do its funky stuff for a day or so, at room temp, until I get some foam forming.
7. take out cotton wool and seal tops of jars
8. Refrigerate.

Then when I need some S04 i plan to:

1. Plan ahead a few days !!!
2. Take a sample out of the fridge and let it warm up slowly.
3. Pitch it into 50mls of sterised wort (10:1 ratio)
4. Let it work its majic, wait until i get some foaming going on.
5. Pitch the 50mls into 500mls (10:1 again)
6. Then I'll have what I think is a 500ml starter bottle that can be pitched into my next brew, and access to a whole heap more.

I know S04 isn't so expensive and most may not bother, but i'm a tight arse, and its good practise for later.

So some Questions:

1. Will this work? (if i do it right !)
2. When I make up the 5ml sample tubes do I have to use DME to make Wort, or can i just use sugar here? Will be heaps easier if i can, and will be much diluted before it gets in a brew.
3. How big a starter bottle is required for a 10 or 20 litre ale brew?
4. This seems much easier than 'harvesting' the yeast from the bottom of the FV, and in case there is a limit of using only 3-5 generations this skips the 1st generation. What's the disadvantage of doing it this way?

Have I forgotten anything?

Most tightarses have a devalued view of their time and are prepared to put in lots of it to save some money, so yep.......you're a tightarse :lol:

Honestly, if you are going to go to the effort, buy a good yeast. Also there is plenty on info re dried yeast and why it's not such a great idea to reculture it or reuse it (higher levels of wild yeast and bacteria, which is why manufacturers put such a high cell count in their packs, note: not kit packs, they are repackaged), so maybe do a search and learn as much as you can about yeast, before going any further.

Screwy

 

[michaelcocks]

I've read the yeast farming guide which has been airlocked, and think i've got the general idea. Just want to make sure I'm on the right track before I try the below.

My next brew will be only 10litres, and I have a sachet of S04 which cost far too much to justify keeping on buying one for 10litre brews. So what I aim to do is:

1. Make up 100mls of sterilised wort by dissolving DME in preboiled water.
2. Put 5mls into each of these little sample tubes, see attached, that I've also sterilised. I'll do 10 or 20 i think
3. Make sure it is 18 Deg C
   
4. Then i'll drop a few granules of the dried yeast into each tube, sterilsed tweezers I think.
5. Block end with cotton wool, or maybe gladwrap and an elastic band?
6. Let it do its funky stuff for a day or so, at room temp, until I get some foam forming.
7. take out cotton wool and seal tops of jars
8. Refrigerate.

or just use half the packet.if you are only doing a 1040 type beer half pckt is fine.
Hydrate the 7gm yeast and pitch. The wrap packet with remaining f yeast incling wrap and put back into the fridge.
Then when you ten litre batch is finished pitch on top
you are putting yourself thru alot of work for no real gain.
IMHO


Then when I need some S04 i plan to:

1. Plan ahead a few days !!!
2. Take a sample out of the fridge and let it warm up slowly.
3. Pitch it into 50mls of sterised wort (10:1 ratio)
4. Let it work its majic, wait until i get some foaming going on.
5. Pitch the 50mls into 500mls (10:1 again)
6. Then I'll have what I think is a 500ml starter bottle that can be pitched into my next brew, and access to a whole heap more.

I know S04 isn't so expensive and most may not bother, but i'm a tight arse, and its good practise for later.

So some Questions:

1. Will this work? (if i do it right !)
2. When I make up the 5ml sample tubes do I have to use DME to make Wort, or can i just use sugar here? Will be heaps easier if i can, and will be much diluted before it gets in a brew.
3. How big a starter bottle is required for a 10 or 20 litre ale brew?
4. This seems much easier than 'harvesting' the yeast from the bottom of the FV, and in case there is a limit of using only 3-5 generations this skips the 1st generation. What's the disadvantage of doing it this way?

Have I forgotten anything?

 

[boobiedazzler]

Do you actually like S04 as a yeast or is this all youve got handy? Its a lot of effort to keep such a questionable strain going through the ages. I agree with other posters, if you are going to all this trouble, then make a one-off investment of $15 and get a decent liquid English Ale yeast if that's your thing - assuming this because of your S04. And if you're keen to expand your bank into other styles but are a bit of a spendthrift, hit the commercial bottles to harvest their dregs.

 

[petesbrew]

Make a 1ltr starter with all your yeast, then when it is foaming, split it into smaller lots...

5ml starters wont work without stepping them up a few times

+1.
I mean sterilised tweezers?

Do you actually like S04 as a yeast or is this all youve got handy? Its a lot of effort to keep such a questionable strain going through the ages. I agree with other posters, if you are going to all this trouble, then make a one-off investment of $15 and get a decent liquid English Ale yeast if that's your thing - assuming this because of your S04. And if you're keen to expand your bank into other styles but are a bit of a spendthrift, hit the commercial bottles to harvest their dregs.

+1.
Nothing wrong with being a tightarse, but the liquid yeasts really add another dimension to your beer.
By all means, have a go with kit or dried yeast first, for cheap practice.

 

[hazard]

Also there is plenty on info re dried yeast and why it's not such a great idea to reculture it or reuse it (higher levels of wild yeast and bacteria, which is why manufacturers put such a high cell count in their packs,
Screwy

I made an amber ale with SAFALE US-05 because I didn't have any WY1056 to hand. I harvested about 300ml slurry from secondary fermenter and intend to use it for my next amber or american ale. As far as i can see, its a liquid yeast now - innit? Would you recommend against using this?

I also have to ask - when people say that liquid is better than dry do they actually mean that there is a bigger range of liquid? Or does anyone actually suggest that WY1056 is superior to US-05?

 

[Pennywise]

I brew alot with wyeast 1056 and always have a few packs of US-05 in the fridge for emergencies. No difference at all between em'. I still reckon it's the same strain (although I have no proof of this, apart from my taste buds). Not sure if there's a liquid version of S-04. I think people just say liquid is better because there is a much much larger and more specific range.

 

[boobiedazzler]

Remember that the OP is using S-04, not S-05. Personally I like the results from S-05, and plan to to a side by side comparison between that and the White Labs Cali. Ale in the near future.

S-04 though, personally I dont think its much chop.

 

[petesbrew]

Remember that the OP is using S-04, not S-05. Personally I like the results from S-05, and plan to to a side by side comparison between that and the White Labs Cali. Ale in the near future.

S-04 though, personally I dont think its much chop.

Try the Danstar Windsor. (craftbrewer sell it).
Not a real expert on yeast characteristics, but both beers I tried it in were sensational - A KnK Stout and an AG London Ale.

 

[Nodrog]

Really only using S04 as this is what the LHBS has sold me for my first exploration away from kits, in NZ doesn't seem that easy to track down less common strains, but I'm only a beginner at this.

way I see it is that I would be practising a technique I would probably need later if I do get into 'special' yeasts, and because of the cost benefits the pratise would cost me nothing and might even save a bit. Make sense?

 

[Wolfy]

Yes the procedure would work, and yes it's really that easy, however other than to practice yeast management techniques, it's going to be pointless and not really that beneficial for yourself or the yeast.
Dried yeast is essentially 'force fed' to be in top condition for the stress of being dried, and so that when re-hydrated it's ready to go.

Rather than bothering to split it up into small tubes as you have suggested, you'd be better simply leaving it dry in the pack until a few days before you are ready to brew.
Then - if you want to be a real tight ass - prepare some wort and your vials/bottles, drop a few grains of the dry yeast into the 5ml vial, and after a day or few step it up into a 50ml sample, then step that up to 400ml and again to 1 or 2L and pitch that into your beer.
That way you keep your dry-yeast - in optimal condition - in the packet until you are ready to use it and don't rehydrate the yeast until you are going to use it ... but you can use the same packet many many times over.

If you were using a liquid yeast - which you can't easily store the packet once it's been open - then splitting it into a number of small vials would be a very good idea - that many people do, either into small vials like you outlined or even better onto slants.

I'd suggest you use the dried yeast to practice your starter-techniques and stepping up from a small amount of yeast and making a starter large enough to pitch.
The other thing you could practice is re-using and washing the yeast trub from your fermenter, but that involves recycling the yeast after you have fermented with it the first time.
But I'd save the yeast-farming-into-vials for when you have a better reason for it, like when you're using a liquid yeast.

 

[Nick JD]

Every time you "step up" a starter to increase your population of yeast ... do you create another generation?

Yeast multiply by "budding" AFAIK, so will multiple step ups will mean great-great grandaughters - or the equivalent of reusing a pitch-able amount of yeast 6+ times and you haven't even thrown it in the fermenter yet?

Wouldn't it be easier to throw the whole pack in and then harvest some trub, and use this for your next brew, and so on (generationally speaking)?

 

[michaelcocks]

Really only using S04 as this is what the LHBS has sold me for my first exploration away from kits, in NZ doesn't seem that easy to track down less common strains, but I'm only a beginner at this.

way I see it is that I would be practising a technique I would probably need later if I do get into 'special' yeasts, and because of the cost benefits the pratise would cost me nothing and might even save a bit. Make sense?

Sorry my previous reply got buried in your original text - Damn mobile computing:
Her it is again;

or just use half the packet.if you are only doing a 1040 type beer half pckt is fine.
Hydrate the 7gm yeast and pitch. Then wrap packet with remaining yeast in cling wrap and put back into the fridge.
Then when your ten litre batch is finished, pitch on top
you are putting yourself thru a lot of work for no real gain.
IMHO

 

[jzani]

http://www.homebrewer.co.nz/wyeast1005.doc

These guys get in a group order of Wyeast every couple of months to NZ and send them out to you. I reckon you probably wouldn't even need too many ice packs with the current weather! Would be a good way to get hold of a decent liquid strain. Haven't tries them myself yet, but on the verge as I hear the dark side calling...

How long can you keep these viable for? Not sure if I am doing enough brews at the minute to justify this faff, but would like to give it a go so that I can justify expensive yeast to SWMBO.

 

[Nodrog]

thanks all, Wolfy and Juzzy in particular. Had just found that NZ source juzzy, will see how the $$'s look come July.

wolfy- now i see why it would be alot of trouble for little gain, and perhaps a loss in quality. I think Ill try making starters for a while, and get a few brews out of the one sachet just to see if I can!

Don't really buy into this genrational thing, but stand to be corrected. I would have thought more 'faults' are likely from infection and breeding from the trub. Wouldn't the trub contain the ones which were most genetically likely to survive in a festering pile of waste rather than the true best breeders/alcohol makers/taste producers / whatever ???

I am but a newbie at this, so am probably completely off on the wrong track, just like in the OP !

 

[ianh]

Instead of making up special yeast starters for your brews why not just use the brews you have bottled. Just drink a couple of bottles of your homebrew and dont pour out the last say 100ml.

Combine the 2 lots and make a starter with 1litre of 1.040 SG wort a 2 days before you plan to brew.