Splashing From Mashtun

[kelbygreen]

Ok my question is does splashing from the mashtun bad??? I know you can get hot side oxidisation but if the wort is going to get boiled wont it boil off all the oxygen anyway?? I have splashed from mashtun, kettle, fermenter and never really noticed any signs of oxidisation but looking to make better beers improving these things may help.

 

[hsb]

I think HSA (hot side aeration) is any stage of brewing where the wort is hot, so out of mash tun too.

 

[np1962]

Not a definitive answer by any means but in my experience it made no difference in beers I have brewed including SABSOSA medal winners.
When I first started AG brewing I had 1 pot that served as HLT and kettle. I sparged into a fermenter then poured this into the pot once I had finished with it as a HLT.
There was definitely some splashing.
Now I am 3V I underlet my Mash and fill tap to tap from Tun to Kettle, no more splashing, still good beer. Better beer? Yes. Hard to tell if the lack of splashing is a factor as my whole brewing technique is a lot better than it was back then.
Nige

 

[kelbygreen]

yes as I say I have not noticed oxidisation but whats HSA do flavour wise? I know there has been heaps of discussions here and heaps say avoid it and some say it doesnt matter in home brew scale so I am prob opening up a whole thread of never do it and its alright but there is no real straight answer I find other then just to reduce the risk.

 

[beerdrinkingbob]

BBR have done some significant experiments, the only time HSA was noticeable was when they took a whisk to the wort, they basically whisked it until it had a thick head. When they did the tasting they could only just make something out different in the beer, pretty much a bee's dick..... Myth busted!!!

 

[sama]

As long as your not frothin ya mash up with a paint stirer stuck in a drill etc. then it aint a huge concern.A bit of splashing here and there is nothing to be concerned about.Heres a good podcast that helped alleviate my fears.HSA PODCAST

 

[hsb]

Isn't HSA about shelf life? The O2 you put in comes out and turns your beer into cardboard quicker than it would have. Something about lipids and fairies, that's all I can recall. If you can avoid splashing, might as well.

 

[beerbog]

As a lot of BIABers would testify, when pouring in the squeezed out runnings of the drained bag, there's quite alot of splashing. My beers still taste great. :beerbang:

 

[TasChris]

I would have thought that any oxygen that is adsorbed by the wort pre boil would be driven out during the boil before it could have too much impact on flavour.

Cheers
Chris

 

[kelbygreen]

that was my main question tas but it was a question about all types of HSA. I mashed in a esky and simply poured the wort into the pot. Also for people that BIAB that pour into a cube post boil and leave a bit in the bottom I guess its the same maybe worse. But since I got a 19lt pot and want 21lts out I sometimes rack off and with BIAB and hops seem to get heaps of trub and high gravity wort left in the pot (maybe 4 lts sometimes) so I clip some voile to a bucket and pour into that the hops and most of the trub gets stuck in the voile and then I top up to the desired volume and boil for a few mins to be safe. the voile and bucket are sanitised before hand (sometimes if I remember). so some splashing there.

 

[chiller]

that was my main question tas but it was a question about all types of HSA. I mashed in a esky and simply poured the wort into the pot. Also for people that BIAB that pour into a cube post boil and leave a bit in the bottom I guess its the same maybe worse. But since I got a 19lt pot and want 21lts out I sometimes rack off and with BIAB and hops seem to get heaps of trub and high gravity wort left in the pot (maybe 4 lts sometimes) so I clip some voile to a bucket and pour into that the hops and most of the trub gets stuck in the voile and then I top up to the desired volume and boil for a few mins to be safe. the voile and bucket are sanitised before hand (sometimes if I remember). so some splashing there.

HSA is a total non issue with homebrewing and even microbreweries have to really abuse the hot side of their process to cause a problem. If you are transferring thousands of litres of hot wort and dropping it many feet into a boiler in a mega brewery system you certainly run a real risk of oxidation products.

 

[Tony]

I will quote a brewer from a very respectable local micro here........... Dont worry about splashing... HSA is a myth.

He told us that when talking about his wirlpool vessel.

I think anything pre boil is generally not a problem as long as you dont really smash it up....... when you boil it all the oxygen comes out anyway

I keep it to a minimum for the sake of good practice but i dont think it hirts too much

cheers

 

[felten]

It oxidises compounds that are carried through to the finished beer. Avoid splashing as much as you can but if you don't have a choice then, like everyone else said, it will make little difference.

 

[kelbygreen]

yeah sweet. I do try to minimise it but its hard sometimes. I was never really worried about it but thought id get some info on it

 

[Pennywise]

I will quote a brewer from a very respectable local micro here........... Dont worry about splashing... HSA is a myth.

He told us that when talking about his wirlpool vessel.

I think anything pre boil is generally not a problem as long as you dont really smash it up....... when you boil it all the oxygen comes out anyway

I keep it to a minimum for the sake of good practice but i dont think it hirts too much

cheers

That's interesting. I hope I'm remembering correctly here, but I remember TB saying something about oxidation & hsa happens because the wort was splashed while hot, not just during the splashing. Along the lines of what felon was saying.
Not sure I keep my beers long enough to worry about it to be honest, well most of them anyway

 

[kelbygreen]

so it only really matters for storage?? that should be fine as not many of my kegs last longer then a week once carbed so no storage happens here

 

[Feldon]

From 'Brewing Techniques' magazine, Nov/Dec 1993...

If air is introduced during wort production--in other words, on the hot side --these substances will be oxidized and later, in the finished beer, they can turn around and give up their oxygen to alcohols that were created during fermentation. An oxidized alcohol is an aldehyde, and aldehydes are the bad guys that are responsible for all the stale, old-beer flavors we have all encountered in far too many imported brews.
and...

Now for the good news: Brewpubs and home brewers don't have nearly as much to be concerned about as shipping breweries because they keep their beer close to home rather than sending them out into the cruel world where they can suffer all kinds of insults. Storage temperature has a lot to do with how fast beer oxidizes. So does agitation. There really is something to the old saying that beer doesn't travel well. Getting knocked around in the back of a truck does take a toll on packaged beer, and temperature is an even bigger factor. But even at low temperatures, kept absolutely still, beer will oxidize eventually. That is why the best plan is to store it cold and drink it quick.

Full article available online at : http://www.brewingtechniques.com/library/b...r.html#aeration

 

[donburke]

From 'Brewing Techniques' magazine, Nov/Dec 1993...

If air is introduced during wort production--in other words, on the hot side --these substances will be oxidized and later, in the finished beer, they can turn around and give up their oxygen to alcohols that were created during fermentation. An oxidized alcohol is an aldehyde, and aldehydes are the bad guys that are responsible for all the stale, old-beer flavors we have all encountered in far too many imported brews.
and...

Now for the good news: Brewpubs and home brewers don't have nearly as much to be concerned about as shipping breweries because they keep their beer close to home rather than sending them out into the cruel world where they can suffer all kinds of insults. Storage temperature has a lot to do with how fast beer oxidizes. So does agitation. There really is something to the old saying that beer doesn't travel well. Getting knocked around in the back of a truck does take a toll on packaged beer, and temperature is an even bigger factor. But even at low temperatures, kept absolutely still, beer will oxidize eventually. That is why the best plan is to store it cold and drink it quick.

Full article available online at : http://www.brewingtechniques.com/library/b...r.html#aeration

this might be handy if trying to clone one of those commercial beers, HSA might be the secret to that "authentic taste"

 

[kelbygreen]

alright well thats some good info there feldon has heaps of other interesting stuff in there to.