Green Flash West Coast Ipa Extract Recipe

[Pommy Matt]

Hi there - first post on this forum but I've been lurking for a while and read a lot, so thanks!

New to home brewing with only 4 kits + extras under my belt, but swiftly getting into it
Loving super hoppy American IPA styles at the moment as I'm sure many on here are. At the moment it seems that a beer just can't be too hoppy for me, although I'm sure I'll get through this phase
Having enjoyed beers such as the Brewdog Punk and hardcore IPA's, then seeing these described by some pundits on US beer review sites as 'run of the mill' West Coast pale ales, I'm intrigued to try a proper West Coast double IPA hop bomb - and a standout in that category seems to be the Green Flash.
I'm ready to try a full extract brew given that I already have a big pot (22l) and outside burner for canning, but no chiller (do I need one?).
This is a recipe that i found on this site in the US http://www.thebrewingnetwork.com/forum/vie...?f=&t=14268 . It seems to be pushing the right buttons for the people who have tried it.

6 Gal. batch
OG: 1.069
FG: 1.013-1.014
SRM: 8.8
IBU: ~93

14# American Two Row
1.31# Crystal 40L (British if possible)
1.31# CaraPils

0.5oz Simcoe @ 90min
0.5oz Columbus @ 90 min (optional)
0.25oz Simcoe @ 60min
0.25oz Columbus @ 60min
0.25oz Simcoe @ 30min
0.25oz Columbus @ 30min
0.75oz Simcoe @ 15min
0.75oz Columbus @ 15min
1oz Cascade @ 10min
0.5oz Simcoe @ Flameout
0.5oz Columbus @ Flameout

0.5oz of each: Amarillo, Simcoe, Columbus, Centennial, Cascade for Dry Hop

Mash Temp: 152F, Boil Time 90min

Yeast : WY1056 or WLP001
Ferment Temp: 68F -> 72F

I have played around in Beersmith for the first time and come up with the following extract attempt. I would love a bit of feedback on this recipe.
A US user commented that a good start for extract would be 84% Pale LME, 8% crystal malt 40L, steeped and 8% maltodextrine. I tried the maltodextrine in beersmith, but I think my FG is looking a bit high as it is (1017 v's 1013-1014 in the AG recipe) so I subbed for dextrose to keep the FG down but the ABV up. Anyway its real guesswork as a first ever recipe attempt, but see what you think. The IBU's, colour and ABV are close(ish). It's hoppy!

Note also I couldn't remove the maltodex from the recipe?? I just set the quantity to 0.0, just in case that causes confusion!

BeerSmith 2 Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Green Flash WCIPA
Brewer: Matt
Asst Brewer:
Style: American IPA
TYPE: Extract
Taste: (30.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 13.89 l
Post Boil Volume: 12.79 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 18.93 l
Bottling Volume: 17.42 l
Estimated OG: 1.071 SG
Estimated Color: 23.3 EBC
Estimated IBU: 84.2 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 0.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
4.11 kg Pale Liquid Extract (15.8 EBC) Extract 2 85.5 %
15.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 90.0 min Hop 5 15.2 IBUs
15.00 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 90. Hop 4 16.4 IBUs
7.50 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 7 7.1 IBUs
7.50 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 60. Hop 6 7.7 IBUs
7.50 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 9 5.5 IBUs
7.50 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 30. Hop 8 5.9 IBUs
22.50 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 11 10.6 IBUs
22.50 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 15. Hop 10 11.4 IBUs
30.00 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 12 4.4 IBUs
15.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 15 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 0.0 Hop 14 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Day Hop 16 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 20 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Dry Hop Hop 19 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 18 0.0 IBUs
15.00 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 17 0.0 IBUs
0.45 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (78.8 EBC) Grain 1 9.4 %
0.00 kg Malto-Dextrine (Boil 5.0 mins) Other 13 -
0.25 kg Corn Sugar (Dextrose) (0.0 EBC) Sugar 3 5.2 %

 

[argon]

if i were converting this recipe to extract i'd keep everything the same and just replace the base malt (the american 2-row) with enough LDME to make up the gravity... keep the spec malts and hops the same... simple

So for example; add the all grain recipe into beersmith, then delete the base malt (the american 2-row) , add LDME until you get the same starting gravity.

 

[Bizier]

I congratulate you for jumping in the deep end mate. Green Flash IPA is a ripping beer and a noble goal.

With the 15, 10 and 0 minute hop additions being a large part of this beer, I would suggest looking at either chilling the whole batch via conventional means. You could also make the beer as normal up to and including the 30 minute addition (continue full boil schedule without late hops) and then no-chill, and at time of pitching re-boil a maneagable portion which you are able to chill, adding the hops there.

With a 22L pot you might need to consider a reduced boil volume, and add your remaining extract and top-up water at the end.

 

[keifer33]

As Argon has stated try and run with the same recipe and you can adjust on future batches if you enjoy. If you put the recipe as is into Beersmith and then up the top there is a nice button 'Convert'. This will just replace all the grains that require mashing with suitable extract volumes.

 

[Pommy Matt]

awesome response time - thanks guys!
Didn't realise beersmith could do the conversion for you, so I plugged the original recipe in, and actually got slightly different values than the original AG recipe for IBUs (a tad higher at 99).
The conversion dumped one of the specialty grains and left the following, for a 13 liter boil which I can manage:

BeerSmith 2 Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Green Flash WCIPA
Brewer: Matt
Asst Brewer:
Style: American IPA
TYPE: Extract
Taste: (30.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 13.89 l
Post Boil Volume: 12.79 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 18.93 l
Bottling Volume: 17.42 l
Estimated OG: 1.072 SG
Estimated Color: 18.7 EBC
Estimated IBU: 99.6 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 0.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
17.62 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 90.0 min Hop 4 17.6 IBUs
17.62 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 90. Hop 3 19.0 IBUs
8.81 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 8.2 IBUs
8.81 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 60. Hop 5 8.9 IBUs
8.81 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 8 6.3 IBUs
8.81 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 30. Hop 7 6.8 IBUs
28.32 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 10 13.1 IBUs
28.32 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 15. Hop 9 14.2 IBUs
37.76 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 11 5.4 IBUs
12.34 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 13 0.0 IBUs
12.34 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 0.0 Hop 12 0.0 IBUs
12.34 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Day Hop 14 0.0 IBUs
12.34 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 18 0.0 IBUs
12.34 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Dry Hop Hop 17 0.0 IBUs
12.34 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 16 0.0 IBUs
12.34 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 15 0.0 IBUs
0.54 kg Cara-Pils/Dextrine (3.9 EBC) Grain 1 10.7 %
4.49 kg Pale Liquid Extract (15.8 EBC) Extract 2 89.3 %


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body, No Mash Out
Total Grain Weight: 5.03 kg
----------------------------

This gives an estimated 7.1% which is in the ballpark.
Think I might give this one a whirl as my first extract brew. Hey what's the point of a deepend if you don't jump into it ? Having said that I doesn't look too complicated really, just a lot of hop additions.
If I wanted to try and reduce the IBU's to the original target of 93, would it be best to reduce the boil time (of say the 90 minute additions), or reduce the quantities of those additions?
Other than that, I think it's close enough for an attempt.

With the dry hopping - I've heard rumours of a two stage process, with an extra addition after fermentation at chilled temp to help preserve aroma/less grassy notes. Anyone tried this?

Edit to add: This version has an FG of 1019 which is 5 or 6 higher than the original AG recipe. This is what I was initially trying to bring down with the addition of dextrose. Would you recommend just leaving it as is, or trying to bring that in some how. If so - how?
thanks again!

 

[Bizier]

After initial hesitation (based on reading and BN guys recommending dry hop in warm secondary), I am now a firm convert of dry hopping cold in the keg. I am unsure whether reduced pH from CO2 plays any part, but I really love the aromas I get from this method and it easily makes a boring beer interesting.

I say add some or all of your dry hops cold. Or double the amount

 

[Pommy Matt]

After initial hesitation (based on reading and BN guys recommending dry hop in warm secondary), I am now a firm convert of dry hopping cold in the keg. I am unsure whether reduced pH from CO2 plays any part, but I really love the aromas I get from this method and it easily makes a boring beer interesting.

I say add some or all of your dry hops cold. Or double the amount

Thanks mate - I think that's what I'll do.

With the conversion from AG to extract Beersmith upped the IBUs to 105 and the SG to 1018. I've dialled back the amount of hops @ 90 minutes to hit 94 IBUs, but if I want to get the FG into the 1013-14 range I'm guessing I would need to reduce the base malt and swap in some dextrose. Would you recommend this or just going with an FG of 1018, which seems on the high side?
cheers again,
Matt

ps have ordered the hops that my LHBS didn't have (Columbus and Simcoe) and got the rest of the ingredients in from the local, so this brew is going to happen this week

 

[Pommy Matt]

Thanks for the advice on this thread - especially introducing the idea of the 'no chill' Bizier, which I have since spent a bit of time reading about, and ended up doing tonight.
I decided the simplest thing for me would be to do a smaller batch (10L) and a full boil, so I scaled back the recipe in Beersmith. I boiled the full amount (starting with 15L) tonight for 90 minutes and added the 90, 60 and 30 minute hop additions, along with a whirlfloc tablet @ 15 minutes. I decanted the whole lot into a 10L jerry can at flame out, using a jug and a funnel. Does anyone see a problem with this method? (no heat proof tube on hand). I tried to keep aeration to a minimum. Tomorrow I should have 10L of cool wort. If I get this down to say 5C in the fridge, I can then take out say 4L ?? and boil this up again for the late hop additions (15 mins and flameout). If I cool this amount in the sink, then add back to the 6L @ 5C I should have wort at pitchable temp very quickly.
The one thing I haven't decided on yet is whether to add dextrose to lower the final FG. The recipe is adjusted to it, to hit 7.5% ABV, but would still be over 6 without. Some forums in the US suggest adding the dextrose late (end of primary), as this helps keep the hops flavour fore most. I may do one 10L with and one without and compare.

For the record, here is the recipe. I used JW caramalt, not crystal 30L.

Can anyone see a problem with the process? In particular - how much of the wort would you reboil for the late hop additions?

cheers,
matt

BeerSmith 2 Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Green Flash WCIPA LME MY POT
Brewer: Matt
Asst Brewer:
Style: American IPA
TYPE: Extract
Taste: (30.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 15.00 l
Post Boil Volume: 13.11 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 10.00 l
Bottling Volume: 10.00 l
Estimated OG: 1.071 SG
Estimated Color: 11.3 SRM
Estimated IBU: 99.0 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 0.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
5.06 g Simcoe [12.20 %] - Boil 90.0 min Hop 5 17.1 IBUs
5.06 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.40 %] - Boil 90. Hop 4 20.1 IBUs
2.53 g Simcoe [12.20 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 7 8.0 IBUs
2.53 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.40 %] - Boil 60. Hop 6 9.4 IBUs
2.53 g Simcoe [12.20 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 9 6.1 IBUs
2.53 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.40 %] - Boil 30. Hop 8 7.2 IBUs
7.59 g Simcoe [12.20 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 11 11.9 IBUs
7.59 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.40 %] - Boil 15. Hop 10 14.0 IBUs
10.11 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 12 5.2 IBUs
6.24 g Simcoe [12.20 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 14 0.0 IBUs
6.24 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.40 %] - Boil 0.0 Hop 13 0.0 IBUs
6.24 g Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Day Hop 15 0.0 IBUs
6.24 g Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 19 0.0 IBUs
6.24 g Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Dry Hop Hop 18 0.0 IBUs
6.24 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 17 0.0 IBUs
6.24 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 16 0.0 IBUs
2.10 kg Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract 2 84.0 %
0.20 kg Corn Sugar (Dextrose) (0.0 SRM) Sugar 3 8.0 %
0.20 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 30L (30.0 SRM) Grain 1 8.0 %

 

[Bizier]

I think that you will do well boiling the largest amount of wort you can reasonably manage for the late hops, and using a sink or similar water bath to wash off the bulk of the heat as quick as possible, and then mix with your remaining wort pre-chilled to a low temperature.

Can I ask why you are only doing 10L?

I think if you are set on 10L, you should just go straight ahead and do it and learn from the experience.

Dextrose will add alcohol but no body, the dryness will only come if you are swapping it with a less fermentable ingredient like DME, you probably knew that, but it is worth noting. I suggest shooting for the original ABV of GF IPA, but don't go over 20% for simple sugars like dex.

 

[Pommy Matt]

I think that you will do well boiling the largest amount of wort you can reasonably manage for the late hops, and using a sink or similar water bath to wash off the bulk of the heat as quick as possible, and then mix with your remaining wort pre-chilled to a low temperature.

Can I ask why you are only doing 10L?

I think if you are set on 10L, you should just go straight ahead and do it and learn from the experience.

Dextrose will add alcohol but no body, the dryness will only come if you are swapping it with a less fermentable ingredient like DME, you probably knew that, but it is worth noting. I suggest shooting for the original ABV of GF IPA, but don't go over 20% for simple sugars like dex.

I'm doing 10L firstly because it lets me do a full boil in the equipment I have, but also because at this stage in my brewing career it will give me a chance to try more things without having to get through too much beer! I intend to boil up another 10L batch next week where I'll tweak a few things. Apart from the extra hassle per litre of brewing smaller batches, are there any other disadvantages?
For this batch I will chill the 10L as low as I can get it, then boil half with the late addition hops, sink chill and add back to the chilled remainder.
I did remove malt to allow for the dextrose in this one. For next week's I'll leave it as all malt and then compare the two in the bottle.

One thing that I did find interesting is that Beersmith reduced the amount of hops required for the full extract boil. more than just the proportional volume adjustment to 10L would suggest. Eg. at 22.7L full AG boil it suggested 7.09 g of hops @ 60 minutes. For the full extract 10L, it suggests 2.53g for the same addition, which is somewhat less than 7.09 / 2.27. I went with the Beersmith numbers but am curious as to the reason?


cheers again,
matt