Re-creating 9,000 Year Old Beer By Mashing Bread

[BjornJ]

Interesting read, a homebrewer and paleontologist wanted to recreate beer how it was possibly made 9,000 years ago..


http://www.brewingtechniques.com/library/b.../hitchcock.html




Bjorn

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

Interesting read, a homebrewer and paleontologist wanted to recreate beer how it was possibly made 9,000 years ago..


http://www.brewingtechniques.com/library/b.../hitchcock.html

View attachment 38134


Bjorn

May be Fritz and his mate should have gone to modern Europe first as they still use this method now ! Google "Gira" recipe. Nothing new about Fitz's ancient discovered beer.
Gb

 

[zoidbergmerc]

May be Fritz and his mate should have gone to modern Europe first as they still use this method now ! Google "Gira" recipe. Nothing new about Fitz's ancient discovered beer.
Gb

My house mate makes bread from my used yeast and spent grains. I thought we was just being a retard but it's actually really nice.

I found this pretty neat site on beer history http://www.beerchurch.com/Default.aspx?tabid=1885

also, while Dad was poking through grandpa's old library he found a few "How to brew books" and also some information that leads me to believe that on of my ancestors, Alexander Nowell the Dean of St Paul's in the 1560s, invented bottle conditioning by accident while fishing and leaving one of his bottles of beer behind to return few days later to find it was fizzier and tastier. Why no one picked them up before him has me beat though.

Bottled beers were commonplace by the 17th century for the well off who wished to drink outside of public inns, or who wanted to take a beer with them when fishing. Such as the famous story of Alexander Nowell, the Dean of St Paul's, who, in 1568, left his bottled beer by the river bank, and upon returning a few days later discovered the bottle opened with a bang and that the contents were very tasty. But while the middle and upper classes could indulge themselves with such expensive luxuries, the ordinary folk continued to drink their beer served direct from the cask

 

[rendo]

very interesting read, thanks Bjorn

Interesting read, a homebrewer and paleontologist wanted to recreate beer how it was possibly made 9,000 years ago..




Bjorn

 

[mje1980]

My wife's background is russian, and a few times we have had something like beer made from fermenting bread and sugar. It has sultanas in the bottle, i think for carbonation. Quite drinkable, but not better than vodka. Bit of a novelty really.

 

[felten]

I remember my dad telling me about when he was posted to Kuwait ~30 years ago, he would make rice and raisin wine from stuff like brown rice extract with the raisins for wild yeast, it sounded pretty terrible (and also illegal there AFAIK). They also made a distilled spirit called flash, which was probably more useful as a paint stripper than a beverage.

Slightly OT but interesting none the less.

 

[peterhop]

I tried that 9,000 yr old recipe once. I took a few shortcuts - didn't make the baked cakes, was deliberately casual about sanitation. It made a malty tasting wort. but wild bugs took over during fermentation.

 

[notung]

My wife's background is russian, and a few times we have had something like beer made from fermenting bread and sugar. It has sultanas in the bottle, i think for carbonation. Quite drinkable, but not better than vodka. Bit of a novelty really.

That sounds a little bit like kvass maybe? I bought a slab of Czech kvass at a Cheaper Buy Miles in St Albans last year and found it to be really drinkable stuff.

 

[mje1980]

Da

 

[zoidbergmerc]

maybe 9000 years ago wild yeasts and bugs didn't taste so bad...

 

[Florian]

When I was a kid I remember that most of my family in Germany referred to beer as liquid bread. They would ask for someone to bring them a liquid bread, and they would also use this as an excuse if they wanted one more and the wife or whoever didn't agree. It's got the same nutritional value as a slice of bread they would argue.

Florian

 

[manticle]

maybe 9000 years ago wild yeasts and bugs didn't taste so bad...

Wild/uncontrolled yeasts are still used today in various Belgian brews as well as some English and French ciders.

To my palate some of them are incredibly complex and delicious.

Maybe back 9000 years ago people had less of a one eyed opinion about how things were 'supposed' to taste?

@mje1980 - also sounds a bit like the finnish mead called sima ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sima_(mead) )

 

[peterhop]

Maybe back 9000 years ago people had less of a one eyed opinion about how things were 'supposed' to taste?

That might be so, but it does not mean the old taste was better - beer made without hops anyone ? 9,000 years ago, and until fairly recently, there was no trade in beer, so there was not much choice in flavour. And there are only some parts of the world where you can (could?) leave wort uncovered and get it infected with a conjenial bug.

 

[manticle]

Not saying one or the other is better. In fact I think that was my point - thousands of years of fermenting grains and cereals and other things would have produced a huge diversity of flavours and still does to this day. There's no point trying to draw an arbitrary line and say beer from any particular time was/is better.

People are interested in old traditions and methods and those old traditions and methods have informed much of what is done today (including the mistakes that were made).

I'd also dispute your statement that there are only some parts of the world where you can find congenial bugs. Sure there are limited commercial examples of spontaneous fermentation but read something like the babblebelt forum to see that there are people playing with ambient spontaneous ferments all over the shop.

Also beer made without hops was also often bittered with other herbs so it's pretty hard to can something we're unlikely to ever try (unless we re-create it using old ingredients and methods).

 

[peterhop]

I was wrong. My reply to your post was a bit of a muddied lake - I think we think the same. Thanks for the reference to babblebelt - I had not heard of that.

I make sour breads. Here too, as you say, people have developed a huge diversity of styles from simple basic ingredients plus wild or store-bought yeasts. I haven't tried making sour beer yet.

--------------------

Here is a recipe for kvass, the drink made from bread, which I am going to try.

 

[manticle]

No worries Peter. One of the things that excites me so much about beer is the sheer diversity of beverages that exist and have existed and the base level it's been made on throughout history. It's the ultimate DIY craft and HB carries on that tradition.

I'm ageing some sour beers atm but using shop bought 'bugs' at this point for the souring. I do have a wild yeast (I think) at my place that doesn't make beer revolting - just strange (even after months) and would need some encouragement to make something worthwhile - fruit, plenty of secondary ageing and maybe some extra brettanomyces from an orval bottle or two.

Babblebelt was referred to me by someone else here and it's a pretty good source of info for all things belgian and all things sour. That blogspot you linked to is also great and he's responsive to questions.

 

[flattop]

One of the reasons beer and wine were popular in the early and middle ages was it was more sanitary to drink that the river water which was often polluted. I guess the fermentation and alcohol cleaned up some of the nasties.
When the main dome of the Duomo church in Florence was constructed the workers were given 2 parts wine, 1 part water to drink... they were probably working about 15 stories up on scaffholding.