Debunking the raw food fraud/diet

[Mr. No-Tip]

So I've been invited to a raw food feast on sunday. The attendees are not militant hipsters, they are more moderate hipsters, of which I would describe myself one. They are interested in the raw food concept, but open to reality.

Some raw food capers talk about 'sea vegetables' and a bunch of other stuff, but my plan is to bring some marinated oysters and jerky to the party. IT'S MEATY, BUT MEETYS THE RULES, ya jerks.

...Cept I am not sure that my dehydrated jerky meets the militant 42 degrees standard of the raw food nazi. From what I understand, rawists feel that food dies at the point it is heated as the enzymes are robbed of their lifeforce (denatured to those of us that prefer to be objective). The raw foodist's measure seems to be 40ishdegreees

Any brewer knows that our enzymes are only getting their acid on at this point - they've got a summer's range before they start denaturing.

I plan to take this to the fairly open minded party this weekend. Hey guys, guess what? This no boil berliner is raw food by any realistic definition, but not by the militant one. This jerky is raw, unless you're a dick.

Am I missing something, or is the whole raw food caper based on a ridiculous assumption that enzymes LOSE THIER LIFEFORCE about fourty something degrees?

 

[manticle]

A lot of proteins are denatured around/above 40 deg.

That in itself means nothing as proteins are complicated, specific strings of amino acids and our bodies can't often (could be seldom/never - can't remember) just take specific proteins and make them work for us. Many amino acids are produced internally but some essential ones we need to get from diet. Proteins make things what they are structurally so chicken skin is different to human skin for example.

Also while many proteins and enzymes are debatured above 40, many others aren't and may be optimised well above that.

Raw often retains certain nutrients including vitamins but enzymes and proteins are maybe a different bag of carrots.

 

[Mardoo]

There's a spectrum. There are folks who base it on the belief that our bodies need enzymes to function and eating raw thereby increases enzyme load available to the body. There are folks who don't want to hurt the life force of the the little enzy-beasties. There are life-force theorists:

http://www.amazon.com/Raw-Food-Life-Force-Energy/dp/0061344656

I'm guessing it's not total bullshit, but rather an extreme interpretation of some simple information. "Our bodies need enzymes. Therefore our entire diet should be about getting more enzymes." Doesn't seem to make sense to focus on increasing enzyme load without using cooking to break down foods in specific ways to make their components more accessible to enzymes, but then I'm not hungry for eternal youth, which seems to drive a lot of these folks.

Generally things like this are based on something scientific someone heard about and thought sounded awesome and then built into a theory of living that they later realized they could make money propounding. I have just noted the fact that pretty much every culture includes eating raw foods as part of their diet, and seems to think it's important. So I make an effort to do so.

 

[TSMill]

I like how you can be hipster, but anyone more hipster than you is a dick!

 

[slcmorro]

Take Biltong instead. Definitely doesn't get over 42 degrees.

 

[slcmorro]

(and it's a hundred times better than boring old jerky)

 

[joshF]

I think if enzymes in foods are the only thing they're worried about then it's pretty narrow minded. Eating a strictly raw food diet eliminates the potential for eating chicken..... CHICKEN for gods sake.

No great story ever started with someone eating a salad :lol: I think there's still plenty of alternatives for those people who want to eat 'clean'. From what i've read, the whole paleo diet thing is pretty much based on eating non-processed 'clean' foods that you can still actually taste.

While few will dispute that raw probably holds more nutritional value, we only live once so may aswell make each meal taste semi decent. Raw cauliflower... OR cooked cauliflower with heaps of salt and that white sauce with pepper. I know which one tastes better and if they say the raw one does they are lying !!!!! Hmmmm :icon_drool2:

 

[manticle]

I was with you until you mentioned cauliflower.

 

[Not For Horses]

Eating a strictly raw food diet eliminates the potential for eating chicken..... CHICKEN for gods sake.

You'd be surprised actually.
There are many people that eat raw chicken and are perfectly fine. It's not really advised, but eating a raw diet certainly doesn't eliminate it.

It's not for me though.

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

(and it's a hundred times better than boring old jerky)

The couple times oven had biltong, I've not enjoyed it all that much. The fat/oil doesn't render or the cuts have too much to begin with. I don't like the mouth coating it gives.

Also, jerky? Boring? You haven't had my peach lambic habanero death jerky yet, clearly!

 

[Bribie G]

Chimpanzees occasionally eat raw meat, especially colobus monkeys.

However the main reason that we developed big brains and don't spend our days sitting in the dirt eating vast amounts of raw chewy nuts and tubers, grimacing, scratching fleas and making grunting noises (unless you live in Caboolture South) is that we devoloped fire and cooking. Fire remains have been found in Homo Erectus caves in China and it's fairly well accepted that the subsequent Homo Sapiens (us) have always cooked.

 

[stakka82]

Nothing over 42 degrees eh? That would render all Victorian produce in fields this week inedible.

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

Nothing over 42 degrees eh? That would render all Victorian produce in fields this week inedible.

Winner!

 

[Scooby Tha Newbie]

Mate on one side the raw food movement has good intentions. but most of the info they give out is misleading and plain incorrect.


http://www.beyondveg.com/

 

[Scooby Tha Newbie]

You should be safe. Just don't give them your bank details.

 

[Airgead]

Yeah, actually, it is all total bull$hit.

The whole enzyme argument is crap. Some get denatured at 42 others (like... I dunno. the amalayse we use in a mash...) denature much higher.

The protein argument is crap as well. Proteins denaturing is nutritionally a good thing. We don't want whole proteins, we want the amino acids so we can build our own proteins. Digestion breaks down proteins. Cooking helps the process.

Likewise starches. Likewise complex carbs.

Essentially it then comes down to "essential life force" which is basically new age crap.

OK. Some vitamins etc do degrade with heat (so don't boil everything till its grey) but general cooking actually makes more nutrients available to the body not less. it has been theorised that the introduction of cooking and thus the big increase in available nutrients was what helped us evolve big brains.

Its a pity we use those big brains to come up with rubbish like the raw food movement.

Cheers
Dave

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Bacon.......have you had raw bacon.....no contest.

 

[Bribie G]

Unfortunately a lot of faddist diets are taken up by young people like fifteen year old girls who, like, say, like, like meat? eeewwww, like gross like. Like.

When you are young, say under 35, you can withstand stupid diets because you still have the reserves of fitness and repair - ability of the body. However once you get into your overthehump years stuff like raw foodism or can I even be politically incorrect, Atkins, can be positively life shortening.

I'm a diet-ist myself but whatever method I'm trying I always make sure they include good real food like veg, fruit, dairy, pig, eggs (not raw), ale, etc.


edit: interesting debunking site, raw food is on page 5

 

[Greg.L]

This is just one of a number of modern systems based on magical beliefs. Biodynamics, astrology, homeopathy, chiropractic, all the other alternative medicine stuff, they are all based on mystical insights into the nature of the universe, without the bother of evidence or research. Maybe they are filling a void left by the lack of relevance in modern life of the established imaginary belief systems eg christianity islam etc, or maybe its just an easy way to make a buck.

 

[Airgead]

, or maybe its just an easy way to make a buck.

Got it in one methinks.

Selling easy solutions to the ill informed and gullible.