Pilsner And Ale Base Malt

[dr K]

There we have it then.
Both TF MO and Halcyon are able (batch to batch to batch) to produce a paler beer than Weyermann Pilsener.
Bairds Pale Ales are able to produce a beer as light as Weyermann Pilsener.
It has been mentioned that varietal differences in the strain of barley may be more important. Of course nitrogen levels vary (bout as much as EBC really).
Australian Pilsener Malt made from Gairdiner (or Sloop or Schooner or Franklin or whatever), is it going to be markedly different from Ale Malt made from the same grain, I bet not, and I can bet its the same hopper as well.

K

 

[Tim]

With the JW malts I found that the JW trad ale malt does not clear as well as the JW Pilsner malt. I also had a small but detectable DMS poroblem when using the JW trad ale. I think that there is only 1 ebc or so difference between them?

I started using JW Pilsner malt as my base malt for all styles after Gerard told me that was what he used at Paddy's (back around 2003/2004). It also happens to work out the most economical as well.

 

[mje1980]

I love to use Maris Otter for my bitters, but have, and will happily use pils in them, as well as blonde ales, and APA's. Just add a touch of amber,brown, or choc. Still makes great beer. I doubt i could pick the difference taste wise, unless maybe it was 100% base malt in each beer.

 

[///]

Theres quite a few of those funny things with those weird paper page things that will deliver all those answers and more. There is a varietal difference via the malt strain, technical difference via the malting process and a specification difference (colour, WK index, total extract etc etc).

Rather than ill-informed opinion, may as well start with the best .... Malting and Brewing Science

 

[T.D.]

I'll have to take your word for it dr k as I've never tried it. However These are the specs from the Craftbrewer website. This taken into account it shouldn't produce a wort any lighter than their Maris Otter.

Fawcett's
Golden Promise 5-7 EBC
Halcyon 4.5-7 EBC
Maris Otter 4.5-7 EBC

Baird's
Golden Promise 5-7 EBC
Perle 5-7 EBC
Maris Otter 5-7 EBC

Barrett Burston
Ale 5-7 EBC
Galaxy Pilsner 3-4 EBC
Pale Pilsner 3-4 EBC

Weyermann
Pilsner 3-5 EBC
Premium Pilsner 2-3 EBC
Bohemian Pilsner 3-4 EBC


Warren -

Do these numbers look a little strange to anyone else? From my experience GP produces much lighter-coloured wort than MO...

I had a quick look on the Bairds website and it quotes 5-7 as the EBC for their "Pale" malt. That must be why Ross has quoted it as being the same for each type, but I would guess that GP has a lower EBC than MO in reality...

 

[warrenlw63]

Rather than ill-informed opinion

Why ill-informed Scotty? I'm sure most of the information offered up is by the homebrewer's practical experiences with the grain (well at least I hope it is). It is after all a "homebrewing" forum.

Warren -

 

[warrenlw63]

Do these numbers look a little strange to anyone else?

Hey T.D. these were taken from the Craftbrewer website... Surely they're not wrong?

Warren -

 

[T.D.]

Hey T.D. these were taken from the Craftbrewer website... Surely they're not wrong?

Warren -

Couldn't possibly be Warren.

 

[Bribie G]

Theres quite a few of those funny things with those weird paper page things that will deliver all those answers and more. There is a varietal difference via the malt strain, technical difference via the malting process and a specification difference (colour, WK index, total extract etc etc).

Rather than ill-informed opinion, may as well start with the best .... Malting and Brewing Science

Golden. I've bookmarked it and will settle down for a good read when there's nothing on TV which is most of the time nowadays :icon_cheers:

 

[THE DRUNK ARAB]

Here is a beer brewed with 100% TF MO just for interest sake.

C&B
TDA

 

[brendo]

Here is a beer brewed with 100% TF MO just for interest sake.

C&B
TDA

that looks great... feeling kinda thirsty now...

Brendo

 

[///]

Why ill-informed Scotty? I'm sure most of the information offered up is by the homebrewer's practical experiences with the grain (well at least I hope it is). It is after all a "homebrewing" forum.

Warren -

Sorry, nup. The information in Briggs covers brewing , they make no difference between home or professional. The information within is backwards compatible if I make take words from a former profession. And whilst I continue this rant, the last time I looked there are only 2 brewers large enough to sit behind screens, the rest of the 120 or so breweries with staff getting paid have more than practical input into the exercise and can draw from this experience. i.e. they lift the heavy crap like everyone else.

The focus of home brewers is wort production. This is something that can be measured via basic tools (a hydrometer) and other testing (sensory analysis). Other aspects of downstream issues such as DO, Total PU's are not easily tested and are outside of the current thread. The questions asked were based on grist bill composition and hence wort production, here Briggs will give a chock of information.

And yes Warren, I did think that response of yours pretty rude.

Scotty

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

Do these numbers look a little strange to anyone else? From my experience GP produces much lighter-coloured wort than MO...

I had a quick look on the Bairds website and it quotes 5-7 as the EBC for their "Pale" malt. That must be why Ross has quoted it as being the same for each type, but I would guess that GP has a lower EBC than MO in reality...

I have found GP (Bairds) to be a deeper more inviting golden colour.MO is lighter in my opinion and much less character in a single malt beer..
GB

 

[dr K]

Why ill-informed Scotty? I'm sure most of the information offered up is by the homebrewer's practical experiences with the grain (well at least I hope it is). It is after all a "homebrewing" forum.

A "homebrewing" forum. Exactly and exactly why ill-informed messages are propogated.

An English Ale Malt is very different from a German Pilsener malt, very different varieties, different nitrogen levels, different malting processes, all as one would expect ans they are aimed at two very different styles of beer and methods of production of that beer (mash -wise). Both will be very different from Australian malts.
Traditionally British barley has a higher protein level and is more highly modified than European malts. A higher modification enables a very simple mashing routine and a higher protein will generally mean a higher diastatic power and a greater ability to use use low enzyme adjuncts.

Assuming that JW Trad Ale and Pilsener are really all that different (they would both come come from the same malting barley with roughly the same specs) perhaps the Trad Ale is kilned a tad higher or a tad longer then it seems odd that one would produce all that different a beer than the other, even used 100% the final wort colours are both within range of being identical, clarity (based on grain selection alone) should be identical and DMS if anything should be higher in the Pilsener Malt than the Ale, yet we find quite different results being quoted by practical home brewers.

In the end it is a matter of personal choice and personal taste, if you are happy with the beer you are brewing then really that is all that counts..

K

 

[warrenlw63]

Sorry, nup. {clipped for brevity} of information.

And yes Warren, I did think that response of yours pretty rude.

Scotty

Or ill-informed? You may say it was pretty rude but I didn't elude to others espousing ill-informed opinions.

Warren -

 

[Tim]

I was just speaking in regards to the JW malts from my own experience. I found the JW Pils to be more versitile. I cannot comment on other varieties as i have not tried them.