Design of 150L Brew stand and Plumbing

[5150]

Hi Guys,

I'm just in the process of building a new brew stand and rig and I was after everyone's feedback, good and bad.

A bit of about what I am after is a stand to hold three 150 Liter stainless pots. The mash tun will be suspended half way up and 150mm to the front to allow me to tip the kettle over 90° to make it a little easier to clean and empty when I make big beers. It'll just be made from 50x50mm 2.4mm steel tube. I'm just going to go square cut as I can get the local shop to cut it for me as apposed to me having to buy a drop saw to cut all my 45°.

Anyway, I hope the image appears below as I just opened a photo bucket account just for this. :unsure:



As long as these images are appearing here is a pic of the plumbing I am thinking. Sorry the above image and this one is pretty basic. Everything is plumbed so that I don't have to move hoses etc while brewing. I feel like there is a ridiculous amount of hoses and plumbing, so please be as harsh as you like. Also wondering peoples opinion of plumbing with copper/Stainless as apposed to silicon??? I know it will have to do with cleaning.



Thanks in advance guys.

If my images didn't work here are the links to images.

 

[Mardoo]

Hi, I know very little so have no advice I can offer, other than the bad kind. If I'm reading the plumbing diagram correctly it appears you have the kettle set up for recirculation. If that's the case, being pretty inexperienced, I'm wondering why would you do that? Cheers.

 

[Cocko]

Whirlpool.

 

[5150]

Yeah as Cocko said, Whirlpool.

Any other comments or suggestions??? :unsure:

 

[davedoran]

Could look at having the vessels at different heights and gravity feed the whole way along. Saw it done before and seems to work very well.
HLT on top, Mash (Lauter) Next and Kettle after that. Kettle just up high enough to fill cubes.
That way if you still wanna do the pump you should only need it to recirculate around the mash.

Like the idea of recirc the cooling water to hlt though.

Whats the Hex between HLT and mash for?

1.6mm wall will be plenty strong for those volumes.

 

[gava]

Only thing i can see is that you are dumping the wort from the top of the Boil Kettle, I'd push it in the bottom tap so it doesn't splash plus a combination of whirlpool connection lower down the pot.. there's some theories about Hot Side Aeration doing stuff to your wort.. Personally I think in home brew scale its a load of crap but if its not.....

you can make up your own mind : http://byo.com/aeration/item/1613-when-do-you-need-to-worry-about-hot-side-aeration

Cheers
Gavin.

 

[Cocko]

I think it looks great, only thing I would think about is run of entering the bottom of the kettle rather than the top, avoiding splashing/HSA.

Other than that, looks great.

My preference is silicon, purely for ease of use and cleaning purposes - I would alway be wondering if a hard plumbed system is clean.

Keep us posted, looks like it is gonna be a killer rig!

Cheers


Edit: Beaten by Gava - Great minds....

 

[5150]

Could look at having the vessels at different heights and gravity feed the whole way along. Saw it done before and seems to work very well.
HLT on top, Mash (Lauter) Next and Kettle after that. Kettle just up high enough to fill cubes.
That way if you still wanna do the pump you should only need it to recirculate around the mash.

Like the idea of recirc the cooling water to hlt though.

Whats the Hex between HLT and mash for?

1.6mm wall will be plenty strong for those volumes.

Thanks Dave, I've currently got a three tier Keggle system, but as I am kicking it up a notch I'm going to do step mash's hence the HEX unit.
I decided on 2.4mm steel just because I haven't really done any welding since school over 20 years ago and figure it'll be a little easier.


Gavin and Cocko, my plan, (even though you can't see it anywhere in my design) is for the wort to enter from the top but it will be piped to the bottom for whirl-pooling and to avoid HSA. Would this be ok? I have to be honest, I haven't been whirlpooling before and I'm just trying to figure everything out.

I hear what you are saying Cocko about not knowing how clean the pipes are inside, so I think I will go for silicon, It's just so damn expensive -_- . I'll be plumbing it all with some garden hose, (Cheap), to leak test and flow test before I start ordering my silicon.

I will keep you posted about how it all goes, My third 150 Litre pot arrived today with a dent, so I called the supplier and I think they will be sending out another.
I also got my two 210,000 BTU/hr burners. Two bikes are on ebay to make room, so it's all happening.

 

[Cocko]

Gavin and Cocko, my plan, (even though you can't see it anywhere in my design) is for the wort to enter from the top but it will be piped to the bottom for whirl-pooling and to avoid HSA. Would this be ok? I have to be honest, I haven't been whirlpooling before and I'm just trying to figure everything out.

I hear what you are saying Cocko about not knowing how clean the pipes are inside, so I think I will go for silicon, It's just so damn expensive -_- . I'll be plumbing it all with some garden hose, (Cheap), to leak test and flow test before I start ordering my silicon.

I will keep you posted about how it all goes, My third 150 Litre pot arrived today with a dent, so I called the supplier and I think they will be sending out another.
I also got my two 210,000 BTU/hr burners. Two bikes are on ebay to make room, so it's all happening.

Whirlpool: I don't run a whirlpool personally, I have the bits but am scared to drill a hole in my 98L robinox... maybe one day - anyway, from what I understand you would want it about 1/3 to 1/2 way up the wort volume. While planning obviously allow for boil off and different batch sizes, if you plan on doing that. So, if you come in to the at the top, you will need some pipe running down into the kettle and this should face in to the pot/wort to create the whirlpool, so if running off your mash through it, it would not avoid splashing - again, all from my understanding, not experience, maybe a more edumacated brewer can confirm?

Silicon and cam locks or snap locks are expensive, yes, but last for ever... but I can't see hard plumbing and fittings being a hell of a lot different, maybe a touch cheaper but not a hell of a lot. It is the same amount of fittings - Compression and threads etc... either way, buy once/buy right.

Hope it helps.

Cheers

 

[Dan Pratt]

absolutely no affiliation - contact TS Valves for any camlocks for the setup. QLDKev suggested it on another thread and i checked them out, they have greaaat prices

 

[Grainer]

whirlpool with a spoon !

 

[MastersBrewery]

whirlpool with a spoon !

100L+ thats some spoon

 

[lukiferj]

Awesome rig. Look forward to seeing progress shots.

 

[stakka82]

I have a 50 l brau and whirlpool with my ss mash paddle. It's huge and I got it from kk.

Sometimes have 60+ litres in the kettle and if anything the paddle is oversized for rhe job. I reckon it could handle 150l comfortable. When you get the momentum up you have to put very little effort in. 2c.

 

[5150]

Thanks again Cocko, my understanding of whirlpool is pretty much exactly what you have state above. I will probably have a couple of different pipes to run down the side for wort transfer and whirlpooling depending on the size of the batch. I know you are right about the plumbing doing it once/right. Just counted out my taps and there will be 20, excessive I know, but it will allow me to do everything I want with having to move pipes/tubing around. like you said do it once. :icon_cheers: I'm still deciding between Camlock and Tri clover as in the end it's not going to be a major difference in cost?

Thanks Pratty for the tip, I'll give them a yell on Monday for a quote :icon_cheers:

If I have the pump there I may as well use it instead of using a paddle to whirlpool

Thanks lukiferj I'll post shots as soon as anything exciting stats to happen. At the moment I just have pics of a bedroom with three big ass pots and two hard core burners :super:

 

[Cocko]

If I built or did my build again I would go tri-clover..... I went Cam lock, which are awesome BTW!! But I still see tri-clover and think.. Hmm... they just look cool.


Anyway mate, design, think, re-design, think again.. I am sure you will nail it!!

Can't wait to see the pix!

 

[Camo6]

Nice looking plan 5250. Just looking at your plumbing and wondering about your sparge method. Looks good for batch sparging but if you're using pump 1 for both HLT and MT you won't be able to fly sparge (not that there's anything wrong with that). Could you use pump 2 for whirlpooling kettle and recircing the mash? Apologies if I've overlooked something, I'm dead sober ATM.

 

[QldKev]

whirlpool with a spoon !

100L+ thats some spoon

I whirlpool my 112L batch with my mash paddle.

I got it from Craftbrewer. Can't remember the price, but it was a lot cheaper than I expected. To give you an idea of scale, that's my 100L mash tun. Sorry about the pic, I took it just now.

 

[5150]

Nice looking plan 5250. Just looking at your plumbing and wondering about your sparge method. Looks good for batch sparging but if you're using pump 1 for both HLT and MT you won't be able to fly sparge (not that there's anything wrong with that). Could you use pump 2 for whirlpooling kettle and recircing the mash? Apologies if I've overlooked something, I'm dead sober ATM.

Thanks Camo6, I had been planning on doing batch sparging as I had some terrible results trying to fly sparge when I first started into AG, but it would only be an extra tap and two three way connectors to allow that. Great suggestion and thanks again.

QldKev, I just order this mash paddle today and I'll punch a few holes through it, I was tempted to get their 1300mm version but I thought it was pushing it. Question for you Kev if you don't mind, how do you find your ramp times with your HEX? and what element do you have in it. I just built the same one with a 2200w kettle element and I'm a little worried about times on big batches, I was thinking of rebuilding one with two kettle elements, but my trouble then becomes the power available in my garage.

Cheers,
Richard

 

[MastersBrewery]

I whirlpool my 112L batch with my mash paddle.

I got it from Craftbrewer. Can't remember the price, but it was a lot cheaper than I expected. To give you an idea of scale, that's my 100L mash tun. Sorry about the pic, I took it just now.

see that aint a spoon, its a blood boat oar