Hop shots

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Ha,too true, typing on an iPad without spellcheck sucks. Still the overall message is convieved without exact plain english. If I was not to busy doing what I am doing (public health) I reckon that there is a lotta money in hops and home brew in general. But, online only average details are provided via online/web providers; ON THEIR WEB SITE. In the USA northern brewer seem to provide a holistic service. In the meantime I'll stick to my local supplier for advice where I drive to and speak to an actual person. Unlikely to move to another supplier, especially online, as the information on line from the websites is generally poor. Don't shoot the messenger!!!

In the meantime I will continue to dry hop using pallets, until a supplier gives me the relevant info I need to change my habits. Beer tasting great without Hotshots! could be better? capitalism, sell your wares!!!
Cheers
Elz
 
Elz said:
In the USA northern brewer seem to provide a holistic service.
sure they do rummy...

Northern Brewer.JPG

Information has been posted already if you care to read it
 
Yob, Careful with your argument. What do you have to add to the hop knowledge based on your website data (useful links?). I am NOT here to argue but to implore sellers on there web site to outline how hop shots can be used.
 
Frankly, why do you care? Doesn't sound as though it's your type of thing anyway...

I've posted information, I'm always ready to discuss and do so often.

Tell ya what I'll do for ya, I'll add the pdf of the information that's already been posted to the page.
 
Elz said:
Yob, Careful with your argument. What do you have to add to the hop knowledge based on your website data (useful links?). I am NOT here to argue but to implore sellers on there web site to outline how hop shots can be used.
Frankly I'm not sure what you're after here. Every brewer has to come to their own understanding of the craft, even if they're doing K&K. It's not something that can be simply laid out. You can receive the directions but you have to do it yourself.

I am under the impression that I understand what you want, as I wanted it once myself. And, as I mentioned earlier, I was told by some of the most informed sources that this sort of knowledge does not yet exist due to the nature of the chemistry involved. Hop chemistry in interaction with wort and with the yeast biome is more complex than any of us can ever hope to understand.

Vinnie Cilurzo, Matt Brynildson, Mitch Steele and other masters of brewing and hopping have come to their knowledge of hopping through their own direct experience and commissioning of studies. It's reallly, genuinely, truly not something one can say, "Do X and Y will be your result." If these hop extracts were standardised through massive fractionation of the individual components, then maybe, but they aren't. They are extracts of the crop of one particular season. The best you can hope for is a guideline, like a map, and until you walk the trail you'll never understand the forest.

I think you need to do some more work to understand the nature of the question you're asking. I've tried - for myself and by my own effort of study and communication with experts over the course of a year - to get what I think is the same answer you want. What I learned is that it doesn't exist. Sensory analyses are by their nature difficult, if not impossible, to communicate clearly and concisely. When one adds the complexity of hop and brewing chemistry on top of that, our science is quite frankly not there yet.

And here is the end of my trying veeeeeeeeeeery hard to be polite and contribute constructively to discourse.
 
edited to ad the below info.

View attachment DOSING INFO.pdf

HopBurst – Dry Hop Aroma
General:
HopBurst are prepared from hop cones or T90 pellets by innovative extraction and
distillation methods. They consist of hop oil components in a propylene glycol (PG)
solution.

Characteristics:
HopBurst provides an easy method of adding intense hop aroma independent of any
other product or process. Specifically, HopBurst gives a ‘dry hop’ aroma to beer that is
characteristic of the specific variety of hops from which it is prepared. The product also
enhances pleasant existing flavours and can mask some off-flavours in the beer.
Light stable: All products are free of α-acids and can be used with any beer packaging type.
Fully soluble: HopBurst utilisation is up to 100% as it is fully soluble.
Easy handling: Provided as a standardised solution for dosing into bright beer.
Natural: 100% derived from hops by physical processes.
Product development: The products can be used to differentiate from a single wort
stream or to add layers of aroma and flavour to an existing product.

Product Specifications:
Description: water white solution, can be hazy
Odour: characteristic of variety
Specific gravity (20°C) 1.035 – 1.045
Flash point: >90°C (194°F)

Product use:
HopBurst are fully soluble in beer and are intended for addition to fined or filtered
beers. They can be dosed into finished beer without the need for subsequent filtration,
with gentle mixing required for maximum effect. Regardless if the beer is intended to be
kegged, bottled or filled into casks, the optimum way of dosing HopBurst products is inline
dosing into the beer stream on transfer to the bright beer tank or racking vessel.
HopBurst can also be added direct into finishing vessel prior to transferring the beer,
where the transfer should ensure the product is mixed. For dosing direct to casks, we
recommend doing so either during the racking process or into the full cask. HopBurst
should be added separately from cask finings.

Product Development:
Trials are recommended to determine the concentration required to give your required
aroma and flavour effect. The rate of initial dosing should be 10ml/hl of the HopBurst.
This can be dosed to a bottle of beer using a pipette at a rate of 0.1 μL/ml bottle volume
(i.e for a 330 ml bottle dose 33 μl). Chill the beer to normal drinking temperature. Add
the required volume of HopBurst into the beer. Re-close the bottle, inverting to mix and
then chill for minimum 2 hours before tasting.

Dose rate: Typical dose rates start at 5 – 40 ml/hl (0.05 – 0.4 ml/l). Depending on the
base beer style and on the effect you want to achieve the dose rate can be altered within
this range. In the USA, however, triple hopped IPA beers are using up to 100 ml/hl!

Calculation example for a barrel or cask -
1 UK barrel = 36 gallon = 288 pints = 163 litres; at 10ml per hl dose rate this gives an
addition of 16.5 ml per barrel
9 gallon cask = 72 pints = approx. 41 litres; at 10 ml per hl dose rate this gives an
addition of 4 ml per cask

Packaging:
Standard packaging for HopBurst is a 1 litre or a 5 litre aluminium flask, or 20lt steel
lacquered drums.

Storage and shelf life:
HopBurst are stable in unopened containers for at least 12 months in the packaging
supplied and should be stored at 5 - 25°C

Regulatory
HopBurst qualify for natural status with regard to their flavouring properties. In the
European Union they may be classified as natural hop flavouring or hop extract
according to the flavouring legislation (1334/2008EC). In the USA, HopBurst is
classified as a natural extractive, since essential oils, oleoresins and natural extractives
(including distillates) from hops are GRAS for their intended use (21.C.F.R. § 582.20
 
/// said:
Funny that CUB whom were one of the worst culprits for hop extracts have gone away from using these and there is interest in using these in home brew ...
Scotty, you say 'culprit' like it's a negative thing to use hop extract.
Is it all so bad, and how?
 
Les the Weizguy said:
Scotty, you say 'culprit' like it's a negative thing to use hop extract.
Is it all so bad, and how?
The CUB efforts were all about wort economy and diverting beer to different brands based on spec, never about flavor

Thankfully it's a flavor consideration for these sorts of options
 
For the home brewer/mad scientist, a simple oil extract can be done with a Soxhlet extractor at home. Setup for around $100 and you could dabble in all the extracts you want (lemon, coffee, hops, cinnamon etc.), to add flavours to your beers.
 
A quick look at wikipedia page would suggest that a Soxhlet extractor is not the best choice for volatile compounds, but I have no practical experience with it.

@blair - have you tried it?
 
You're right, soxhlet extraction isn't the best option but with limited equipment, cost - super critical co2 extraction is HELL expensive!!, low danger and ease it would be perfect for small scale home production. A lot of labs still have and use the soxhlet extraction method due to ease and simplicity. Volatile organic compounds are funny things, as different compounds have different boiling points and react differently to solvents. So with hops having roughly 36+ organic compounds (please correct me if I’m wrong), unless you have access to a fully equipped lab it's dang near impossible to achieve a full extraction (it may be possible but I'm not an organic chemist, just a hobbyist :) ).

@yob - will dig up some links tonight

@peteru - No not yet as I'm re-stocking/designing my brewlab area after a year or so off, however I have purchased a soxhlet to do small scale extractions after considering the other home achievable methods (butane, steam etc).
 
What I'd really like to get hold of are the Euro hop extracts.

Say what you like about the overall quality of beers such as Oettinger, Henninger, Sainte Etienne or Bavaria, one thing that they have in common is a lovely hit of noble aroma when you pop the lid and burped up the back of the nose during drinking. The other thing is when you read the label and see "hop extract" or in the case of Oettinger "Hop sex tract" :)

I find it very hard to get that hit even with the classic Saaz, Hallertau varieties etc. I'd guess there is such a small home brewing fellowship in continental Europe that nobody has sourced any for sale, yet.
 
Better keep the garage door shut during operation.

Soxhlet_Extractor.jpg

soxhlet.jpg
 
Bribie G said:
What I'd really like to get hold of are the Euro hop extracts.

Say what you like about the overall quality of beers such as Oettinger, Henninger, Sainte Etienne or Bavaria, one thing that they have in common is a lovely hit of noble aroma when you pop the lid and burped up the back of the nose during drinking. The other thing is when you read the label and see "hop extract" or in the case of Oettinger "Hop sex tract" :)

I find it very hard to get that hit even with the classic Saaz, Hallertau varieties etc. I'd guess there is such a small home brewing fellowship in continental Europe that nobody has sourced any for sale, yet.

can be obtained
 
Do tell, I'd love some.

Hopefully not the "liquid hops" offered on a certain site, they don't seem to have much aroma (used a vial a few years ago for a Pils but no noticeable improvement).
 
if its extracted, it's liquid.

Fresh extract certainly DOES have aroma, in spades...

I also suffered at the hands of (what I believe) was much older stocks that had SFA aroma years ago.. from a 'reputable source'

Personally, I'd have pulled it and thrown it out rather than give good product a bad name.
 
Reminds me of when I was originally looking for a fermenting fridge - ended up getting kegemates (have 3 now) but the looks on staff / customer faces when I walked into HN, Good Guys etc carrying a keg for measurement purposes.. :p

Probably not a good idea nowadays especially if shouting Allah ha Akhbar..

OK back on topic.
 

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