How Long Does A Starter Last?

[Rodolphe01]

So, I made a 3 litre starter a bit over a week ago, with a view to using it a few days ago. But with leave at work being cancelled, and shovelling **** out of peoples homes on my days off with regard to the floods in BNE I have not been able to brew, and will probably be minimum 1 week before I can put water to malt - Is my starter OK as is at room temp? Or should I be handling if differently to maintain better viability? I'd just stick it in the fridge, except the demijohn won't fit, which would mean I have to decant it, which means I increase risk of infection etc.

If it makes any different it is Wyeast London ESB.

Fortunately this is the most troubling thing to personally affect me in these floods (and i'm not complaining!).

Cheers.

 

[MaltyHops]

A recent thread I wrote to suggested the ideal time to use a starter is when
the yeasties have been clearly growing and around the time krausening in the
starter container begins as the yeast is at full growing mode at that stage.

In your case I think putting the starter in the fridge is prob best to slow the
yeast down for now - perhaps into 2, 3 or more separate containers to spread
the risk of infection (check/smell before next use), maybe adding more starter
wort to get them going before committing to using it.

T.

 

[raven19]

I would certainly recommend sampling the beer ontop to make sure its ok.

Room temp will fluctuate between day and night, possibly leading to nasties getting sucked back into the vessel at night when cooler.

I had this occur with one of my recent starters which went sour after leaving it on the bar counter at home for a week!

 

[MeLoveBeer]

Got an esky or similar that you can fit the erlenmeyer into? You could try and regulate the temp by keeping it in a body of water like a laundry sink or something?

Theoretically it should behave much the same as fermenting beer, so as long as its in the temp range it should be okay. If the yeast starts to drop out over the week you could decant, and then step up again to increase viability and health before pitching (even if its half a litre or so, it'd have to help).

 

[RobW]

I'd pour off most of the supernatant and resuspend the yeast, then decant it into a new sanitised container and keep it in the fridge. If you are carefull with your sanitation you will be OK.

When you are ready to pitch, pour off the rest of the liquid and just pitch the yeast (or else fire it up in a couple of litres of your brew wort and then add to the main brew).

 

[Rodolphe01]

Cheers guys, I have 2 spare Schott's, i'll decant and dump into there for storage and fill another with wort to get 'er started again.

 

[kelbygreen]

I have the same problem I done a starter last wednesday and was going to brew and pitch on friday but the starter did not kick off till friday and I had to go away for holidays. When I got home tuesday this week I crush chilled it and its still in there. I wont be able to brew till sunday maybe saturday but doubt it. I have a bung and a airlock in a old rum bottle it smells ok out of the airlock and the yeast has settled.

I was thinking of tipping off the wort and adding another 500ml of wort made from LDME boiled up for 5-10 mins then getting it started again if the wort smells and tastes ok . It was coopers cultured yeast but I used the sparkling bottle so not sure the viability.

This is my first attempt as a starter and a culture so not sure the best method from here. I also want to grow it up to pitch it into 2x 21lts fermenters as I got no money to buy beer and I want to make the most out of it. I can just pitch one then pitch the other straight on the yeast cake as it will be identical beers (brew a double batch but only have 25lt fermenters) so that is maybe the best option to get a better pitching rate?

your thoughts would be good.

 

[MaltyHops]

Don't know if you were going to but don't put an airlock on your starter
- just loosely wrap the opening with sanitised alfoil to allow air exchange
into starter container. Recently discovered that on a stirplate, yeast
growth is about 2 to 3 times more this way than using an airlock.

 

[cdbrown]

I'd tip off the spent wort (taste and smell it) and do a starter the same volume you had just done.

Just using yeastcalc - 21L at 1.050OG needs 195B cells. You can go to mrmalty and guesstimate the initial cell count based on the thickness of the yeast slurry and then take into account it's been a few weeks so the viability will have dropped a little. Then do your stepping up from there.

If you had 100B a few weeks ago, you'll have 86B now - a 1.5L starter is the right innoculation rate and gives a good cell count with intermittent shaking.

 

[kelbygreen]

Yeah thanks cd. Now to work out how to measure how many mls the yeast is lol

 

[kelbygreen]

ok I cant work out how to calculate the starter I need to use. I measured the yeast as its solid on the bottom and calculated it to about 21ml and it says I need about 53ml. How do I know how much to step it up to get 53ml?

 

[Steve@PMF82]

ok I cant work out how to calculate the starter I need to use. I measured the yeast as its solid on the bottom and calculated it to about 21ml and it says I need about 53ml. How do I know how much to step it up to get 53ml?

A 1L starter with 10min worth of swirling shaking at the start then some intermittent shaking withing the first 12hrs should get you in the ballpark.

If you just want to shake the **** out of it then let it be go 1.5 to 2L.

 

[kelbygreen]

yeah no worries. So if I do a say 1.5lt starter then pitch it when the krausen is high would this be the best? As I say never done a starter but read that its best to pitch before the fermentation is finished.

I wonder if the reculture coopers yeast article is right?? as I used 3 bottles (instead of 2 stated) and I also used about 750ml (instead of the 600ml stated) and looks like I got under half what is recommended to be pitched???

Edit: maybe thats why people get the banana flavour if fermented above 20c as they are under pitching and stressing the yeast???

 

[cdbrown]

At high krausen is when they've done all the growing/multiplying and is the best time to pitch as it's most active - normally about 24hrs after stepping up. Works well if pitching the whole starter. I usually only want to pitch the yeast so I let it ferment out, chill for a day, decant and pitch the slurry.

 

[kelbygreen]

yeah true I might do the same and just pitch the yeast, Do you put a small amount of wort from the fermenter into the starter to get the yeast in suspension or do you just leave a bit of wort in the starter and swirl it around to get the yeast in suspension?

 

[cdbrown]

Leave a little bit of "beer" to give it a really good swirl. Make sure the slurry has warmed up to pitching temps to avoid temperature shock

 

[stux]

So, I made a 3 litre starter a bit over a week ago, with a view to using it a few days ago. But with leave at work being cancelled, and shovelling **** out of peoples homes on my days off with regard to the floods in BNE I have not been able to brew, and will probably be minimum 1 week before I can put water to malt - Is my starter OK as is at room temp? Or should I be handling if differently to maintain better viability? I'd just stick it in the fridge, except the demijohn won't fit, which would mean I have to decant it, which means I increase risk of infection etc.

If it makes any different it is Wyeast London ESB.

Fortunately this is the most troubling thing to personally affect me in these floods (and i'm not complaining!).

Cheers.

I believe, although I don't have references, that Whitelabs and Wyeast both say that viability of a starter begins to decrease rapidly after two weeks, as long as the starter is stored in a cold fridge.

Basically, you're talking about storing slurry, and the same numbers should apply.

It would perhaps be a good idea to decant the wort, juice the starter a bit, and then pitch.

I have used week old starters with no issues, BUT they were stored in the fridge.