Terror suspect shot dead in Melbourne suburb.

[BadSeed]

Meanwhile, when countries fall over themselves reacting to non-specific fears about terror, shit like this happens;

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2014/09/26/im-really-scared-teen-trapped-home-after-labelled-terror-suspect-fairfax

Poor kid, the result of knee jerk hysteria.

On the subject of believing the police and media version of events.
Remember this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Butcher

A gang of blokes started a brawl in a pub on an afternoon the bar staff asked 2 regulars (a father and son) to help out.

So the cops turned up , tasered the guy (55 yo) who was trying to stop the fight and was urging his cop mates to taser him more while he was on the ground.
The mans son headbutted the cop to stop him from repeatedly tasering his, already on the floor, father.

The cops lied about it repeatedly in the media. released a heavily doctored video. The main tasering headbutted cop then turned up to court in a wheelchair which he hasn't been seen in since.

Mostly came out in court and the headbutting guy was found to be not-guilty of all charges.
Disgusting behaviour by the cops and media and all strangely silent after the court case.

 

[philmud]

So shit.

Media get stuff wrong all the time (personal experience of this) but to stuff something like that up is really poor. Thus my earlier disclaimers of 'if media reports are true'.

Media get stuff wrong most often when they are clamouring to get a story out first.

 

[Dave70]

So shit.

Media get stuff wrong all the time (personal experience of this) but to stuff something like that up is really poor. Thus my earlier disclaimers of 'if media reports are true'.

Did a candid photo of you sipping a beer at the local somehow find its way into an article about die hard fans enjoying a drink in preparation for that evenings Radiators (feat Uncanny X men) show?
I could see how that would be devastating.

 

[manticle]

It was a Pink show but yeah along those lines.

 

[BadSeed]

Did a candid photo of you sipping a beer at the local somehow find its way into an article about die hard fans enjoying a drink in preparation for that evenings Radiators (feat Uncanny X men) show?
I could see how that would be devastating.

This did actually happen to me,
I was photographed at a festival and labelled as an Inspiral Carpets fan when I was really there to see The Cramps

 

[wide eyed and legless]

Nine arrested in London in co-ordinated dawn raids by counter terrorist task force, looks like the come in for a chat and a cup of tea hasn't caught on over there.

Sailor in Sydney withdraws claims he was attacked by 2 men of middle eastern appearance.

 

[philmud]

Sailor in Sydney withdraws claims he was attacked by 2 men of middle eastern appearance.

I read a statement on Twitter ostensibly from ADF stating that the allegations have been withdrawn. I say ostensibly because I'm unsure if authentic, though was tweeted by a well reputed journo (Mark Colvin).

Just a reminder that yesterday, Occam's razor said the assault took place as it was reported.

Edit:

Link to the story. It was authentic:

http://m.smh.com.au/national/australian-defence-force-member-withdraws-attack-complaint-20140926-10mfgg.html?skin=smart-phone

 

[Blind Dog]

This did actually happen to me,
I was photographed at a festival and labelled as an Inspiral Carpets fan when I was really there to see The Cramps

So This is how it feels?

 

[Camo6]

I read a statement on Twitter ostensibly from ADF stating that the allegations have been withdrawn. I say ostensibly because I'm unsure if authentic, though was tweeted by a well reputed journo (Mark Colvin).

Just a reminder that yesterday, Occam's razor said the assault took place as it was reported.

The main difference being that in the case of the former hypothesis there is a dead man and two injured police officers.

With the instance of the ADF personnel it's built on the basis of one man's allegation of being assaulted by two Middle Eastern men, with little else.

Wouldn't the simplest assumption be that his claim of being assaulted by two men of Middle Eastern appearance, while wearing an ADF uniform, directly after the police shooting of a man of Middle Eastern origins, with nothing to show but minor bruising, was untrue?

Either way, a withdrawn allegation doesn't mean that it never happened. One could theorise that it was withdrawn in an effort to prevent further inflammation of the shooting incident. But that's just another assumption of which we have no evidence. The only thing I know for sure is it's four o'clock somewhere and I'm gonna have a beer.

 

[philmud]

Wouldn't the simplest assumption be that his claim of being assaulted by two men of Middle Eastern appearance, while wearing an ADF uniform, directly after the police shooting of a man of Middle Eastern origins, with nothing to show but minor bruising, was untrue?

I'm not sure I agree with that - what's your logic? I'd say most crimes that are reported occur in the way the victims claim they occur. Most people (myself included) found it feasible and simply assumed that it happened. When you heard about it, did you genuinely think it was a false report?

Either way, a withdrawn allegation doesn't mean that it never happened

I'd say it's pretty likely that it didn't. Occam's Razor once again.

 

[wide eyed and legless]

I for one thought it was genuine, but Camo's theory is plausible, the armed forces have been known to cover things up.

 

[Camo6]

I'm not sure I agree with that - what's your logic? I'd say most crimes that are reported occur in the way the victims claim they occur. Most people (myself included) found it feasible and simply assumed that it happened. When you heard about it, did you genuinely think it was a false report?

My logic is that with the case of the shooting there are two injured officers and a dead body. That can't be dispelled. It's a matter of determining what actually happened.

In the case of the ADF person claiming they were assaulted there is little substantial evidence apart from a statement. Therefore it's a matter of first determining whether it actually happened.

When my daughter tells me the cookies fell into her mouth from the top pantry shelf my first and simplest assumption is that she is not telling the truth.


But now I'm just arguing semantics as I'm a stubborn bugger who can never admit if he's wrong. (And believes not much else makes the same noise as a duck)


The real tragedy here is the two injured officers and the dead kid who was misled by ignorant fucks. My apologies for veering off topic, I shall now withdraw. (bows and backs out of the room)

 

[philmud]

Ok, fair enough. I think we're probably arguing different specific points anyway. Let's both have a beer!

 

[Cloth Ears]

Poor kid, the result of knee jerk hysteria.

On the subject of believing the police and media version of events.
Remember this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Butcher

A gang of blokes started a brawl in a pub on an afternoon the bar staff asked 2 regulars (a father and son) to help out.

So the cops turned up , tasered the guy (55 yo) who was trying to stop the fight and was urging his cop mates to taser him more while he was on the ground.
The mans son headbutted the cop to stop him from repeatedly tasering his, already on the floor, father.

The cops lied about it repeatedly in the media. released a heavily doctored video. The main tasering headbutted cop then turned up to court in a wheelchair which he hasn't been seen in since.

Mostly came out in court and the headbutting guy was found to be not-guilty of all charges.
Disgusting behaviour by the cops and media and all strangely silent after the court case.

Really? "strangely silent after the court case" and "turned up to court in a wheelchair which he hasn't been seen in since", eh? Well, let's see...WA passed those new mandatory sentencing laws as a direct result of this case, so I'm not sure how 'silent' that is. And the guy has been able to learn to walk with a cane (as of 2012) but was still paralysed down the left side and had almost no sight in his left eye. And he did receive a record payout as a direct result. Probably not being able to walk might be a good reason for not being seen.

Any numbnuts who gets involved in a pub brawl should be locked up. Whether it's because the publican asked them to or not. And the use of the headbutt on anyone should have a mandatory 10 year sentence.

 

[Camo6]

Quote Prince Imperial:

Ok, fair enough. I think we're probably arguing different specific points anyway. Let's both have a beer!

Edit: add quote


Haha! Sorry, I was merely coming to Occam's defence as its one of my most fundamental principles. Of religion and politics I step humbly aside and play no part. (Listen to me getting all poetic, can you tell the beers working?)

 

[BadSeed]

Really? "strangely silent after the court case" and "turned up to court in a wheelchair which he hasn't been seen in since", eh? Well, let's see...WA passed those new mandatory sentencing laws as a direct result of this case, so I'm not sure how 'silent' that is. And the guy has been able to learn to walk with a cane (as of 2012) but was still paralysed down the left side and had almost no sight in his left eye. And he did receive a record payout as a direct result. Probably not being able to walk might be a good reason for not being seen.

Makes no difference to any of my points. The police were in the wrong and deliberately misled the public and used the media to promote their own non-truths.

"Any numbnuts who gets involved in a pub brawl should be locked up. Whether it's because the publican asked them to or not. And the use of the headbutt on anyone should have a mandatory 10 year sentence."

Debatable.
How far would you go to protect your nearest and dearest?

What about a chickenshit who uses weapons on an already subdued victim and calls for his mates to do the same. Hides behind a uniform, deliberately misleads the public?
An armed bully and ringleader of other armed bullies. What should their mandatory sentence be?

People like that have no place in society either and certainly shouldn't be cops.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Whilst I agree we should always read between the lines, I think you're being deliberately contrarian here just for the sake of it.

Lets apply a little slash of Occam's razor.
Whats more likely, two police officers decided to throw their careers down the toilet and face jail time in order beat up a citizen in a public place, or a unstable young man with form for antisocial behavior and radicalized religious beliefs decided he wanted to become a fuctard and maby take out a cop or two in the process?

Why is it so difficult for people to accept that some individuals actually believe what they say they believe?

Sorry Dave, just had to correct some spelling mistakes.

 

[Mardoo]

"I wouldn't do that if I were you, Dave."

 

[Jaded and Bitter]

Yeah sad case this,

A few people have mentioned he wasn't all there, which was likely. I also thought drugs like ice and meth can send someone off like this.

But yeah someone pointed out he may have also been given a push by a radical.

I've heard a bit of debate on the radio over whether the police set him off by well, policing him. Which is ludicrous.

Few years back had a couple of mates who destroyed themselves with ice, when they went psychotic what set them off was trivial. They were going to go psycho anyway, they just needed a reason.

Thinking this may be a similar case, maybe someone gave him a nudge, maybe all by himself. If not IS, maybe some other reason.

 

[wereprawn]

Yeah sad case this,

A few people have mentioned he wasn't all there, which was likely. I also thought drugs like ice and meth can send someone off like this.

But yeah someone pointed out he may have also been given a push by a radical.

I've heard a bit of debate on the radio over whether the police set him off by well, policing him. Which is ludicrous.

Few years back had a couple of mates who destroyed themselves with ice, when they went psychotic what set them off was trivial. They were going to go psycho anyway, they just needed a reason.

Thinking this may be a similar case, maybe someone gave him a nudge, maybe all by himself. If not IS, maybe some other reason.

Agree. But is having an invisible friend who sees all, hears all and tells you kill people not just a tad insane ? Depends..... if you are religious ... no.Just come down to the PS for a chat. If your not religious......absolutely........expect the cops and mental health workers on your doorstep to take you to the psyc ward.