New England/Zealand IPA recipe critique

[NeilArge]

G'day
I was lucky enough to try some of Bellwoods Brewing beers while in Toronto last year and while I was impressed with all their beers I was blown away by their New England-style IPA. That got me interested in brewing one up... Below is my variation on the Treehouse 'Julius' clone that was in the October 2016 BYO mag. I've changed the hopping around to suit what I have at hand, and I don't have any Hopshot either, hence the big dose of Columbus at 60 min. I plan to dry hop with Cascade, Riwaka and Motueka as well. Look orright?
Cheers
ToG
4.36 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (Thomas Fawcett) (5.9 EBC) Grain 3 82.0 %
0.39 kg Oats, Malted (Thomas Fawcett) (3.9 EBC) Grain 4 7.4 %
0.12 kg Carapils (Briess) (3.0 EBC) Grain 5 2.3 %
0.12 kg Honey Malt (49.3 EBC) Grain 6 2.3 %
0.12 kg Oats, Flaked (2.0 EBC) Grain 7 2.3 %
0.20 kg Turbinado (19.7 EBC) Sugar 8 3.7 %
46.52 g Columbus/Tomahawk/Zeus (CTZ) [14.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 9 68.0 IBUs
57.00 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 10 0.0 IBUs
57.00 g Riwaka [5.25 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 11 0.0 IBUs
28.00 g Motueka [7.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 12 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg British Ale Yeast (Wyeast Labs #1098) [124.21 ml]
4.00 g Calcium Chloride (Mash 60.0 mins) Water Agent 1 -
4.00 g Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Mash 60.0 mins) Water Agent 2 -

 

[sp0rk]

You have honey malt?

 

[timmi9191]

i would fwh the columbus.

and up the motueka. mmmmm motueka :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2:

 

[NeilArge]

You have honey malt?

Heh heh... yes I do! I bought a few hundred grams last year when in Toronto. Lovely stuff!

 

[NeilArge]

i would fwh the columbus.

and up the motueka. mmmmm motueka :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2:

Thanks Timmi. What proportion of it would you FWH?

 

[timmi9191]

100%. columbus is superb done as FWH, IMO

 

[Dan Pratt]

I've recently made a NE IPA and I can give a little advice.

Back off the bittering charge, 68ibu is way too much, aim for 35-40ibu.

Double your whirlpool hops, at two stages. Flame out and then again below 75c.

Forget the carapils and double the oats to ~ 18-20% of the malt bill.

My next neipa will be based around trilium but 68 ibu.....

 

[technobabble66]

For the uninitiated, can either of you describe the elements the oats bring to an IPA?
I'm rapidly becoming a big fan of oats (currently fermenting an Oaty Saison), and I've been thinking of doing an Oaty Red IPA (maybe tomorrow [emoji6]) so I was wondering if it does anything different in an IPA I should be considering.
I'm assuming it adds what I perceive as a grainy earthy vanilla element plus the "slick" mouthfeel. Sound right? Anything else? Any particular impact on the hops?

Edit: FWH FTW!!

 

[NeilArge]

For the uninitiated, can either of you describe the elements the oats bring to an IPA?
I'm rapidly becoming a big fan of oats (currently fermenting an Oaty Saison), and I've been thinking of doing an Oaty Red IPA (maybe tomorrow [emoji6]) so I was wondering if it does anything different in an IPA I should be considering.
I'm assuming it adds what I perceive as a grainy earthy vanilla element plus the "slick" mouthfeel. Sound right? Anything else? Any particular impact on the hops?

Edit: FWH FTW!!

This is the first time that I've used oat malt and oats of any sort in an IPA so I can't really answer this question. I'm guessing the flaked oats and the malt will add some extra body and mouthfeel. One thing I would say about oat malt - mill it separately to the rest of the grain bill and mill it twice. It's hard to crack properly.

 

[NeilArge]

I've recently made a NE IPA and I can give a little advice.

Back off the bittering charge, 68ibu is way too much, aim for 35-40ibu.

Double your whirlpool hops, at two stages. Flame out and then again below 75c.

Forget the carapils and double the oats to ~ 18-20% of the malt bill.

My next neipa will be based around trilium but 68 ibu.....

Thanks Pratty. Where else would you get the bittering from in a c. 70IBU beer?
Cheers

 

[Dan Pratt]

^ whirlpool hops at 95c will get good ibu contributions when done for 20-30mins and about 6g/L

 

[Dan Pratt]

The oats is all about mouthfeel, unlike a stout or porter which creates a slickness. This style it softens the hop kick with a smooth fluffy mouthfeel.

Important to make the beer calium forward at 125-150ppm and half that for sulphate, its one of the stark differences from normal IPA water profiles.

 

[NeilArge]

^ whirlpool hops at 95c will get good ibu contributions when done for 20-30mins and about 6g/L

Thanks. I might try a FWH and flameout combo to get up there. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Haydos13]

Yep minimal bittering charge, huge 2 stage whirlpool at flameout and 70ish C, then the same amount again dry. I'll be enjoying one tonight, they go down a treat when super fresh.

 

[NeilArge]

Yep minimal bittering charge, huge 2 stage whirlpool at flameout and 70ish C, then the same amount again dry. I'll be enjoying one tonight, they go down a treat when super fresh.

Thanks Haydos. Yeah, I should have read the BYO article more closely. It suggested a 20-odd IBU to start with.. I went with something similar with FWH, then a double charge while whirlpooling. It's fermenting away steadily as I type. Need to up the sparge a bit to make up for so much wort loss due to the hop dosage!