The Art Of Chilling.

[damoninja]

If water consumption is something you're really worried about and you already have a chiller here's an idea...

What about chilling to say 70-80C to the point where hops "don't" isomerise (someone jump in if this is inaccurate) and then drop that wort in to a cube, and no-chill the rest overnight?

The first 20 degrees come off in seconds, you can see the dial zipping down in no time, so this first bit doesn't use that much water.
You also have the hop situation adjusted (yeah or nah?)
And have 80C wort which will stay high for hours, still able to kill most nasty stuff

This a good idea or ****?

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

I can see logic in that

 

[Matplat]

I like chilling simply because it get's everything done in one hit.

Otherwise, I spend all night brewing, then still have to go and take another 30-45 mins the next day to sanitise the FV, pitch yeast, clean cube etc.

If you have young children, you'll know what I mean.....

 

[Crakkers]

All the water does not go to waste. The first bit that's hot goes in the washing machine, once it's cooler I back the pressure off hook up a longer hose and go water my vege patch.

The one thing that's a bit of a pain is when the water's 30 degrees so won't chill any lower.

Mine goes out the kitchen window into the washing machine. Then I can either do a load of washing with hot water, or wait for it to cool down and pump it onto the vegie patch.
When the tapwater loses its effectiveness, I connect it to a pond pump in an esky full of an ice slurry and recirculate it through that. Gets that last 15-20 degrees knocked off in no time.

 

[damoninja]

Mine goes out the kitchen window into the washing machine. Then I can either do a load of washing with hot water, or wait for it to cool down and pump it onto the vegie patch.
When the tapwater loses its effectiveness, I connect it to a pond pump in an esky full of an ice slurry and recirculate it through that. Gets that last 15-20 degrees knocked off in no time.

Hmm... Never thought of doing it this way, I heard of people using 2 chillers like a miracle box and chilling the water that way but it involves another piece of hardware, fittings etc.

Well, since I have the freezer going anyways ready for the beer the next day I could just freeze a heap of coke bottles or something and smash it up, can drop it in my mash tun with some water and boom. B) B)

Was thinking one of the brown pumps, but I don't know if that would have the guts to pump that mass of water over the distance, might be OK if level... Will see what other cheap ones I can get a hold of for this purpose.

Nice tip, cheers

 

[Crakkers]

I could just freeze a heap of coke bottles or something and smash it up,

I use 3x2 litre long-life milk cartons. They take up less room in the freezer than equivalent volume round drink bottles and they're much easier to break open.
I give them a few whacks with the blunt side of a tomahawk to smash the ice up, then flip it over and cut them in half with the sharp side.
As for the pumping side of things, I sit the esky right next to the kettle at the same height, so a cheapie Ebay pond pump is just right.

 

[Meddo]

If water consumption is something you're really worried about and you already have a chiller here's an idea...

What about chilling to say 70-80C to the point where hops "don't" isomerise (someone jump in if this is inaccurate) and then drop that wort in to a cube, and no-chill the rest overnight?

The first 20 degrees come off in seconds, you can see the dial zipping down in no time, so this first bit doesn't use that much water.
You also have the hop situation adjusted (yeah or nah?)
And have 80C wort which will stay high for hours, still able to kill most nasty stuff

This a good idea or ****?

I'm also keen on some opinions as to whether this works or not. My preference is to immersion chill as my standard method so that I can pitch same day, but also on occasion want to cube the occasional batch for longer storage if, for instance, the fermentation fridge is tied up or I'm late getting a starter done.

I'd prefer to keep a consistent chilling, whirlpooling, and hop stand technique (rather than occasional full-blown no-chill / cube-hop) while I'm in the early stages of my brewing journey, so wondering if there's a minimum temperature that the wort should be when pumped into a starsanned cube to prevent infections? Ideally for this consistency to be achievable it would be just below what most of my reading indicates is the lowest standard hop stand / whirlpool temperature of 77 deg, but of course my preference don't make it science.

I read a post in an earlier thread that suggested 20 seconds at 75 deg would pasteurize the wort, and therefore presumably knock out anything worrisome in the cube that the starsan didn't get - does this sound reasonable?

I'm sure this sort of question has been answered plenty of times before but my last couple of hours worth of searching hasn't surfaced it for me yet.

Thanks,

 

[Dave70]

No chilling goes against general cannon of the homebrewer, viz, more brewing associated ****. Rapid cooling of the wort is considered best practice. It simply is.

Just be sure to re hydrate you chiller before placing it in the wort or you'll catch botulism of the AIDS.

 

[damoninja]

I read a post in an earlier thread that suggested 20 seconds at 75 deg would pasteurize the wort, and therefore presumably knock out anything worrisome in the cube that the starsan didn't get - does this sound reasonable?

Suitable probably especially in conjunction with star san. Home pasteurisation of certain things suggest holding at 80C for 90 minutes, when I've done it with things like fruit 10 minutes is about what I go for.

With the mass of wort, if you dropped it in the cube at 75C you can rest assured it's going to take quite some time to come down from this temp.

If you wanted to be even more careful hit the cube with sodium perc, rinse then star san it.

 

[manticle]

The wort will be fine as it's been boiled for 60+ minutes. Nothing will settle in it as it cools to 80.

It's the surface of the cube interior that will need to get to x temperature for y time. Proper cleanliness and sanitation should be relied upon rather than hot wort anyway. I let my wort settle for around 20 minutes, then add late hops, whirlpool and let settle for another 20 minutes so it enters the cube around 80 (previously measured). I can't see anything amazingly wrong with what you propose damoninja although some of the convenience of no-chill is lost.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

I did both No-chill & crash chilling

There is a difference in taste, due to hop utilisation etc...

So far I am still alive from no-chill

 

[Zorco]

Hops ***** bots

 

[Stouter]

No chilling goes against general cannon of the homebrewer, viz, more brewing associated ****. Rapid cooling of the wort is considered best practice. It simply is.

Just be sure to re hydrate you chiller before placing it in the wort or you'll catch botulism of the AIDS.

Intermittent arse scratching during any pitching of yeast, wort aeration, and processes of transferring or bottling is also now considered 'best practice'...apparently.

 

[Bribie G]

I no chill in an assortment of 10L and 5L cubes.
I expect LC could provide a formula for the increased speed of chilling compared to a 20-25L cube due to the far increased surface area to volume ratio.

If doing a morning brew and no chilling, I find that by sitting in the laundry tubs with a trickle of cold water, by the early afternoon the cubes are often cool enough to pop in a fridge and pitch that evening.

 

[TidalPete]

I have no-chilled twice in 295 AG's & have found that it's not cool. :lol:

 

[Tony121]

I can't see anything amazingly wrong with what you propose damoninja although some of the convenience of no-chill is lost.

My thoughts are that one of the best parts of no chilling is to not worry about setting up the chiller and then having to clean the bloody thing afterwards. If you are going to the effort to chill to 80 why not go all the way?

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

damoninja, on 17 Nov 2016 - 09:24 AM, said:

The one thing that's a bit of a pain is when the water's 30 degrees so won't chill any lower. No sweat, my ferm fridge is a freezer and has been set to -18C for a few days so in an hour or so she's dropped to pitching temp.

I used to do no chill and probably ought to again over summer providing it's not a hoppier beer, if it is then I'll deal with it in the above manner.

I just built something that might help with that. It was meant to go into use today but too busy with bike stuff so no brew till Monday:

https://flic.kr/p/PfmEtj]

The idea is to run the chiller as normal until the delta T reduces to under 20 degrees then couple this thing into the line and dump a few kg of ice into it (hence the wide mouth drum, easier to get the ice in). The water flows up through the ice and drops toaround 0oC, improving the delta T.

Once I've run it a few times I'll post more info.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Sorry, doubled up.

 

[Moog]

I just chuck the cubes in the pool, and leave them there for 2 or 3 hours, without any no-chill adjustment, they seem to cool pretty quick, I must spend the time to monitor how quick some time.
I know I've checked about an hour later and all the warmth has gone.

 

[Robbo2234]

I no chill and no hop cubes!
Brew a little over target boil and no chill as per normal but don't add hops.

When your ready to ferment boil some water and do your hop schedule and add it to the fermenter!

Heaps better for late hop additions