Do I Need Diacetyl Rest?

[kalbarluke]

I am in the process of brewing my first real lager. It is a fresh wort lager from the lhbs. I used a saflager yeast (1 pack - I know I should have probably used 2) and pitched at about 18-19 degrees. I have kept it in a temperature controlled environment at 12 degrees and it is now at 1020 gravity. I realise now that I should have piched at 12 degrees, but live and learn.

I tasted it and it does taste a bit malty/sugary but not necessarily of butterscotch. Should I still be tasting some sort of maltiness at 1020? Does it sound like I need to do
a diacetyl rest? Is it too late to start a diacetyl rest?

This whole lager proces is becoming a bit of a pain in the date. It better be worth it.

Any advice appreciated.

 

[Pennywise]

I'm not Lager expert by any means, but from my (admittadly limited) experience from pitching at higher temps is that you'll NEED a "d" rest, and especially pitching just 1 pack.

 

[Nick JD]

The rest has another benefit. It gives the yeast a nice warm environment to finish off any residual sugaz as well as the diacetyl. I've been known to do a rest a little early with lagers - by the time it's got to 20C it's all over.

I treat my lagers exactly like my ales - people insist lagers have to be babied and fluffed about. You'll get a lager that's 95% as good if you skip all the "lager" bullshit.

 

[DKS]

I am in the process of brewing my first real lager. It is a fresh wort lager from the lhbs. I used a saflager yeast (1 pack - I know I should have probably used 2) and pitched at about 18-19 degrees. I have kept it in a temperature controlled environment at 12 degrees and it is now at 1020 gravity. I realise now that I should have piched at 12 degrees, but live and learn.

I tasted it and it does taste a bit malty/sugary but not necessarily of butterscotch. Should I still be tasting some sort of maltiness at 1020? Does it sound like I need to do
a diacetyl rest? Is it too late to start a diacetyl rest?

This whole lager proces is becoming a bit of a pain in the date. It better be worth it.

Any advice appreciated.

No its not to late, too early yet if anything. What is your estimated FG?
Try to give more info as much as you can on a brew to help with answers.

 

[Pennywise]

The rest has another benefit. It gives the yeast a nice warm environment to finish off any residual sugaz as well as the diacetyl. I've been known to do a rest a little early with lagers - by the time it's got to 20C it's all over.

I treat my lagers exactly like my ales - people insist lagers have to be babied and fluffed about. You'll get a lager that's 95% as good if you skip all the "lager" bullshit.

Curious as to what temp you pitch at Nick? and the whole process to be honest, well yours anyway

 

[Nick JD]

Curious as to what temp you pitch at Nick? and the whole process to be honest, well yours anyway

With S189 I pitch at about 20C. By the time the yeast has become active and is fermenting the wort is down to 12C. This is similar to Wyeast's directions. At a few points before FG I up the temperature to 20C for a day.

Then I bring it back down to about 10C add gelatine and wait 2 days. I then add polyclar and wait a day. Then bottle.

The beer is crystal clear and tastes SFA different to lagering for weeks at 1C. I haven't done a back to back taste test, but I brew for my tongue, not a judge's - so I'm not too anal about it all.

 

[kalbarluke]

No its not to late, too early yet if anything. What is your estimated FG?
Try to give more info as much as you can on a brew to help with answers.

To tell you the truth, I don't really know the FG , but I'm assuming it's somewhere around 1012-1014.

Thanks to the people who have provided advice. I will probably start putting the temp up to 16 degrees very soon. May even post in a few weeks to tell you how it went.

 

[edddy57]

You ask 10 people about D rest and you'll get 14 different answers. I think you just have to choose one way and see how it goes. The regime I follow after a lot of reading is the D rest after approx 75% fermentation complete. This ensures most of the fermentation is at the low temp to produce the right style of beer ... but there is still activity going on and yeast in suspension. Raising the temp to around 18 - 19 C for a 2 - 3 days ensures everything gets cleaned up and also gives me assurance that the fermentation is complete (the higher temp finishes things off much quicker). Depending on the OG and expected FG, typically I do the D rest when the SG reaches somewhere around 1.020. I complete the fermentation at this higher temp and then crash chill before putting into a secondary and adding some gelatine.

 

[DKS]

You ask 10 people about D rest and you'll get 14 different answers. I think you just have to choose one way and see how it goes. The regime I follow after a lot of reading is the D rest after approx 75% fermentation complete. This ensures most of the fermentation is at the low temp to produce the right style of beer ... but there is still activity going on and yeast in suspension. Raising the temp to around 18 - 19 C for a 2 - 3 days ensures everything gets cleaned up and also gives me assurance that the fermentation is complete (the higher temp finishes things off much quicker). Depending on the OG and expected FG, typically I do the D rest when the SG reaches somewhere around 1.020. I complete the fermentation at this higher temp and then crash chill before putting into a secondary and adding some gelatine.

I mostly agree here eddy but there is a thing about lagers that for some reason they show up faults much more so than ales. Upping the temp too early could lead to off notes. I suggest D rest after primary ferment is complete at 12*, usually lower for me, then raise to 18* for at least 2 days then chill. If you are trying to make a lager quicker, you'll probably wish you hadn't in the end.
Daz

 

[kalbarluke]

For those who want to know, here is an update:

Waited for the SG to get to 1.018 and upped the temp to 20 degrees for two days. When the SG was 1.013 I racked into a secondary fermenter and crash chilled to 2 or 3 degrees (I have an analog temp controller) for a week. Bottled it this afternoon.

I didn't add gelatine or any other clearing agent. Never have but will one day.

People will probably say that I should have left it lager longer, but I am starting to get thirsty. Tasted it out of the fermenter and it was so nice I had another glass.

Plan to bottle for 3 weeks before consuming at a rapid pace.

Thanks to all people who gave valuable advice, especilly Eddy and Nick, who taught me that I don't need to stress when making a lager.