My Opinion Is That Rudd Is A Ferral

[MarkBastard]

So the majority are idiots because they don't agree with you. Hmm - interesting concept.

They don't agree with me because they're ******* idiots.

 

[Dave70]

They don't agree with me because they're ******* idiots.

touche...

 

[pk.sax]

which I guess shows that the majority of Australians really are ******* idiots.

I wouldn't pretend to know who and what of it, but I credit the ALP with trying to tax the mines and the 'Australian people' - greedy shareholders scaring the million rednecks (unfair to actual miners but the downstream mining fed jobs) of the panic and fear that got it watered down and rejected.
As an immigrant not that long ago, one of the best selling points was, the society is quite equitable, most of the people earn about the same, live in the same sort of conditions etc. I know it's not exactly like that, but the vultures tic profiteering of mining companies is adding fuckall to the Australian nation and it's people and the only attempt made to tax it and put that money into building Australia was viciously opposed by the Libs. That is what I define as shallow politics.

 

[MarkBastard]

I'd argue that mining lobby groups brought down Kevin Rudd. To some extent interest groups sacked the leader of Australia.

 

[Kevman]

They don't agree with me because they're ******* idiots.

More likely they don't agree with you because you're the ******* idiot.

 

[Liam_snorkel]

OOH sick burn.

 

[MarkBastard]

Didn't see that one coming!

 

[tavas]

, but the vultures tic profiteering of mining companies is adding fuckall to the Australian nation

How so?

 

[peas_and_corn]

There's a well known economic principle that any economy with a strong mining industry will inevitably have a suffering manufacturing industry. This is principally caused by a rising exchange rate, but also due to the skills hole created by the industry. Personally I'm amazed that Australia makes anything, and it's a testament that what we make is good, competing on the quality side of things as opposed to price (which... well, is impossible). That said, wages for people in the mining industry are quite healthy and there is a lot to be said of the positive economic impact of people merely spending their pay packets.

 

[Liam_snorkel]

The mining industry employs a whopping 2% of our workforce. I read that somewhere, it must be true.
One of my mates flies in and out, and spends most of his cash on overseas holidays.

 

[pk.sax]

I'm not saying mining is bad, far from it. Where I work, for example, makes a fair buck from flying miners and related flying. That also feeds into the caterers and ground staff that are employed, the accommodation providers etc.
The main problem is that due to the high wage levels created by these flow on mining effects Aussie manufacturing finds it difficult to find and retain skilled personnel. If they pay at similar levels as mining, they are stung by the high resource costs due to the overseas competition for those resources. That is why I liked the idea of a strong mining tax, it will allow the government to subsidise manufacturing and education to retain skills organically. Oh well..... Vote the greens again!?!

 

[Liam_snorkel]

could someone explain to me why we can't tax the shit out of the miners & set up a sovereign wealth fund which invests largely overseas, to keep the dollar down to a level where manufacturing and tourism are competitive globally again?

 

[pk.sax]

I hear the Chinese have a sovereign fund made from the trillions worth of cheap exports they make that has been buying out foreign enterprise in distress at times.

 

[MarkBastard]

I hear the Chinese have a sovereign fund made from the trillions worth of cheap exports they make that has been buying out foreign enterprise in distress at times.

Yeah they own a substantial chunk of the capitalist world, those crazy socialists. Funny thing isn't it. Free markets and all that.

 

[super_simian]

Yeah they own a substantial chunk of the capitalist world, those crazy socialists. Funny thing isn't it. Free markets and all that.

Socialist (well, communist) in name only; like any good (evil) regime.

 

[tavas]

could someone explain to me why we can't tax the shit out of the miners & set up a sovereign wealth fund which invests largely overseas, to keep the dollar down to a level where manufacturing and tourism are competitive globally again?

And what would the miners use for exploration and investment capital? Bottle tops?

Same reason you can't tax the shit out of people - they'd pack up and go elsewhere and then you'd be left with nothing.

The mining tax was never about setting up a sovereign fund. It was a cash grab to get the budget into the black. It was set to kick in at profits over $75m. Not all companies make over $75m, and not every year. If you wanted an investment fund, you would be better to find a sustainable source of income to invest in, such as a portion of GST or another of the broad base taxes.

Or perhaps the Gov could read the Henry Tax Review and attempt more than just 3 of the 138 items recommeded.

 

[tavas]

I'm not saying mining is bad, far from it. Where I work, for example, makes a fair buck from flying miners and related flying. That also feeds into the caterers and ground staff that are employed, the accommodation providers etc.
The main problem is that due to the high wage levels created by these flow on mining effects Aussie manufacturing finds it difficult to find and retain skilled personnel. If they pay at similar levels as mining, they are stung by the high resource costs due to the overseas competition for those resources. That is why I liked the idea of a strong mining tax, it will allow the government to subsidise manufacturing and education to retain skills organically. Oh well..... Vote the greens again!?!

I certainly don't doubt that mining creates an issue with poaching resources from other sectors, but there is about 1,000,000 people employed in manufacturing in Oz vs around 130,000 people in mining, so you can't blame it all on mining. There are other factors (some related such as strong aussie dollar, although mining companies get hit by that as well) such as raw material costs, manufacturing costs and consumer demand. Mining related manufacturing is a growth business. For example, in Europe the investment into the car industry is about $300/person vs about $20/person here. We all complain how crap Holden and Fords are, but the flow on effect from that industry is massive.

If mining companies make 10% profit which goes overseas, it means 90% of the cash flow has remained in Oz through wages, taxes, spending etc, with a multiplier of 3-5x towards the economy. Better than a Woolworths or Harvey Norman model to buy cheap imports (and send a majority of cashflow overseas) and rebrand them for sale in Oz.

I'd actually like to see less taxes on everything and more efficient spending by the Gov (either Labor or Liberal). The amount of waste and wasted opportunity is crimminal.

 

[bum]

they'd pack up and go elsewhere and then you'd be left with nothing.

And they can go mine wherever the minerals aren't?

GOOD PLAN!

 

[tavas]

And they can go mine wherever the minerals aren't?

GOOD PLAN!

Plenty of minerals in places OUTSIDE of Australia.

Miners work here because its low sovereign risk, stable gov, good skill level. But tax the crap out of them, and there's other options.

 

[bum]

And no one else would want to mine it if they left? No one wants to make the billions of dollars?

What a load of shit.