Why Rehydrate And Pitch Dry Yeast Warm?

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ohitsbrad

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Palmer suggests rehydrating dry yeast in a cup of water at 35 to 40 degrees, and pitching after half an hour. Lets say the yeast solution cools further to around 30 degrees in that half hour. Is there no issue with shocking or stunning the yeast when you pitch it to a cooler wort, say 20 degrees, like there is if you had've made and pitched a liquid yeast starter at warmer temperatures than the wort?
 
Lots of info out there on this. Maybe start here first.

Then try "rehydrating dry yeast site:aussiehomebrewer.com" into the google search bar, that should give you enough reading material to keep you occupied :p

And at the end of it, you'll find it's a bit of a personal thing. So personally I almost always rehydrate dry yeast and I always make the starter at Ale brewing temps (20ish degs). Though all I'm looking for is to be sure the yeast pack is good and I haven't been sold another 'baked' pack by the LHBS.
From listening to the White Brothers on the BN they build yeast at 30ish degs as you get more growth. Whether that results in the best tating beer is another question.
 
Because I like living on the edge, I tried something like this for my most recent, currently fermenting, batch. Previously when using dried yeast, I would just sprinkle and forget.

I followed Fermentis' instructions for rehydrating their US-05 yeast on the basis that I would probably get more viable yeast due to rehydration in water being easier than in wort. I did it at temperatures that Fermentis (not Palmer) recommends and let it cool towards the temperature of the wort I was pitching into. I threw the yeast into the water at 27degC and am fermenting at 18.

Subjectively, I think this is the most vigorous US-05 fermentation I have had. If that is a sign of health, then it could be good.
 
I am an advocate of the starter.

Whether you use dried or liquid yeast, starters are the way to go. Feed it a few days before brewday and pitch a nice, thriving colony into your wort

Use a small proportion of the yeast from the packet and get it going.

WJ (yeast farmer)
 
I have always wondered why DCL print "Pitch Directly into Wort" on the packets.

Just as a matter in interest the number 1 selling beer product in my shop over the last year is SAF American Ale Yeast (in one of its several guises US-56/US-05 or Brewcellar AA), in fact the top 3 sellers were all yeasts, so the message is getting out to the public that good yeast helps make good beer.

mika_lika
it is also kept refrigerated so you can be fairly sure its fresh.

MHB
 
Not suggesting your practices are as poor as the dude I'm referring to over here, but he kept his refrigerated as well. Don't know what happened to it on it's way across the paddock/ocean/whatever though ;)

Rather than have the stress of wondering whether the brew is going to fire, rehydrating is a simple test.
 
Dehydrated yeast can not protect the cell wall while rehydrating.

If you pitch directly into the wort, some things can cross the cell wall that will kill off some of the yeast cells, and hence you will get a lower cell count (ie less healthy yeast).

In regards to temperature, you are just trying to wake the yeast up in a more ideal environment, although 30-40C does sound fairly high, I usually do it at about 25C.
 
Howdy ohitsbrad,

I don't post here much anymore but have just got back from a very nice pub so am well-lubricated :blink: Your question has piqued my interest so I'm going to try and ramble my way to a good answer for you and the answer will not be what you would expect but I'm pretty certain that it will be the answer you are looking for so bear with me...

Being a brewer that likes to test and try everything and has done nearly all that everyone above has mentioned, I reckon...

Firstly, there is a lot of technical information about how you should pitch your yeast.
Secondly, the science that people offer behind their theories may make sense but...
Thirdly, I have never seen and therefore suspect that taste tests of beers with yeast pitched in different ways for home brewers are virtually non-existent.

A lot of info on AHB and in the home-brewing world is based on copying commercial practices. And I could go on for a lot longer here but the home brewer actually has a hell of a lot more power and versatility in their brewing than any commercial brewer. Many don't realise this.

In fact, I'd be ashamed if anyone doing their first all-grain, under supervision, could not exceed the quality of most commercially produced beers.

We home brewers like to laugh at the commercial or even micro-breweries but they have constraints that we home brewers will never have to deal with, tax for one!

(I'm getting closer to your answer ohitsbrad!)

I think you are a beginner of AG (I haven't read your prior posts) so....

Whilst there are several ways to slightly speed up the fermentation process using dried yeast, these processes are very time-consuming and will not make the slightest difference to your finished beer. If they do and you can notice it then you need to post here your results because you will have become the messiah of dry yeast pitching!

I have been through all the re-hydration and wort-activating of my dried yeasts.

It makes NO DIFFERENCE to the end result. Just sprinkle the bugger on top of your wort and Bob's your uncle.

If you are new to AG, try and keep things simple as possible. Don't get hung up on small technicalities. Find a brewer who brews a beer you like and ask them for their recipe.

Aside from correct basic brewing practices, a good recipe is the real key

The way you pitch your yeast will make bugger-all difference. Just make sure you pitch the sachet at 25 degrees or less and have your wort rapidly cooling to 17 or 18 degrees.

Ah! There's an answer at last! Hopefully it answers your original question sort of :blink:

All the best,
Pat

P.S. I originally meant above to write how to get one sachet of yeast to last you six brews using a very easy and simple method but I have now run out of steam! Sorry about that!

Edit: A bit of morning editing here but nowhere near enough - lol
 
Effective pitching my way

Rehydrate with 75-110ml sterile luke warm in a sterile container wrapped in glad wrap for 25 min.
If it rises shes ready to go. Pitch
Leave it alone at optimum temp.

If not add 250ml wort after 30 minutes into a larger container and shake about for 15-20 minutes.
Pitch.
Aerate wort.
Matti
 
Palmer suggests rehydrating dry yeast in a cup of water at 35 to 40 degrees, and pitching after half an hour. Lets say the yeast solution cools further to around 30 degrees in that half hour. Is there no issue with shocking or stunning the yeast when you pitch it to a cooler wort, say 20 degrees, like there is if you had've made and pitched a liquid yeast starter at warmer temperatures than the wort?
To actually answer your question pitching a dehydrated dried yeast at approx 30C into a approx 20C wort should be fine.

As far as whether you should rehydrate or not. The science has been done. Do a search on Google and you can find any number of papers where it has been tested. Read them and decide if you think it is worth it in your situation. If you get the real science form professionals you will have something worthwhile to base your decisions on.
 
Here is my problem

Of the thousands of yeasts my customers use every year, the only ones who have any problems are those who rehydrated/build starters.

I think it's mostly because they dont follow good procedure - using a thermometer for 1.
Those that pitch directly simply have no problem.

Agreed if you have a suspect yeast supply, or have boiled the whole wort; reducing the dissolved oxygen; and are very careful to work as clean as possible, there are advantages to starting a yeast.

But for 99% of the people out there the negatives outweigh the benefits. Especially for quality yeast

The advice I give my customers is:-
Choose appropriate yeast
Pitch at the right temperature
Pitch the right amount
Make sure the wort is well aerated

Of course there are exceptions and times when it's appropriate to build a starter - but first and foremost - do it properly.

MHB
 
For dried yeats, like Mark, I advise my customers to pitch dry.

I've tried all different ways, but for the record this is how I now do mine, which is on average twice a week, so plenty of practical experience/results.
I always pitch at my fermenting temp or just below & let it rise to fermenting temp. The yeast is added straight out of the fridge, so it's warmed by the wort, rather than being chilled from room temp. I just simply sprinkle on top of the wort, put on the lid & leave it. Even with my full boiled worts I never aerate & I don't appear to have any attenuation problems. For high alcohol beers or lagers I pitch a double sachet (total 25gms).

If your hygiene is up to scratch, then rehydrating will definately give you a more viable yeast, but I have really found it unecessary.

Cheers Ross
 
My last few brews I have just done the simple sprinkle on top. It worked and fermented to acceptable levels, but more importantly made great beer.

However for the last brew (still fermenting); I went back to rehydrating in 250ml of warm water and a dissolved teaspoon of sugar. The yeast proved to be active and as a result the lag time was greatly reduced. The fermentation is pretty strong, but I believe that the fermentables have more of relevance in this area over the yeast... even if they are relying on each other.

The only real disadvantages of not rehydrating are longer lag time between pitching and an active ferment. Another is a reduced cell count before pitching.

If your sanitation is up to scratch, there really isn't any major difference worth worrying about in home brewing.
 
Just as a point I'd like to add.

Had a couple of packets of US-56 that had been in the fridge since year dot. "Best Before" date is listed as January 08. So lets say less than two months left.

Pitch them "dry" into 45 litres of wort and have active fermentation 12 hours later (call it an uncalculated risk). I know the correct (and probably sanest) way is to rehydrate as per the instructions.

Awfully long story short. I buy dried yeast purely on the context of its a no stuffing around medium. So the idea of boiling and cooling water to the exact temps, adding the yeast and stirring to a cream or whatever starts to become just as much rooting around as making a liquid yeast starter.

I'd rather go back to liquid if I had to go through all that.

Chuck it in dry. Treat it mean and keep it keen.

Lazy as charged. B)

Warren -
 
In a nutshell I agree that the only result we generally see (or hear) is lag time. I just do what seems healthier. Would you prefer to be pitching approx 1 tablespoon of inactive yeast into your primary or 1/2 cup of built up active starter + wort?

The main reason i pitch a starter is to ensure i dont pitch a dead batch and the yeast dont get lazy. My only recommendation is to get a good thermometer, get CLEAN and you wont have any issues.

Cheers
 
On the back of the big Saf packets, they detail a rather elaborate rehydration method and then conclude with, "Or, just sprinkle on top". As mentioned by the retailers, get the basics right (temp, rate, aeration) and you'll find 'or sprinkle on top' works just fine.
 
Well before all 5222 registered members add their opinions, here's my experience.

Have changed my mind on the use of dried yeast. Used to pitch dry, used to pitch warm, it all made good beer. Have had little trouble with dried yeast, the exception being that US-56 changed about 18 months ago. Now it has a slimy krausen which lasts to the end of fermentation and sticks to the fermenter wall as the beer is drained, and it's less flocculant than it used to be, but still a great yeast used in the right style.

My experience in the past with yeast was that if you keep it around 32C it will breed fast, and work fast. My early working life was as a baker, for some time I worked in a country bakery with a wood fired oven. The master baker would make the dough and it would be ripe (yep you read correctly, there was a test for ripeness) and ready for secondary fermentation around 10 hours later. Long slow cool primary fermentation makes the best bread Boy! Over the years primary fermentation times reduced with the use of bread improvers (yeast nutrient) to 8 hours, 3 hours, then came instant doughs, using horsepower from machinery for conversion in place of the kinetic energy produced during primary fermentation. We used compressed yeast (not liquid yeast but not dried, it was slightly dehydrated to a firm paste like yeast) then eventually came dried yeast in the early 70's. Dried was more potent, higher cell count and worked best if rehydrated but could be used as was. Well that's how bread is made today, fast. We all eat it, in my opinion the 10 hour doughs made superior bread, bread judges would recognise the difference, but not that many people would want to pay more for such a difference. My point - slow controlled fermentation made better bread.

Have been playing around with all sorts of wort compositions, mash temps, fermentation temps, pitching temps etc for 12 months roughly using dried and liquid yeasts. When I use rehydrated dried yeast as per the manufacturers rehydration instructions (when I stir after 15 min I give a whisk to aerate then rest again) pitch about 2 below fermentation temp and attemporate the rehydrated yeast before pitching, I find that lag time is reduced, the fermentation is much more controlled. When I say that, I mean it's not all rip-tear-bust and done in 3 days. Have two beers (using dried yeast) fermenting now, one in primary (K97) is 1.050/1.010 and still going after 10 days in primary AA of 80.21%, the other in secondary (US-05) is 1.056/1.015 after 9 days (7 days primary 1.056/1.017) AA of 71.6% and still going. For my 2c worth, the beers fermented in this fashion are brighter (meaning less dull to the palate). Achieveable attenuation must take into account the fermentability of the wort, in the case of the beer fermented using US-05 the malt bill included 10% Crystal/Carapils and so would reduce the ability of the yeast to achive the higher end of its normal attenuative capability.

So to agree with many of the comments above, do it either way, pitch dried or rehydrate. A quick Google search should locate scientific support for not pitching dried into a starter, apparently one should rehydrate first. Haven't tested this out yet. In any case you'll make good beer, but will it be the best it can be? maybe you won't notice. Bit like wasting an expensive stereo on my 1$ ear :D

For some yeasts such as Nottingham there would be little to gain in rehydrating or making a starter, I think only two organisms would survive an atomic catastrophe, Nottingham Yeast and Cockroaches :p

Newcomers should just pitch dried, relax and have a home brew.

For the present I'm sticking with rehydration and the other processes, it makes enough of a difference to my beers for me to go the extra yard. Another procedure I've returned to is racking to secondary, this gives the yeast a litte revitalisation and helps with better attenuation. Also have found that dropping the beer (racking/aerating to a second vessel) after 24 hours active fermentation helps improve attenuation with some yeasts (only tested one liquid yeast on two occasions and one dried on one occasion so far).


Screwy
 
Not even points for trying on that one Bugman <_<
 

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