I Need Help!

[Tim Cox]

Hello Ladies and Gents,

I am currently in the process of shifting house and as such, I've had to pack up all my brewing equipment, Sell my Fermenting Fridge, and all sorts of other horrors =(

This has left me with an awful amount of spare time and I have one of those minds that never, ever stops......I have been dreaming up a beer on my long drives between SA and QLD and I think I know what I want, but need some help to establish an actual recipe.....

Considering I am moving back to QLD, I want to take full advantage of the tropical fruits that will be available to me and I want to incorporate the following:
Weetbix
Rolled oats
Rice
Mango
Pineapple
Passionfruit

I am sort of going for a breakfast mash/style of thing. If I could incorporate it into a wheat beer that'd be perfect although a Pale Ale wouldn't be too bad either....

Can anyone give me any pointers on how to get this across to a 23 ltr batch at around 5-8%?

Cheers

Tim

 

[Lionman]

I'll have a go.

I would pre cook the rice and oats. Weetbix can be added directly to the mash. Probably a good idea to use some rice hulls in there to help the sparge flow better. I would add any fruit as a secondary fermentation, almost like a dry hop.

2Kg pale Malt
1Kg Wheat Malt
1Kg Weetbix
.5Kg Rolled Oats - cooked
.5Kg Rice - cooked

5g Magnum - FWH

10g Mosaic - 5min
10g El Dorado - 5min
10g Galaxy - 5min

30g Mosaic - Whirlpool
30g El Dorado - Whirlpool
30g Galaxy - Whirlpool

300g Mango - Secondary
300g Pineapple - Secondary
300g Passionfruit - Secondary

This will come out at about

5.5ABV
20IBU
3.5SRM

The hops match up with the fruits you mentioned pretty well.

You could ferment this with a wheat beer yeast to get some banana flavours in there too, or a clean ale yeast if prefered.

 

[Tim Cox]

I'll have a go.

I would pre cook the rice and oats. Weetbix can be added directly to the mash. Probably a good idea to use some rice hulls in there to help the sparge flow better. I would add any fruit as a secondary fermentation, almost like a dry hop.

2Kg pale Malt
1Kg Wheat Malt
1Kg Weetbix
.5Kg Rolled Oats - cooked
.5Kg Rice - cooked

5g Magnum - FWH

10g Mosaic - 5min
10g El Dorado - 5min
10g Galaxy - 5min

30g Mosaic - Whirlpool
30g El Dorado - Whirlpool
30g Galaxy - Whirlpool

300g Mango - Secondary
300g Pineapple - Secondary
300g Passionfruit - Secondary

This will come out at about

5.5ABV
20IBU
3.5SRM

The hops match up with the fruits you mentioned pretty well.

You could ferment this with a wheat beer yeast to get some banana flavours in there too, or a clean ale yeast if prefered.

Thank you very much for that Lionman,

I'm interested to see how it'd turn out, it'll either be brilliant or a massive flop lol. Quick question for you though, how would you cook the oats? The only way I've done it is with half a cup of water and cook it in the microwave....

Also you said Whirlpool the hops....what does that mean? and what is FWH?

Lastly, when you say dry hop, do you mean once she has cooked, boiled etc....and in the fermenter, put it in there for the two weeks or so?

 

[altone]

I actually don't cook oats first I use the home brand quick oats (check that they are 100% oats) and add some rice hulls to the mash.
However, just boil some water in a pan and add the oats for about 10 mins should do it.

By FWH I'm assuming @Lionman is talking about first wort hops and not the Urban Dictionary meaning

Here's a link: http://beersmith.com/blog/2008/03/17/the-first-wort-hop-beer-brewing-techniques/

Whirlpool is when you stir the wort after the end of the boil to try and get the trub to settle in the centre rather than blocking
your valves etc.
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/threads/whirlpool-process.63220/

Dry hopping:
https://byo.com/article/dry-hopping-techniques/

There you go

 

[Tim Cox]

I actually don't cook oats first I use the home brand quick oats (check that they are 100% oats) and add some rice hulls to the mash.
However, just boil some water in a pan and add the oats for about 10 mins should do it.

By FWH I'm assuming @Lionman is talking about first wort hops and not the Urban Dictionary meaning

Here's a link: http://beersmith.com/blog/2008/03/17/the-first-wort-hop-beer-brewing-techniques/

Whirlpool is when you stir the wort after the end of the boil to try and get the trub to settle in the centre rather than blocking
your valves etc.
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/threads/whirlpool-process.63220/

Dry hopping:
https://byo.com/article/dry-hopping-techniques/

There you go

Thank you very much for all that,

I'll have a read and post once I've brewed it all....hopefully she isn't a massive flop!

 

[Lionman]

Haha, sorry for dumping so much jargon on you, and welcome to the forum.

The point of cooking the rice and the oats is that the starches will not be available for conversion by the enzymes in the malt unless they are first gelatinised. You can get away without cooking the oats as I think they gelatinise below the mash temp generally used. If you pre cook them though they will convert quicker in the mash. Rice definitely needs to be cooked, and over cook it so its gluggy and mix it well into the mash.

Altone has provided some great links, but in this recipe there isn't any dry hops, rather fruits used instead so the method is a little different. You could dry hop as well thoguh if you wanted too. 20-30g of each of the mention hops will help boost aroma and flavour a bit. Here is some info on different ways to brew with fruits.

https://byo.com/article/fruit-brew-part-2-techniques/

You don't need to use the first wort hopping technique, boiling the hops in the wort for 60mins will also be fine.

I think the beer would come out quite interesting and should be reasonably fruity. The oats should help give a nice mouth feel. I'm not sure how the weetbix will impact the end product though. I would expect that the majority of their flavour will be lost. They do contain a small amount of salt and are fortified with nutrients which will be interesting. The salt is in a tiny amount so probably won't have much impact but at least you'll get a good serving of niacin and folate. Healthy beer, haha

If you want a more fruity brew you could easily double the whirlpool and fruit additions. When whirlpooling, wait for the wort to cool to 80c before adding the hops or you will extract additional bitterness that the above recipe has not taken into account.

 

[Tim Cox]

Haha, sorry for dumping so much jargon on you, and welcome to the forum.

The point of cooking the rice and the oats is that the starches will not be available for conversion by the enzymes in the malt unless they are first gelatinised. You can get away without cooking the oats as I think they gelatinise below the mash temp generally used. If you pre cook them though they will convert quicker in the mash. Rice definitely needs to be cooked, and over cook it so its gluggy and mix it well into the mash.

Altone has provided some great links, but in this recipe there isn't any dry hops, rather fruits used instead so the method is a little different. You could dry hop as well thoguh if you wanted too. 20-30g of each of the mention hops will help boost aroma and flavour a bit. Here is some info on different ways to brew with fruits.

https://byo.com/article/fruit-brew-part-2-techniques/

You don't need to use the first wort hopping technique, boiling the hops in the wort for 60mins will also be fine.

I think the beer would come out quite interesting and should be reasonably fruity. The oats should help give a nice mouth feel. I'm not sure how the weetbix will impact the end product though. I would expect that the majority of their flavour will be lost. They do contain a small amount of salt and are fortified with nutrients which will be interesting. The salt is in a tiny amount so probably won't have much impact but at least you'll get a good serving of niacin and folate. Healthy beer, haha

If you want a more fruity brew you could easily double the whirlpool and fruit additions. When whirlpooling, wait for the wort to cool to 80c before adding the hops or you will extract additional bitterness that the above recipe has not taken into account.

Hey Lionman,

Thanks for the reply and warm welcome! it's been quite educational!!!

So if my recipe looked something like this, I should be pretty right hey?

2Kg pale Malt
1Kg Wheat Malt
1Kg Weetbix
.5Kg Rolled Oats - cooked
.5Kg Rice - cooked
2-3 cups rice hulls

Mash in around 65 deg c, strike about 70 deg C?

Let mash for 60-70 mins

Sparge and top water up for 10 mins or so

5g Magnum - @ 60 Min

10g Mosaic - @ 5min
10g El Dorado - @ 5min
10g Galaxy - @ 5min

Allow to cool to sub 80 deg C

30g Mosaic - Whirlpool
30g El Dorado - Whirlpool
30g Galaxy - Whirlpool

Whirlpool for 10 mins or so?

Into fermenter with liquid wheat yeast at around 24 for that bubblegum to come out?

Two weeks post this, add:

300g Mango - Secondary
300g Pineapple - Secondary
300g Passionfruit - Secondary

Leave for another week or two, cold crash and enjoy?

Does that sound right? I love my wheat beer, will that amount of weetbix do anything at all, or should I throw some extra grain in it? The reason for doing the weetbix was to use what I have "Around the house" without going to a HBS.....

Thanks again for the replies guys! Much appreciated, I wanted to do something a bit left field so I could prove my dad wrong (He and I quite often have beer-off's....)

 

[altone]

Good info @Lionman I should have added a link to using fruit in secondary.

Personally I add spices/fruit etc. inside a hopsock so I can pull it out easily.

Just thinking about the Weetbix and thinking unmalted wheat would be better.
The Weetbix are going to turn into a gluggy mess and probably a stuck mash will occur.

Never tried it but just my thoughts. I've used oats and rice and even quinoa before but never Weetbix

 

[Tim Cox]

Good info @Lionman I should have added a link to using fruit in secondary.

Personally I add spices/fruit etc. inside a hopsock so I can pull it out easily.

Just thinking about the Weetbix and thinking unmalted wheat would be better.
The Weetbix are going to turn into a gluggy mess and probably a stuck mash will occur.

Never tried it but just my thoughts. I've used oats and rice and even quinoa before but never Weetbix

I could do something completely wild and use cocopops

 

[altone]

I could do something completely wild and use cocopops

don't stick with 1 colour https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/fruit-loops-pale-ale.562671/

 

[Lionman]

No worries.

Feral did a breakfast IPA that had Nutragrain, Weetbix, Rice Bubbles and All Bran in the mash. It was called Shooter McGavins Breakfast IPA and was brewed for GABS earlier this year. It was more in the NEIPA style but with lactose added. By all accoutns it was pretty good but I missed out on trying that one.

https://craftypint.com/beer/5325/feral-brewing-shooter-mcgavins-breakfast-ipa

So its definately possible to mash with breakfast cerals. I would add maybe 250g or so of rice hulls to the mash to help with runoff and sparging.

The bubblegum flavours from yeast is a Beligian thing, not sure how well it would go with a breakfast inspired beer but I dont have a lot of experience with Beligian styles. I would consider going for more of a German style which Banana flavours from the yeast as it might work better with the concept? You could also try the WLP644 strain that throws some lovely pineapple notes.

 

[Tim Cox]

don't stick with 1 colour https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/fruit-loops-pale-ale.562671/

I like this idea! I should try it....=P

 

[Tim Cox]

No worries.

Feral did a breakfast IPA that had Nutragrain, Weetbix, Rice Bubbles and All Bran in the mash. It was called Shooter McGavins Breakfast IPA and was brewed for GABS earlier this year. It was more in the NEIPA style but with lactose added. By all accoutns it was pretty good but I missed out on trying that one.

https://craftypint.com/beer/5325/feral-brewing-shooter-mcgavins-breakfast-ipa

So its definately possible to mash with breakfast cerals. I would add maybe 250g or so of rice hulls to the mash to help with runoff and sparging.

The bubblegum flavours from yeast is a Beligian thing, not sure how well it would go with a breakfast inspired beer but I dont have a lot of experience with Beligian styles. I would consider going for more of a German style which Banana flavours from the yeast as it might work better with the concept? You could also try the WLP644 strain that throws some lovely pineapple notes.

Nice one,

Ill give the WLP644 a run then...thanks for the heads up.

Aside from that, the rest of what I put down for times/temps etc looks ok?

 

[Rocker1986]

No worries.

Feral did a breakfast IPA that had Nutragrain, Weetbix, Rice Bubbles and All Bran in the mash. It was called Shooter McGavins Breakfast IPA and was brewed for GABS earlier this year.

Why? Did it have floaties in it?

 

[Lionman]

Why? Did it have floaties in it?

 

[Mat]

Speaking of brews with cereal, basic brewing do one with count chocula .

I'm keen to do the same recipe but sub in Coco Pops.

 

[Tim Cox]

Well!
I finally got off my ass and finished my shed un-pack part of the move and decided this afternoon was the time to do the beer.....was an interesting one.

I used the recipe as above and am fairly happy....a few notes

Use rice hulls....oh lots of rice hulls....I did notice that the weetbix melted and went through my screens and did cause them to block up quite a bit....again, this was kind of expected. I ended up using a sieve to get the chunky bits out which helped.....

70 mins mash in was too long, I ended up getting to 60 mins and called it there, the whole thing had turned to a goo so I sparged it for a while and then went from there....doh forgot the reading....fml....

Hops were added, it was interesting that I bought a 50g bag of hops, I used 10 grams of it, then the other 30 and there was nothing left.....hmmm.....never mind.

The colour is a poo kind of brown, once in the cube it came a bit more of a caramel, but def not the golden wheat colour I was after, admittedly I did use a little too much weetbix and I'm seriously met worried about the colour....

I'll post back once I have had one or two!

Thanks again all.

 

[Tim Cox]

So.….

Just a quick update, I ended up bottling the beer last weekend and found 7.5 ltrs of trub =(

So did the recipe as per above but threw in a R2E2 mango which I think was closer on 6-800g, a tin of pineapple rounds 500g and some passionfruit (in a tin 2 x the small tins)

As I said, I bottled last weekend and have just cracked one...at 5 days, it's green as crap, but nice. Very tropical.

I'd say it's like a tropical IPA without the bitterness and base of a wheat beer....Exactly what I was after. I think the only thing I'll do next time is use a

 

[wide eyed and legless]

So.….
I'd say it's like a tropical IPA without the bitterness and base of a wheat beer....Exactly what I was after. I think the only thing I'll do next time is use a

Wow, can't wait for the next post to see what you are going to use.

 

[Tim Cox]

Wow, can't wait for the next post to see what you are going to use.

I am open to suggestions

To be honest, I hadn't given it much thought, might stick to what I know for the moment. However, it's really down to the guys who helped out with the recipe with how it all came together!