The Best Hard Seltzer - White Claw or Moon Dog Clone

[KegLand-com-au]

We have had a relatively disappointing experience with seltzers so far which is why we have not put any seltzers on our website but we are keen to get your feedback on this topic. Obviously the seltzer market has grown a lot but even from many of the customers that we have spoken to none of them seem to have made a seltzer they have been really happy with.

So far despite extensive testing we have found that many light lasting seltzers are so low in flavor that there is simply nowhere for any defects to hide behind. Removing the "yeasty" flavor is quite difficult in a product that is basically carbonated water.

Some things that we have found are:

Nutrient
- Slow release nutrient like Lallemand Yeast Life O are pretty good.
- If you do not have a slow release nutrient then simply topping up the nutrient after day 1 or day 2 is another way to go.

Yeast
- The Lutra yeast is probably the best we have found so far but even with this yeast its difficult to get all the yeasty flavor and aroma out.

Clarification/Filtration
- We have found this to be absolutely essential. Putting using things like Biofine A3 or other silicone based fining agents have been good.
- If you have the ability to run the product through carbon filtration that helps a lot but this is a massive paint for a lot of home brewers.

Good Water
- Using RO water or at least very soft water is also important.

Bottle Conditioning - Is it even possible
- We have found this to be basically impossible as the yeast remaining in the bottle when bottle conditioning makes the product undrinkable. It's more visually presentable to have a clear final beverage rather than a cloudy seltzer but then the other thing is the flavor of all that yeast is really not nice in the final seltzer. So due to this it's almost as if we have to rule out bottle conditioning meaning seltzers are only possible for those customers using kegs.

We are really keen to get your feedback on this one guys? Are we missing something here. We have tried a lot of the kits out there and mostly been disappointed? The only seltzers we have been happy with are ones that we have made from vodka and flavor sachets rather than fermenting sugar out ourselves. We are keen to put a recipe kit together but we also don't want to sell a kit unless we are happy with the end results.

What is your best seltzer recipe both for those people bottle conditioning(if that is possible) and also for kegging?

 

[sp0rk]

fermented seltzer is poop imho, unless you're carbon filtering you'll always have some undesired flavours (ain't nobody got time fo' that)
for kegging, 1L of 96% ABV neutral alcohol, flavour to your choosing (I use 2L of diet rite cordial) and good filtered water to bring the total upto 19L makes for a perfect mix at 5.1% ABV
I use 2L of sugar free cordial because I'm not a huge fan of the very watered down taste of seltzers, but YMMV

 

[KegLand-com-au]

fermented seltzer is poop imho, unless you're carbon filtering you'll always have some undesired flavours (ain't nobody got time fo' that)
for kegging, 1L of 96% ABV neutral alcohol, flavour to your choosing (I use 2L of diet rite cordial) and good filtered water to bring the total upto 19L makes for a perfect mix at 5.1% ABV
I use 2L of sugar free cordial because I'm not a huge fan of the very watered down taste of seltzers, but YMMV

Thanks for that sp0rk. I would agree the only good seltzers that we have made are with the neutral alcohol/vodka so far. I am wondering if it's just you and me or are other customers purchasing the seltzer kits and getting better results than we are?

Has anyone else been able to ferment a seltzer that actually tastes decent? Can you please share the recipe?

I mean if you add enough cordial and flavor you can probably cover up the "yeasty" taste but then it's not really a seltzer. Has anyone actually been able to make a seltzer at home that is anywhere near this type of White Claw product or Moon Dog Fizzer.

 

[Grmblz]

+1 for spOrk. NGS, proof down, flavour, keg, force carbonate. If you can get enough gas into it you may be able to transfer to bottles/cans, and retain some fizz.

I think you already know the answer to your question. Is it possible? Yes. But with an awful lot of faffing around, and not really practical on a homebrew scale. Even with the ability to carbon filter it just becomes impractical due to time, effort, and expense, especially when compared to the alternative way of producing it.

I believe the reason for the commercial guys doing it through fermentation is the excise rates are different depending on how it's produced, not too sure, just a vague recollection of an article I read a few years ago. (just did a quick Google https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-03...ies-classification-beer-spirit-wine/100035218)

Quite clearly the US has sensible alcohol tax and we don't. Clawhammer uses spirit, so trying to replicate it using a completely different method would appear to be a futile exercise.

Many of us with more than one hobby have been chasing the holy grail of a completely neutral sugar fermentation for years, personally I use Lallemands hard seltzer protocols, I've had good results with CBC-1 although I've never tried Lutra so can't comment on that (https://admin.lallemandbrewing.com/...tices-Hard_Seltzer-ENG-A4_2021-printbleed.pdf) although I'd be surprised if you haven't already tried it.

 

[KegLand-com-au]

+1 for spOrk. NGS, proof down, flavour, keg, force carbonate. If you can get enough gas into it you may be able to transfer to bottles/cans, and retain some fizz.

I think you already know the answer to your question. Is it possible? Yes. But with an awful lot of faffing around, and not really practical on a homebrew scale. Even with the ability to carbon filter it just becomes impractical due to time, effort, and expense, especially when compared to the alternative way of producing it.

I believe the reason for the commercial guys doing it through fermentation is the excise rates are different depending on how it's produced, not too sure, just a vague recollection of an article I read a few years ago. (just did a quick Google https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-03...ies-classification-beer-spirit-wine/100035218)

Quite clearly the US has sensible alcohol tax and we don't. Clawhammer uses spirit, so trying to replicate it using a completely different method would appear to be a futile exercise.

Many of us with more than one hobby have been chasing the holy grail of a completely neutral sugar fermentation for years, personally I use Lallemands hard seltzer protocols, I've had good results with CBC-1 although I've never tried Lutra so can't comment on that (https://admin.lallemandbrewing.com/...tices-Hard_Seltzer-ENG-A4_2021-printbleed.pdf) although I'd be surprised if you haven't already tried it.

Hello Grmblz. If you have got this level of experience and you have tried to do this before, would you be interested in doing a comparison for us if we send you some free ingredients to try out.

We are doing a lot of testing in this area ourselves but it's always good to get someone else's opinion when it comes to testing flavored products. We are struggling to make a good seltzer from fermentation but we have a filtered and fortified wine product called VINKA which we would be keen for you to try and see if you get better results.

The only catch is that you have to report back to this forum with the results so other customers can also benefit from your feedback (including ourselves).

 

[Grmblz]

Hello Grmblz. If you have got this level of experience and you have tried to do this before, would you be interested in doing a comparison for us if we send you some free ingredients to try out.

We are doing a lot of testing in this area ourselves but it's always good to get someone else's opinion when it comes to testing flavored products. We are struggling to make a good seltzer from fermentation but we have a filtered and fortified wine product called VINKA which we would be keen for you to try and see if you get better results.

The only catch is that you have to report back to this forum with the results so other customers can also benefit from your feedback (including ourselves).

Sure, I'm happy to help the community. The only caveat is that it will be unbiased and honest. I will also test it on my kids and their partners (22yr-38yr olds) which I'm happy to share with you, and you may use at your discretion, however any comment I make will be my honest opinion.

 

[KegLand-com-au]

Sure, I'm happy to help the community. The only caveat is that it will be unbiased and honest. I will also test it on my kids and their partners (22yr-38yr olds) which I'm happy to share with you, and you may use at your discretion, however any comment I make will be my honest opinion.

That sounds great. We are looking for unbiased advice so you will not be under any pressure. We really want to get some external taste buds on it and compare our kit to other seltzer kits that you have tried. At the end of the day, if the product we have is no good we do not want to sell it.

Can you send me an order number of a previous order you have made with us so I can look up your details in our system?

 

[Grmblz]

That sounds great. We are looking for unbiased advice so you will not be under any pressure. We really want to get some external taste buds on it and compare our kit to other seltzer kits that you have tried. At the end of the day, if the product we have is no good we do not want to sell it.

Can you send me an order number of a previous order you have made with us so I can look up your details in our system?

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