What If You Have?

[Doc Tempest]

Hi folks,

my first post here. I've been a long time lurker and I love the work that some of you have done, really inspiring.

I need some recipe suggestions and would like to work within the ingredients that I have on hand. Hence the title, "What if you have?"

So,
Brewing/Cooling methodology: BIAB (Kettle max.45L) + NC

Ingredients:
[Malt] 25kg German Pale Malt, 2.5-3 EBC; 800g old malt extract that's converted from powder to syrup, 24-44 EBC;
[Hops, pellets] 1.5 kg HPE (Perle) Type 45 Hops; 1 kg Pride of Ringwood Hops; 800g Czech Saaz Hops; 200g Fuggles Hops; 1 oz Hallertauer Hops; 1 oz Centenial hops;
[Yeast, dry activated] Muntons Premium Gold; Nottingham; Safale S-04
[Water] Hamburg Tap Water

Current Cellar Temperature is averaging 16C
Fermenters can be 4 x 22L wide neck Water Dispenser Bottles fitted with Airlocks
Secondaries can be 18L S/S Soda Kegs
Priming preference is to retain unfermented wort from the brew and add this back at time of priming.

My brewing mate is looking into doing a traditional English Pale Ale with the above ingredients or one or two additions if he can get them. I'd prefer to work with what I've got before it all goes toes up and becomes ingredients worthy of Stinky Cheese. Ideally I'd like to make something which is moderately bittered and has some interesting aroma notes and flavours to it.

These are the constraints I have to work with. Would you have any recipe ideas or suggestions for me to consider?

 

[ged]

Don't use the old malt extract.
Option 1 - English pale ale - mash the pale malt, bitter with perle / por / even saaz, split your 200g fuggles at 20 / flameout / dry hop (I don't no chill so follow others advice on this). Tap off 3l wort and reduce to caramel (you don't have any crystal malt). Add back in. Ferment with s04 at 18-20.
Option 2 - do a pseudo lager kolschy sort of thing with your pale malt, perle for bittering, saaz at 20 and flameout ( or you could do tony style large single saaz addition at 40) Ferment with notto at 16.

 

[labels]

Hi folks,

my first post here. I've been a long time lurker and I love the work that some of you have done, really inspiring.

I need some recipe suggestions and would like to work within the ingredients that I have on hand. Hence the title, "What if you have?"

So,
Brewing/Cooling methodology: BIAB (Kettle max.45L) + NC

Ingredients:
[Malt] 25kg German Pale Malt, 2.5-3 EBC; 800g old malt extract that's converted from powder to syrup, 24-44 EBC;
[Hops, pellets] 1.5 kg HPE (Perle) Type 45 Hops; 1 kg Pride of Ringwood Hops; 800g Czech Saaz Hops; 200g Fuggles Hops; 1 oz Hallertauer Hops; 1 oz Centenial hops;
[Yeast, dry activated] Muntons Premium Gold; Nottingham; Safale S-04
[Water] Hamburg Tap Water

Current Cellar Temperature is averaging 16C
Fermenters can be 4 x 22L wide neck Water Dispenser Bottles fitted with Airlocks
Secondaries can be 18L S/S Soda Kegs
Priming preference is to retain unfermented wort from the brew and add this back at time of priming.

My brewing mate is looking into doing a traditional English Pale Ale with the above ingredients or one or two additions if he can get them. I'd prefer to work with what I've got before it all goes toes up and becomes ingredients worthy of Stinky Cheese. Ideally I'd like to make something which is moderately bittered and has some interesting aroma notes and flavours to it.

These are the constraints I have to work with. Would you have any recipe ideas or suggestions for me to consider?

Definitely toss the old malt extract out. Old extract is well known for cidery flavours in beer.

You could make a nice simple ale using the ale malt, the fuggles hops and Nottingham yeast. Nottingham is very tolerant of cooler conditions for an ale yeast and will ferment really well at 16C. It could be a great SMASH beer (single malt and single hop). Mash at 63C, sparge at 75C, ferment for a couple of weeks, cold condition for a week to clear the beer and you're ready to go. How simple is that!

 

[Charst]

Get yourself a bottle of saison DuPont and reculture the yeast, any saison really. 100% pils malt, mash 63 for 45, 68 for 15. bitter to 25 IBU with saaz or fuggles and ferment at 18 for three days then ramp to 30 over a week.

 

[Doc Tempest]

Thanks guys given me lots to think about.

Think I'll do a SMASH loosely based on "The Mysterious Australian Ale"

So, first recipe attempt at my "1856" - Burton No.3 Australian Ale.

20L Brew.
6.25 kg Pale Malt (3EBC)
0.25 kg Home Roasted Malt (200 EBC? - we'll see) - for messing with the flavour profile more than anything else, 'sides I kinda like reddish beers.
BIAB with 24L, Single Infusion Mash at 68C (aiming for Medium Body, Medium Maltiness), No Mash Out
120g Fuggles at 90min, 60g Fuggles at 45min, 20g Fuggles into the Fermenter. Koppafloc, Yeast Nutrient and Whirlpool 10 min before end of boil - switch to simmer for last 10 min. 30 min before end of Boil, retard 3L of wort and caramelize then add back in.
Retard 500ml of clear wort, bottle and store in fridge for Priming then syphon and package the rest into a Cube and leave O/N to chill out.
Pitch two packs of Munton's Premium Gold for a 4 week Ferment at ambient Cellar Temp (16C) with blanket support. [Munton's for temp range and for the higher alcohol tolerance.] Dry Hop with 20g of Fuggles after 2 weeks in the fermenter.
Transfer to s/s soda keg and pitch priming solution and leave to condition for 4-6 weeks or so.

Thoughts? Predictions on the possible flavour profile?

 

[Rowy]

More importantly than all that stuff Doc..............................welcome to the site :icon_cheers:

 

[bignath]

Thanks guys given me lots to think about.

Think I'll do a SMASH loosely based on "The Mysterious Australian Ale"

So, first recipe attempt at my "1856" - Burton No.3 Australian Ale.

20L Brew.
6.25 kg Pale Malt (3EBC)
0.25 kg Home Roasted Malt (200 EBC? - we'll see) - for messing with the flavour profile more than anything else, 'sides I kinda like reddish beers.
BIAB with 24L, Single Infusion Mash at 68C (aiming for Medium Body, Medium Maltiness), No Mash Out
120g Fuggles at 90min, 60g Fuggles at 45min, 20g Fuggles into the Fermenter. Koppafloc, Yeast Nutrient and Whirlpool 10 min before end of boil - switch to simmer for last 10 min. 30 min before end of Boil, retard 3L of wort and caramelize then add back in.
Retard 500ml of clear wort, bottle and store in fridge for Priming then syphon and package the rest into a Cube and leave O/N to chill out.
Pitch two packs of Munton's Premium Gold for a 4 week Ferment at ambient Cellar Temp (16C) with blanket support. [Munton's for temp range and for the higher alcohol tolerance.] Dry Hop with 20g of Fuggles after 2 weeks in the fermenter.
Transfer to s/s soda keg and pitch priming solution and leave to condition for 4-6 weeks or so.

Thoughts? Predictions on the possible flavour profile?

What's your method for roasting your grain? Time/temp?

Interested in your results of this in particular. Always wanted to have a go at it myself.

 

[Doc Tempest]

Hey Rowy, thanks for the Welcome.

@Big Nath - hello mate, I've been following your EZBrew Build and that was the tipping point that pushed me to join. I wanted to add my voice to the chorus for the Part B video request. :-D Would love to see some beer coming outta that badboy!

Roasting Barley I figured I'd do something similar to roasting coffee beans or acorns in the oven but was unsure about just how to finish it all - coffe is funny n that it overshoots, I figured grain might be similar. So a bit of research and I thought I'd follow these two articles: Roasting Malt and Roasting Your Own Grain. I'll keep you posted on how it all works out.

 

[Doc Tempest]

...and this site. http://barleypopmaker.info/2009/12/08/home...ing-your-malts/

 

[squirt in the turns]

800g old malt extract that's converted from powder to syrup, 24-44 EBC

Just out of curiosity, why has your dried malt been reconstituted but not yet used? I would have thought it would keep better in dried form?

Don't use the old malt extract.
Option 1 - English pale ale - mash the pale malt, bitter with perle / por / even saaz, split your 200g fuggles at 20 / flameout / dry hop (I don't no chill so follow others advice on this). Tap off 3l wort and reduce to caramel (you don't have any crystal malt). Add back in. Ferment with s04 at 18-20.
Option 2 - do a pseudo lager kolschy sort of thing with your pale malt, perle for bittering, saaz at 20 and flameout ( or you could do tony style large single saaz addition at 40) Ferment with notto at 16.

I'm keen to have a go at a SMaSH English bitter, with the small decoction for caramelisation instead of using crystal. Is the technique as simple as it sounds? Just boil it down until it's the consistency of liquid extract and add it at the end of the boil? Presumably towards the end of the process, the heat should be reduced to a very gentle level to avoid scorching. Any other caveats?

 

[bignath]

@Big Nath - hello mate, I've been following your EZBrew Build and that was the tipping point that pushed me to join. I wanted to add my voice to the chorus for the Part B video request. :-D Would love to see some beer coming outta that badboy!

Roasting Barley I figured I'd do something similar to roasting coffee beans or acorns in the oven but was unsure about just how to finish it all - coffe is funny n that it overshoots, I figured grain might be similar. So a bit of research and I thought I'd follow these two articles: Roasting Malt and Roasting Your Own Grain. I'll keep you posted on how it all works out.

Cheers mate, hopefully soon ill get around to doing another video now that I've completed V2.0!
It works beautifully well.

Thanks for roasting info....I'll look into it further.

 

[Doc Tempest]

Just out of curiosity, why has your dried malt been reconstituted but not yet used? I would have thought it would keep better in dried form?

It was powdered Malt Extract and certainly old. I had opened it to make a yeast starter, and then popped the plastic cap back on it and then left it on a windowsill through the steamy summer Hanoi heat and the powder absorbed enough moisture from the air to turn it into a hard syrup. That's what I meant by being reconstituted. I really hadn't paid it enough attention or respect. :-(


Well, I've got my grain now, just have to put the final touches on my brewspace and hopefully I should be knocking out a brew or two next week (the plan is Tuesday). I was given the last hops (20g fresh) before felling from the next door neighbour's garden hops - smell nice.

So I thought due to the small amount I'd make up a small batch in my pilot brewery and recipe tester (a 1.65l nom.cap. Coffee Maker) with Type 45 HPE hops for bittering only then dry hop in the fermenter with the fresh hops, and finish the conditioning in PET bottles fitted with EZ Caps (I use these for making cider, great stuff). My mate and I will do a Brown Ale ala Palmer via BIAB and I'll probably start the day off with my BIAB go at the 1856 (outlined above) before my mate turns up in the arvo.

Can't wait, can't wait....

 

[Doc Tempest]

Damn! My yeast crapped out on me... Back to the drawing board.

:-(


DT

 

[Nick JD]

Damn! My yeast crapped out on me... Back to the drawing board.

:-(


DT

Can you buy Coopers Pale Ale bottles in Germany? I know it's available in Europe and America, but probably rarely. It's a key ingredient in Aussie Ales.

 

[Doc Tempest]

Can you buy Coopers Pale Ale bottles in Germany? I know it's available in Europe and America, but probably rarely. It's a key ingredient in Aussie Ales.

Hi Nick, yeah Coopers is gettable here, but it's cheaper, and more reliable, to just order some and have it posted.

My problem above was old yeast I thought by doubling up with the packs I might have done the job, but I'll just have to make a starter for my next batch and order in some new, fresh yeast.

 

[Nick JD]

Hi Nick, yeah Coopers is gettable here, but it's cheaper, and more reliable, to just order some and have it posted.

My problem above was old yeast I thought by doubling up with the packs I might have done the job, but I'll just have to make a starter for my next batch and order in some new, fresh yeast.

You mean WLP009, or the Coopers dried yeast?

Coopers dried yeast is not the stuff they use in their brewery. Whitelabs Aussie Ale is.

 

[Doc Tempest]

You mean WLP009, or the Coopers dried yeast?

Coopers dried yeast is not the stuff they use in their brewery. Whitelabs Aussie Ale is.

Thanks for the heads up on that. This yeast stuff is dicey business.

Anyway, an update

for BigNath: I've home roasted my grain a couple of times now and got some quite good colour out of the beer. However, it is quite energy intensive and takes a bit of time just using the oven. Also in making roasted barley or Black Patent, it's really har to get it dark enough without turning the how sordid mess into charcoal. I think a drum roaster project might be on the cards this coming Summer (Oz Winter, I'm in Germany). FWIW I use commercial kitchen drum seives to hold the roasted grain and then pump some airflow through the grain, to help it de-gas after roasting and cool quicker, with a pedestal fan mounted underneath the seives. I guess a hair dryer with a cold setting would also do the job and make a neat cheapo blower for a DIY rack.

For Nick JD: Been having fun with my yeast. I tried to resurrect a frozen liquid smack pack of Danish Lager that was well over a year past it's best before date. That Didn't work, so I pitched so dried S-23 into it and added some unfermented wort to create a starter and kept it on my getto stirplate. It did some stuff, a little. Anyway, pitched it into some beer and it went off like a frog in a sock! Fermenting it out now, but what I've got in the fermenter are real, cheesy, curd like chunks of trub floating around. Don't think I'll be washing this stuf for reuse. Strange thing is that my mate who got half the wort from brewday, pitched his with an ale yeast and got the same cheesy chunks floating around in his bee as well - He was about to say stuff it and throw it away but I told him to hold onto it and let it do its work, and we'll see how it is after 3-4 weeks, instead of 7 days. I also have a Bohemian Smack pack which Beersmith tells me is probably less than 10% viable. Ah well, looks like something to play with to see if I can build it back up before the next brew.

;-)