La Sirene

[Mountain High]

I'm not sure if this is the correct place to post this, so apologies if it's not. I've really enjoyed the saisons I've had from this brewery, although they are nothing mind blowing, and slightly over hyped. What really bothers me is on their website they say 'In contrast to the current craze for highly hopped ales, we prefer to let our yeast do the talking. We believe that this approach yields beers with more elegant flavour and aroma profiles'. I find this attitude really pretentious and irritatingly snobby. Sure there are lots of beers out there that focus too much on hops and not on balance, but there are also heaps of amazingly crafted IPAs out there that are just as 'elegant' as any other beer. Does this superiority complex from this brewery bother anyone else besides me?

 

[manticle]

Nope. There is a massive overbalance towards highly hopped beers and besides - it's just marketing ****. It's transparent. See through it, enjoy the beer. At least it doesn't claim to magically unlock special ingredients on a cellular level and turn beer into superfood (which we know it is anyway).

 

[philmud]

It's just copy for their website. It's calibrated to a) provide a point of difference from other breweries (and it's a valid point of difference. Most craft beer on the market is hop-forward) and b ) position their products as premium beers for discerning drinkers. I think they do this with their packaging also, it's very pretentious when you consider what a purely functional beer bottle looks like. Are their beers good enough to warrant the pretension? That's a question for the market.

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

I totally agree with this "to the current craze for highly hopped ales" you dont have to be Einstein to see what they are saying reflected in the market place.
like brewing history through the ages where styles have prominence for a time then they are lost to history only to become resurrected again.
Over hopped beers dont do it for me but neither do Saisons.
Nev

 

[kevo]

I guess I'd be a little put off if the label said something like... 'You really should buy a highly hopped ale, this beer just tastes like yeast.'

 

[Mountain High]

No doubt La Sirene are filling a niche in the market with their focus on yeast over hop driven beers, and I appreciate that. I also agree there are too many hop forward beers, and a lot of them aren't even that great. I just found it irritating that they think their style of beer is superior to other styles of beer.

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

No doubt La Sirene are filling a niche in the market with their focus on yeast over hop driven beers, and I appreciate that. I also agree there are too many hop forward beers, and a lot of them aren't even that great. I just found it irritating that they think their style of beer is superior to other styles of beer.

Its just their opinion and I wouldnt get worked up about it, relax and have a elegant Saison

 

[Mountain High]

^^^ haha. Sound advice

 

[kevo]

I just found it irritating that they think their style of beer is superior to other styles of beer.

I think any brewer would have to believe their beer is somehow superior to go to the effort of opening a brewery to sell their product. Especially if your product is saison in a market that loves bland lager and hoppy ales.

In the end it's really up to you. If you like their beer and agree with their marketing, you'll probably buy more of that product over another.

 

[NewtownClown]

They can justify talking up their Saison seeing as they were awarded Champion Belgian and French Style at the inaugural CBIA Craft Beer Awards...

 

[Yeastfridge]

'Elegance' in winemaking/sommelier speak doesn't mean superior or better. It's a tricky definition but means subtle, complex and balanced, which is what is generally highly regarded about saisons. Often used in comparison with 'bold', like a heavy, spicy, fruity Shiraz, or indeed an IPA. I think the bee in your bonnet is about a perceived snobbery that is really just fancy talk. An IPA can never be elegant in wine-speak but that doesn't mean it can't be amazing.

 

[Forever Wort]

La Sirene make awesome beers and their marketing is strong. More power to them.

 

[verysupple]

'Elegance' in winemaking/sommelier speak doesn't mean superior or better. It's a tricky definition but means subtle, complex and balanced, which is what is generally highly regarded about saisons. Often used in comparison with 'bold', like a heavy, spicy, fruity Shiraz, or indeed an IPA. I think the bee in your bonnet is about a perceived snobbery that is really just fancy talk. An IPA can never be elegant in wine-speak but that doesn't mean it can't be amazing.

I agree. When I read the quote I didn't take it as being arrogant or pretentious. They were just saying that their beers are different to the norm.

I found this on their "About Us" page:

The brewers come from winemaking and scientific backgrounds

So it's not surprising that they describe their beers the way they do. It's a different style of writing than you would find on a lot of craft brewery's websites, but why should they all be shouty and flippant like Brew Dog for instance?

NB: Not that there's anything wrong with that. I actually liked the old Brew Dog desriptions better before they tamed them down.

 

[TheWiggman]

I have a strong feeling this thread hasn't gone in the direction OP intended.
In fact I want to try one of their beers now. Internal marketing genious by Mountian High?

 

[Bribie G]

How about the massive trend towards cloudy orange-coloured frozen highly hopped ales. That's the main reason I avoid most Australian "craft" beers. The other week I was in Nelson Bay looking for a beer and found a tap of Kosiuzsko ale, a brand I'd actually never tried.

Oh dear, then came the frozen orange cloudy.........

 

[Phoney]

How about the massive trend towards cloudy orange-coloured frozen highly hopped ales. That's the main reason I avoid most Australian "craft" beers. The other week I was in Nelson Bay looking for a beer and found a tap of Kosiuzsko ale, a brand I'd actually never tried.

Oh dear, then came the frozen orange cloudy.........

Kosiuzsko ale is owned by Lion Nathan. It's about as "craft" as James Squire.

 

[NewtownClown]

How about the massive trend towards cloudy orange-coloured frozen highly hopped ales. That's the main reason I avoid most Australian "craft" beers. The other week I was in Nelson Bay looking for a beer and found a tap of Kosiuzsko ale, a brand I'd actually never tried.

Oh dear, then came the frozen orange cloudy.........

I agree, I can stand Kosciusko or their ilk.
That's another of Dr Charles Hahn's pet projects (read: build a brand, sell it for a motza to Lion/Kirin).
He really knows what the broader market is after - look at the success of Hahn Lager and James Squire. Sure, marketing plays a massive part but a product that will appeal to a majority is essential. That is why, like Australian macro-brewery Lagers, they get "dumbed" down. Whilst they may offend a craft beer aficionado, they do offer an entry point to the world of craft beer for many - and that's gotta be a good thing for both the consumer and the industry.

I hope you mean you try to avoid Australian Pale Ales and not ALL Australian craft beers, for there are many great ones being produced across all styles - have a look at the continuing success of Redoak in international awards. Most recently they received, for the second year running, Supreme Champion for their sour beer, Château Sour, against 550 beers from 30 countries in the International Beer Challenge 2014 in UK, the previous year they won with their Special Reserve. Then there is Young Henry's who won top gong in a Real Ale competition in the UK.

 

[NewtownClown]

Kosiuzsko ale is owned by Lion Nathan. It's about as "craft" as James Squire.

According to the CBIA criteria, Malt Shovel Brewery (james Squire) is indeed a Craft Brewery, albeit a large one.

 

[Goldenchild]

La Sirene wild saison is terrible! Anyone who has happened to have bought a bottle and not drank it should send it to me straight away so i can dispose of it for them h34r:

 

[Mountain High]

'Elegance' in winemaking/sommelier speak doesn't mean superior or better. It's a tricky definition but means subtle, complex and balanced, which is what is generally highly regarded about saisons. Often used in comparison with 'bold', like a heavy, spicy, fruity Shiraz, or indeed an IPA. I think the bee in your bonnet is about a perceived snobbery that is really just fancy talk. An IPA can never be elegant in wine-speak but that doesn't mean it can't be amazing.

Very insightful post. I guess I misunderstood their use of the word 'elegant'.