Long Beer Line Requirements

[komodo]

Guys,

I'm in the process of doing a bit of stuff around the house. Part of the "bigger picture" is to enclose the front yard with a 6ft high fence and have a nice sitting area in what is currently a largely wasted space.

But at the same time I'm currently setting up with some kegging gear. The question I have thanks to my girlfriend was could I have the kegs in the "main bar" around at the BBQ area and have some beer lines plumbed in that run the 15 meters to the front garden.

Now obviously I'd have to use pyton line running glycol to keep the beer chilled in the lines but then after doing a bit of thinking and research I came up with a couple of questions.

By having such long line lengths surely I would struggle to push the beer using CO2 without over carbing the beer in the keg and forcing it out with too much pressure at the first tap.

Then I found out about the sureflo beer pumps. So my question is - are they expencive? and have any home brewers done anything like this.

I know a freind who is also in the process of setting up a kegging setup wanted to see if he could have a beer tap in his kitchen by the sink have the beer in the fridge in the shed and have a tap by the BBQ area so we'd both be interested to know how this is done and if there is a "reasonably" cost effective way of doing it

Cheers,
Kirk

 

[jonocarroll]

I'll point out that if a beer line is 1cm internal diameter (is it? I don't have kegs ), with 15m of line you'll have just under 1.2L sitting in the line at any one time! With 2cm internal diameter lines that would ramp up to about 4.7L. Presumably you can't push that one way or the other between sessions, so I'd presume you'd have a fair bit of wastage. I take it beer doesn't keep too well in the line at those volumes.

Subject to accuracy and assumptions of course.

 

[cdbrown]

Pubs run their beer lines long distances and they get over this problem by using nitrogen/CO2 mix. Not sure what pressure or % mix you would need.

 

[cdbrown]

I'll point out that if a beer line is 1cm internal diameter (is it? I don't have kegs ), with 15m of line you'll have just under 1.2L sitting in the line at any one time! With 2cm internal diameter lines that would ramp up to about 4.7L. Presumably you can't push that one way or the other between sessions, so I'd presume you'd have a fair bit of wastage. I take it beer doesn't keep too well in the line at those volumes.

Subject to accuracy and assumptions of course.

Beer line is usually about 5mm internal diameter.

 

[peas_and_corn]

I use 4mm beer line, which is great for the short distances I need to push it- but you'll need a much wider diameter. As QB pointed out you'll have some beer sitting in your lines and as such you'll have to purge them each time you have a beer- pubs do this every morning, but this is of course offset by the fact that a lot of beer goes through to be sold afterwards- so you'll need to remember that such an idea IMO is best for sessions rather than the odd pint here and there.

 

[jonocarroll]

Beer line is usually about 5mm internal diameter.

peas_and_corn has pointed out that you would need wider lines for such a distance, but I've no idea just how much wider. For completeness, 5mm line would give you about 300mL in your lines at any one time.

Geez - I'll do any calculations except the one's I'm supposed to be doing, won't I?

 

[komodo]

I was under the understanding that this is why they used beer pumps so that they didn't need to purge the lines as often and the glycol would keep the beer cool enough that it shouldn't go off as quickly.

Admittedly it probably would get used for sessions more than the odd pint here or there any way and if I used 4mm line thats just under 200mls in the line any way.

Hmm more thinking to do.

Have any one used on of these air driven beer pumps any way?
http://www.flojetshop.com/flojet/flojet_in...pump/itemid3948

They cost about $140 each

 

[Supra-Jim]

Seems like a lot of effort for a setup that only gets used on the odd occasion. Those beer pumps will need a compressed air source to run.

Would it not be simpler adapt some kind of setup using an esky, tap, regulator and soda stream bottle?

I am currently collecting items to convert an old wine barrel into a large esky, with a dual font on top, and then use a regulator and small Co2 bottle. Something like this could be wheeled out for sessions and then packed away after.

Seems alot simpler than 15m of glycol lagged beer line, with a pump, and a compressor to run the pump.

Jsut my two cents.

:icon_cheers: SJ

 

[komodo]

Possibly but no way near as cool

Compressor I already have and I leave running all the time (keen 4x4er and amateur car do-er-up-er-a means I use the compressor all the time) The compressor is on a timer and comes on 30 minutes before I get home and turns off @ 10:30 and with about 150L of capacity @ 115 PSI I dont think pulling a few beers is going to affect my air consumption greatly.

Plus in Trav's situation where his missus wont let him have a fridge in the BBQ area but he wants beer there he doesn't have a great deal of options. His shed is about 8mtrs away from his BBQ area

 

[Supra-Jim]

Possibly but no way near as cool

No arguement there. Believe me i have often pondered the idea of running beer lines frm the garage to the house......

Good luck with it.

:icon_cheers: SJ

 

[jonocarroll]

I've just re-read the OP and I've realised - you don't need the pump at all... or the 15m of beer line. You already have a system for getting beer from the keg to the bbq area... sorry, I didn't catch her name :icon_chickcheers:

Ba-boom-boom-cha.

 

[MarkBastard]

I'd just set up a second smaller bar and move the kegs to the front bar as needed. It'd probably work out cheaper and easier surely.

 

[komodo]

I "think" I have worked out a way of doing it that would actually work out slightly better than the original plan as I could have matching smaller bars in both locations.

If i set my keg fridge (500Ltr chest freezer thanks to ebay) in the shed and run a python line from the shed to the front (less used) bar then to the BBQ area (main) bar and run a 10L heavily insulated glycol box at each bar with beer line coils going through like an esky magic box with glycol supplied by the python line I should be able to manage to keep fresh and cold beer at both bars pretty much full time.
Because the main beer would be in line after the secondary bar the beer shouldnt ever sit in the line a great deal of time. It would still mean I would have 320 mls of beer in the line at any one point but one would imagine that that would generally be only for a maximum of 22-24 hours any way (then again thats a slab a month hrmmmm)

Now just to price up python line per meter and give myself another scare...

 

[MarkBastard]

If you go ahead with this, please take pictures of the whole process. Sounds very interesting.

How are you going to 'divert' to the appropriate bar? Like will the one keg be available to both bars at the same time? Will there be a manual switch?

 

[komodo]

I dont see a reason why I couldnt just tee off as the pressure is what pumps the beer out. So the same keg should be available at two locations
Plan is to have 3 beers and a cider. The front bar to have cider and one beer and the main bar to have all products available. That said for the costs in volved I might end up making all products available at both bars

http://www.micromatic.com/forum/us-en/part...ystem-home.html
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=0xhRCqsepMc

Those two links are pretty interesting. (its the same guy)

And most definately if I do it there will be pics

 

[jonocarroll]

I gotta say, this sure does sound like a helluva lotta effort for the 'occasional pint' at each bar. It is really that far to walk? I just have this picture in my head - when people want computers or televisions wired up between rooms you run cables through the walls/ceiling/whatever... Are we going to find the first 'wired for beer' house in the next few months? Next you'll want a pint at the other end of the house too. Run another line?

Good luck, definitely let us know how it goes. :icon_cheers: