Must Bottle Today, But Not Sure If Finished!?

[Wonderwoman]

ok, at the risk of getting ridiculed for wanting to bottle without being sure fermentation is finished...

I have a beer which HAS to be bottled today. It's been made for my partner's grandpa who lives in central NSW - we're in Melbourne. My partner's parents are leaving early tomorrow morning to go visit his grandpa so we need to get it bottled today so they can take it with them, otherwise our next chance to get it to him wont be till xmas. Before you suggest sending different beer, he wants this specific beer which he's tried from a previous batch. Unfortunately we only got 2 weeks notice to make the beer, so we're cutting it a bit fine to let the fermentation finish.

the recipe is:
coopers draught kit
cascade golden harvest kit
100g crystal malt
US-05 yeast
vol = 22L
OG - 1050 (16/8)

SG readings for the last few days:
26/8 1020
27/8 1017
28/8 1014
today 1014 (but only ~12 h since the last SG reading)

The previous batch was 21L, OG 1055, FG 1013 (after 13 days)

so my questions are:
1/ should the FG be higher, lower or the same than the first batch which had a smaller volume?
2/ do you think it's finished or is 12 hour between SG readings not enough?
3/ if it's not finished, it can't be far off - could I bulk prime it using less sugar to avoid bottle bombs and if so how would I calculated the amount of priming sugar to use?

edit: I bottle in glass

 

[muckey]

same recipe should give around the same FG

sounds like it maty still have a point or 2 to go so slightly underpriming would be advisable ( I keg so not sure how much under)

I would advise those who are transporting and storing to keep the bottles somewhere cool and be prepared to check the carbonation levels regularly to make sure they dont turn into problems

hope that helps a little. others with more bottling experience will probably have more info

 

[katzke]

Given your scenario I would bottle it but with strict instructions.

1st tell them they need to give you more time to brew a beer for them.

2nd bottle as normal and tell them they need to test it at whatever intervals you are happy with. Then they need to put all of it in a fridge to slow or stop fermentation. You can always keep a sample to test to see how far down it goes so you would know if bombs were a possibility.

I am not up on my priming now that I keg. Not sure how much 1 point or so will make in the level of carbonation so if someone else says to reduce the sugar and gives a figure I would go with it.

 

[Cocko]

The fact you're thinking about blowing up you partners Pa is awesome...

Xmas is only a few months off, imagine how good it will be then!!

Anyway, tell him to keep in a cool place!

 

[Wonderwoman]

thanks for the advice guys

I've just realised I have a few PET bottles hanging around... I might only fill them and leave the rest in the fermenter for a bit longer to be bottled in a week or two and delivered at xmas.

 

[BungalowBill]

ok, at the risk of getting ridiculed for wanting to bottle without being sure fermentation is finished...

I have a beer which HAS to be bottled today. It's been made for my partner's grandpa who lives in central NSW - we're in Melbourne. My partner's parents are leaving early tomorrow morning to go visit his grandpa so we need to get it bottled today so they can take it with them, otherwise our next chance to get it to him wont be till xmas. Before you suggest sending different beer, he wants this specific beer which he's tried from a previous batch. Unfortunately we only got 2 weeks notice to make the beer, so we're cutting it a bit fine to let the fermentation finish.

the recipe is:
coopers draught kit
cascade golden harvest kit
100g crystal malt
US-05 yeast
vol = 22L
OG - 1050 (16/8)

SG readings for the last few days:
26/8 1020
27/8 1017
28/8 1014
today 1014 (but only ~12 h since the last SG reading)

The previous batch was 21L, OG 1055, FG 1013 (after 13 days)

so my questions are:
1/ should the FG be higher, lower or the same than the first batch which had a smaller volume?
2/ do you think it's finished or is 12 hour between SG readings not enough?
3/ if it's not finished, it can't be far off - could I bulk prime it using less sugar to avoid bottle bombs and if so how would I calculated the amount of priming sugar to use?

edit: I bottle in glass

 

[BungalowBill]

Hi, Just a thought , if you were worrying about bottles exploding etc, why dont you put it in PET bottles, not the same as good things come in glass, but might be safer and you can get them back a xmas time.
BB

 

[Wonderwoman]

Hi, Just a thought , if you were worrying about bottles exploding etc, why dont you put it in PET bottles, not the same as good things come in glass, but might be safer and you can get them back a xmas time.
BB

we must have been thinking about PET's at the same time, but I posted it just before you

 

[buttersd70]

easy answers first...

1. for 2 recipes with the same ingredients, the one with the lower volume will have the higher gravity.
2. I don't think 12 hours is enough for the first steady reading. For second or subsequent ones, then you could consider it OK.
3. you could, but it can be awkward to work out, and extra care has to be taken....there is a method of bottling early deliberately, to achieve the carb; most people that do this would likely base the time to bottle on a fast ferment test (like what I mentioned in your other thread), experience, and the knowledge that they can correct any miscalculation once it's in the bottle...something that grandpa will no doubt not be able to do.

Leaving the crystal out of it, for a moment, I woud expect this to finish anywhere between 1010 and 1014, depending on the fermentability of the extracts and the yeast health....if you add dextrose (mentaly, not physicaly) to the recipe at the start, at the rate you want for 2.4 vols of co2, this would be 136g with 20C ferment temp, and would increase OG by 2 points. By logical extension, that means when you add your priming sugar at the end, it will raise your FG by 2 points....so, with a beer that is proved to finish at 1012, you could bottle at 1014 instead of priming. But you better be damn sure it's going to finish at 1012 . If there is more potential for a drop in sg, and as I said, in this case it could go down as low as 1010. If it did drop to 1010 in the bottle, then that means that it's got twice as much potential fermentable sugar than you need to prime it, and it would work out to 3.9volumes of co2 if it were to drop to 1010....pretty risky, there.

I've discounted the crystal, which of course would add a little bit on to the FG...but it's really hard to say exactly how much. If this was going to go to another brewer, I'd say go ahead without any priming sugar, but make them aware that they'll need to check, and possibly vent and reseal....as it's not, I wouldn't send it, certainly not in glass. fwiw, I'd have to say let granpa know you're sorry, but you didn't get enough notice, and you'll give it to him at christmas - as someone said, itll be a better drop by then, anyway.

He might be dissapointed, but pulling a 3 inch shard of glass out of grandma will dissapoint him more.

edit: re the PETS, do that. Send it unprimed (imo) - that way, if it overcarbs, he can vent them, cos with pets it's easy. And in the event that it is finished, and doesnt' carb up, he can toddle off to the local supermarket and get a bag of drops...even grandpa should be able to unscrew the cap, drop in a drop or 2, rescrew the cap.

 

[Nick JD]

Don't do this but it's something I found out by accident (read: by being an idiot).

I did a brew a few months back (I bottle into PET) and had mis-timed the thing. I started washing all my empty bottles out and ended up with 21L when I needed 23.5.

Then I spied a 2.4L orange juice bottle!

My thoughts were to bottle into the orange juice bottle, and then when I have a couple more free bottles, to transfer it into something that'd hold carbonation pressure. But ya know what? The orange juice bottle held pressure...

...to a certain point. Then, if you put your ear against the cap, you could hear a tiny little hissing noise. So it came with its own pressure relief valve aka, a bad seal.

I drank it the other day - wasn't carbed up to where I like it, but it was fully drinkable.

 

[Wonderwoman]

thanks butters - I agree that grandpa is not going to be able to handle lots of instructions about checking the carbonation, so I'll go with your suggestion.

bottling now... everyone wish me luck!

 

[AussieJosh]

i always bottle 5 or so brews in pet every batch! just in case the worse happens and all the glass blows up! my next brew i will be moving to 19l keg. ill bottle the remaining in pet and one in glass. so i can keep it for a year or so to age...

 

[RobboMC]

One of the less explained benefits of PET is that you can FEEL the pressure in the bottle.
An easy solution to this dilema would be to put a couple in PET and then pressure test with your thumb
every day. If the PET starts to go rock hard then it's time to uncap the glass ones before they blow.

 

[Wonderwoman]

a quick update....

so on the 29th of august I filled 6 x 740ml PET's and put one carbonation drop in each against Butters recommendation to use no priming sugar - I thought one is not going to overcarb it too much and if it is finished then one drop will provide at least some carbonation so grandpa doesn't have to faff around with adding more sugar.

The rest of the batch was racked to secondary and left for a couple more weeks before bottling. The SG did not drop any further than 1014 - *sigh of relief* that I don't have to worry about grandpa's bottles exploding...