Who invented BIAB?

[citizensnips]

considering the teabag was invented over 100 years ago my guess would say there's every chance someone out there was doing a shittier less refined version of biab a michael long time ago

 

[S.E]

Actually Mark thinking about it your title is better, then if any other nationality refines BIAB further the thread can be up dated accordingly.

 

[S.E]

considering the teabag was invented over 100 years ago my guess would say there's every chance someone out there was doing a shittier less refined version of biab a michael long time ago

Disposable BIAB bag, now there’s a thought.

 

[Lecterfan]

...to put it into further context though, these threads and those early AHB innovators weren't just saying 'hey let's plonk some grain in some bags', they were interested in the outcomes of a very high water to grain ration (by comparison to the established norm/literature/'trad' German brewing methods), the effects on pH, extraction of tannins, the availability and ability of certain enzymes in this type of mash, the long term stability of flavour compounds, head retention etc of the excessively murky wort and so on.

As someone who lurked on AHB but was more active as a kit and partial brewer elsewhere, AHB was always the bastion of (seemingly) knowledgeable all grain brewers who were talking all kinds of craziness about 'salts' and 'pH' and sprinkling German words throughout their posts.

Not saying that this wasn't discussed elsewhere (although it's not in the Dave Line book - a ripper that I've read many times), and given the number of 'grandmas curtain' and 'pillowcase' jokes it is important to remember that 3V or 2V were enormously popular methods - probably overwhelmingly so in terms of the available literature...brew magazines coming from America, brewing traditions from Europe etc etc etc.

BIAB is not an Aussie 'invention' by any stretch, but in terms of direct comparisons to more traditional grain brewing methods in areas that could be considered reasonably 'advanced' by many, the people involved in those threads and this site (and probably heaps of them behind the scenes in the 'real' world) seems to be where a lot of the work was done to dispel myths beyond mere anecdotal 'well it tastes alright to me'.

Again, this was probably all talked about in brew clubs and by brew nerds the world over, but it was all played out in public here by very enthusiastic, engaged and knowledgeable brewers.

My 2c.

 

[AndrewQLD]

Wish I could have spent my 2c as eloquently Lecterfan, that sums it up beautifully.

 

[mje1980]

But how do you know the uk brewers weren't thinking or doing the same thing all those years ago? Do you have evidence of that or just assuming?. If it has been done for so long there, I can't imagine they'd just be throwing a random amount of grain into a random amount of water and hoping for the best surely?. What makes you think someone only a few years ago was the first to think out calculations regarding bitterness efficiency etc?. I'm honestly curious

 

[Lecterfan]

Not saying that this wasn't discussed elsewhere
BIAB is not an Aussie 'invention' by any stretch, but in terms of direct comparisons to more traditional grain brewing methods in areas that could be considered reasonably 'advanced' by many, the people involved in those threads and this site (and probably heaps of them behind the scenes in the 'real' world) seems to be where a lot of the work was done to dispel myths beyond mere anecdotal 'well it tastes alright to me'.

Again, this was probably all talked about in brew clubs and by brew nerds the world over, .

Not saying it wasn't - just that the reason a lot of American sites seem to credit it as an Aussie thing is that it seemed to play out in public here. See the last sentence of my above quote. In fact it is a safe bet that a cloth-cap wearing, tweed jacketed, leather elbow patched, pipe smoking, extravagantly moustachioed fan of real ale in the UK actually DID do it all 40 years ago...just no one put it on the internet and told the Americans about it haha

edit - in terms of evidence I have none as it is merely conjecture in reply to why it seems to be labelled an Aussie phenomenon. Cheers. :icon_cheers:

 

[citizensnips]

With that said, I don't understand why we would turn down the honour of inventing something when all the methods and information given out and practised all over the world today were originally nutted out here, why give someone else the credit when they hid in their back shed with for all we know a hessian sack dunked in water and told no one about it. Doesn't make sense to me.

 

[mje1980]

Lecterfan, I agree, and is kind of what I was thinking. I don't want to take any credit from pistol as he has put a lot of time and effort into sharing his info and work.

 

[mje1980]

With that said, I don't understand why we would turn down the honour of inventing something when all the methods and information given out and practised all over the world today were originally nutted out here, why give someone else the credit when they hid in their back shed with for all we know a hessian sack dunked in water and told no one about it. Doesn't make sense to me.

This post doesn't make sense to me. Turn down the honour of claiming something we didn't invent?!

 

[citizensnips]

I'm saying people like Pistol should be recognised as the creators of the modern day BIAB method. You can tell who ever you want some guy may have done a similar method in his shed some time ago so give him the praise but at the end of the day they sure as hell didn't put in the effort creating, testing, developing and most importantly sharing the information like people such as Pistol did.

 

[Fatgodzilla]

Who invented the wheel? Religion? Boats? The mash tun? Queensland?

makes no difference.

Just right to say Pistol is the modern father of BIAB. He championed the cause and made it the very good avenue to brewing for many modern Australians and those otherlings from OS who have also seen a light and followed it.

God bless your Pistol and I'm glad you stopped sending me all those bad jokes and late night rants - though it did make AHB more interesting a few years ago!

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Indeed it did.....Some of pats posts required several beers to get thru them.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Indeed it did.....Some of pats posts required several beers to get thru them.

 

[Fatgodzilla]

Indeed it did.....Some of pats posts required several beers to get thru them.

and a packed lunch ...

 

[sinkas]

Pistol Patch,
east fremantle WA,
he has a dedicated website www.biabrewer.info

 

[anthonyUK]

As someone who was on the verge of giving up due to lack of quality with kit brewing and thinking AG was too complicated I am forever grateful to people such as PP and Bribie who championed the cause and demystified the BIAB process. As far as I can tell from the UK, the modern BIAB scene was derived in Oz.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Vindicated..hell, we lost the Ashes so we may as well claim BIAB

 

[MastersBrewery]

I think in the same context John Palmer didn't invent brewing but few would argue the impact he and his books has had on the modern home brewer.

 

[PistolPatch]

Hey there fellas :icon_cheers: ,

Received a heads up on this thread yesterday and have enjoyed the read. Thanks very much for remembering me. I do really appreciate it and wish that teleporting was the go so as I could drop in and have a beer with a few of you that have posted here but I haven't seen for ages since moving states etc. Still looking forward to another QLD Swap and, hopefully one day, the Sydney Pub Crawl.

Regarding the question asked in this thread, I think a few of the original 'BIAB' threads/posts have already been posted. This one was meant to be continually updated to give the right people the right credit but around that time, the ability to edit posts was discontinued. Many people helped or contributed to BIAB. James Squire asked the right question for a start. Ross told me the material to get. AndrewQLD did a full volume mash on his traditional equipment. This encouraged me to do a few single vessel tests. hashie and jimmysuperlative read and advised me on a lot of material I initially wrote and they still help me now. mimeryberg was another really helpful brewer and he's from Germany if I remember rightly. Screwtop did come up with the BIAB name and many others were super helpful or valuable.

There's probably a few myths that need dispelling in this "history" thread. The first myth is that everyone was against BIAB, especially three-vessel brewers. That isn't true at all. Almost all of the original encouragement and investigation of BIAB came from existing three-vessel brewers. In those days the culture here was open-minded and investigative which was great. A year or so later the culture changed a bit and went through some quite wild stages but very few members here with any credibility made any attempts to discourage BIAB. Some of those people though did cost the whole site a lot of time and trouble, so much so, that I think quite a few people gave up on the site. I personally haven't even read here for a very long time. I am really pleased to see that this thread has 79 posts all of which are constructive, positive or humourous. I honestly thought those days were over. Very nice to see :icon_cheers:.

The next problem in this thread probably is a terminology one. As alluded to here already, BIAB, to us here on AHB at least, was more about single vessel, full-volume mashing than brewing in a bag. Was David Line's stuff focused on that? I'd love to know more on this - seriously. From the posts above, it sounds like, some of it at least, was.

What I've been working on...

I know some of you guys wanted an old-style PP essay. Who am I not to oblige?

Pretty much all of the the work I have been doing over the last few years on BIABrewer.info has been spent on the most basic building blocks of brewing. I never envisioned how hard this would be or how long it would take.

...

Apologies. I did actually have a whole essay written just above on terminology, software, formulas and people and just lost the whole lot. You might be able to imagine how I'm feeling about losing that. (Sorry stux, you had a mention there.)

...

Anyway, thanks once again for the thinking of me,
Pat