Fermenting Same lager at 10c Vs 18c comparison on Brewing Radio

[dannymars]

Possibly OT: but WLP800 is a beast that I think would be pretty resilient to a range of different temps.

 

[mfeighan]

I wish my warm fermented lagers tasted as good as the cold fermented ones ( pitched cold and fermented cold ). It'd save a lot of time and some effort. But to me, they just don't taste anywhere near as good as when I make a big starter, pitch cold and just wait for them to be done. Even the pitched cold, then raised up quickly ones don't seem to be as good as just cold all the way

ferment under pressure, ever since i have been fooling around with it my lagers taste cleaner and it finishes faster.
My current schedule, cold pitch set controller (with the heating turned off) to 10, as soon as pressure builds to 100kpa (usually 2 days post pitching) i set the controller to naturally ramp to 15 deg. Beer is clean and usually finished in less than 8 days, i cold condition till the next weekend (or the weekend after that if im lazy) filter and carb. If im not lazy i have a very drinkable lager in 2 weeks but most of the time it takes me 3 as some weekends i just cbf.

a non pressurised example of a lager that i did with only temp control for the first 4 days and left it in the shed at ambient summer temps ~ 25-30c was amazing. Im pretty sure i just fluked it, but i purposely over pitched yeast my reasoning being the big breweries do it and im not after the yeast derived flavours that you want in an ale. I wanted room for another beer my fermenting fridge so i pulled out the lager. Turned out amazing 3 weeks later after only 4 days of temp control. Because of the effort involved in a brewday i am unwilling to repeat this process to see if its repeatable.

I do agree with MHB i haven't tried since going ag but i reckon some kits would be pretty tasty with proper temp control

 

[mje1980]

What fermenter do you have?

 

[droid]

such an experiment is underway here right now, because i've run out of fridge space, about 16ltrs of a 52ltr batch is in the pantry at ambient - the rest is at 9deg temp controlled. I'm just gonna let the pantry one run its course then fridge it for a few weeks it will be interesting to see how they stack up against each other

@damn fwiw if you run your fridge on a cold setting for conditioning a temp controller is not needed, that's what will prolly happen here as my temp controllers are otherwise occupied... anyway once its all over just fridge it around 0-2deg if poss

 

[mfeighan]

What fermenter do you have?

2x 50l conicals, rated to 100kpa

 

[pist]

I cant be bothered with lagers these days they tie up my kegs and fermenting fridge too long, but im also a fan of s189. Fairly lazy fermentation schedule. First week at 10oC. Then let it wander up as far as it wants to go to 16oC for a d rest second week, usually by then its at 1.020 or below, then just lager in primary for 2 weeks. Have had good results

 

[pist]

I personally would not allow primary fermentation to occur at that temperature. Many lager strains do throw some sulphur, stressing the yeast will only make the yeast throw more

 

[Rocker1986]

I cant be bothered with lagers these days they tie up my kegs and fermenting fridge too long, but im also a fan of s189. Fairly lazy fermentation schedule. First week at 10oC. Then let it wander up as far as it wants to go to 16oC for a d rest second week, usually by then its at 1.020 or below, then just lager in primary for 2 weeks. Have had good results

That's basically what I do as well although I allow it to come up to 18.. Have been using Wyeast 2001 lately and used this schedule each batch with decent results (except one that was sub-par due to other reasons).

 

[Futur]

This is useful. I question why I lagered mine for 5 weeks. Sorry to deviate.

Vouching for the lager method also - I've done three lagers with this method and they have all come out fantastic. Grain to glass was approximately 3 weeks.

EDIT: Thought it would be worth mentioning this was with WY 2308 Munich Lager without doing the gradual temperature changes specified in the method.

 

[Goose]

I wish my warm fermented lagers tasted as good as the cold fermented ones ( pitched cold and fermented cold ). It'd save a lot of time and some effort. But to me, they just don't taste anywhere near as good as when I make a big starter, pitch cold and just wait for them to be done. Even the pitched cold, then raised up quickly ones don't seem to be as good as just cold all the way

Yes, but many brewer's experience seems different and your conclusion would carry alot more clout if you put two beers genuinely brewed in the two different ways in front of a panel of tasters (the bigger the better) and let them decide. Granted, the only science in this approach, as with the Brulosophy bloke is the statistics applied to the results of the tasting panel.

btw I love a lager and volunteer to be on your panel .

 

[mje1980]

The only panel of tasters I'm worried about is me, and to me, my above conclusion sounds spot on .

 

[Goose]

The only panel of tasters I'm worried about is me, and to me, my above conclusion sounds spot on .

Good science requires that thou conclusion be verified by others

And repeatable.

 

[mje1980]

Youre right how silly of me. I guess I'll go back to pitching warm and just put up with the esters I don't like. Because science


Long story short, I was never happy with my lagers. Warm pitched and put into a cold fridge, i didnt really rate any of them. No science involved, just didn't love them. Since pitching cold, they're much better, more smooth and I like them much more. Again, no science just my preference. Shoot me if my preference doesn't come with a thesis

 

[Barge]

Have you tried s-189?

 

[mje1980]

Yes.

 

[Barge]

Have you tried s-189?

Yes.

Furry muff.

I agree with you. Go with what you like. I have made some really good Czech Pilsners with 189 fermented at 18C but that doesn't mean you have to.

Brew on! :drinks:

 

[Goose]

Youre right how silly of me. I guess I'll go back to pitching warm and just put up with the esters I don't like. Because science

LOL. Not sure I was suggesting that actually. You clearly have a high degree of confidence in your own taste buds, good for you.

I suppose I do not have the same gifted palate and therefore find the opinions of others quite valuable input.

That is all, thankyou, and goodnight.

 

[mje1980]

Apologies if I've missed something. I prefer my lagers cold pitched and cold fermented.

I dont often have others taste my beers apart from brew club events, so if I like the beer, that's good enough for me, I don't need others to concur with my opinions on said beer to enjoy it.

 

[Rocker1986]

I'm with mje here, not just with lagers but any style of beer - our brewing and serving practices are governed by our own tastebuds, not a panel of scientists, or anyone else for that matter. Unless you're putting beers into competitions you're brewing for yourself.

For me, the quick lager method works really well and I'm really happy with the resultant beers, so I will continue to use it. But that doesn't mean it works for everybody, and in that case, those brewers will find and use a method that does work for them, nothing wrong with that. B)

 

[Coodgee]

I find wy2112 makes fantastic clean lagers when fermented at 14 degrees. The only restriction with this yeast is that you never get a dry result but i like a malty lager anyway. The brew i put down on Saturday with a 2l starter pitched at 14 degrees was at final gravity by Wednesday. That's faster than many ale yeasts.