Cube swollen

[bpt]

I've got a cube of Pilsner that is swelling, I've opened it up to relieve the pressure and smell it, it just smells like normal fermentation. I haven't put any yeast in obviously so it is an infection of some description. I thought an infection would smell rank/rancid?
Should I ditch it now or ferment it properly?
Cheers
Tom.

 

[S.E]

I've got a cube of Pilsner that is swelling, I've opened it up to relieve the pressure and smell it, it just smells like normal fermentation. I haven't put any yeast in obviously so it is an infection of some description. I thought an infection would smell rank/rancid?
Should I ditch it now or ferment it properly?
Cheers
Tom.

Just loosen the lid and let it ferment as it is. If it tastes OK when it’s finished drink it , if it doesn’t tip it.

Edit: There’s not much else worth doing at this stage.
Cheers Sean

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Definitely ditch as its the only time with beer that you can end up with harmful toxins if botulism is the infection (although I think botulism can smell rank, experts?).. best to be safe and take it as a learning curve though. If you didnt tip yeast in the most likely whatever itnis wont taste like a nice beer along the lines of your intended recipe.

 

[kevo]

Had my first swollen cube recently.

Tried to salavage, then thought better of it, ditched the beer and the cube too - just to be on the safe side.

I vote ditch the beer and the cube too. Happy to be over ruled though...

 

[OneEye]

You could take a gravity reading and see if it's dropped, that will tell you for sure if something has got a hold of the sugazzz

 

[bpt]

I'm thinking I'll ditch it, it was part of a double batch anyway.
Thanks for the tips
Cheers Tom.

 

[Spiesy]

Just a thought, but it could be wild yeast at work...

 

[geneabovill]

You mentioned 'normal fermentation smell'.. Maybe it's infected with something good.

I'd let it ferment out, give some to the neighbour, and if they don't die, and it tastes good, drink it.

 

[Yob]

Any swollen cube should be tipped, it's not worth the risk

 

[r055c0]

Listening to the latest episode of basic brewing this morning and they touched on this. Apparently botulism cant survive in beer so if it is actually fermenting & producing alcohol the risk should be zero. I'd be inclined to see if the gravity is dropping, and if it is let it ferment out. It might still taste shit but then again it might not.

If you've already written it off then you've got nothing to lose

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Yes but botulism is not the problem, its the toxins they produce so if they produce some before you ferment (as it swells) then these toxins are still there in the beer and could be at a dangerous level.

For me its playing with fire. Spend the time and effort up front ensuring that a swollen cube wont occur.

 

[Yob]

Listening to the latest episode of basic brewing this morning and they touched on this. Apparently botulism cant survive in beer so if it is actually fermenting & producing alcohol the risk should be zero. I'd be inclined to see if the gravity is dropping, and if it is let it ferment out. It might still taste shit but then again it might not.

If you've already written it off then you've got nothing to lose

Beer no, wort yes, and they will consume sugars and produce gas, if the cube is swelling without yeast being added, the risk is quite high. Unacceptably so.

 

[GalBrew]

The odds of it being botulism that has infected the wort is quite low, it is probably just wild yeast. That being said I wouldn't risk it. I would be tipping it, not worth the risk for a batch of beer.

Perhaps there is something off with your cubing technique? How did you cube this wort exactly? If done properly it should be fine for up to 1 year at least (I have found anyway).

 

[S.E]

Such a difference in opinions. :lol: While it is being discussed here if it’s best to keep or dump a possible wild yeast ferment this thread has started up with someone deliberately trying to start one. http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/80016-another-wild-yeast-fermentation/#entry1171535

 

[rotten]

Ditch it as you said you would. Nuke the cube or ditch that too.

Botulism h34r:

 

[S.E]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lambic

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lambic

Unless the OP lives in the Pajottenland region of Belgium, I'd be more wary that it's not "spontaneous" fermentation of the ideal kind. He had a sealed cube that should have been cleaned and sanitized. The fact something has happened, whether it ends up being harmful or not, demonstrates that the OP's cleaning/sanitizing regime did not work for some reason in this instance.

No matter what reasoning anyone comes up with here, the risk of botulism, whilst unlikely, is not something anyone on here should tell the OP to ignore, plain and simple.

 

[Yob]

A sealed swollen cube is more likely to be the result of spores than wild yeast.. Hence the unacceptable risks

 

[kahlerisms]

I'm thinking I'll ditch it, it was part of a double batch anyway.
Thanks for the tips
Cheers Tom.

I had this exact issue and wrote about it here:

http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/79331-how-much-infection-is-too-much-infection-swollen-cube/

 

[pcmfisher]

Unless the OP lives in the Pajottenland region of Belgium, I'd be more wary that it's not "spontaneous" fermentation of the ideal kind. He had a sealed cube that should have been cleaned and sanitized. The fact something has happened, whether it ends up being harmful or not, demonstrates that the OP's cleaning/sanitizing regime did not work for some reason in this instance.

No matter what reasoning anyone comes up with here, the risk of botulism, whilst unlikely, is not something anyone on here should tell the OP to ignore, plain and simple.

Except if it is infact botulism.

As stated, botulism spores are not killed by normal boiling.
They are in your wort when it goes into the cube.
No amount of cube sanitation or any sanitattion proceedure is going to get rid of them.

They are there. Just like in honey and on potatoes.

The question is, why would these spores decide to give off toxins in the op's wort and not anyone else's??

I think this is a pretty important question if there is any chance at all of it being botulism, because holding your mouth a different way while mixing up your starsan ain't going to make any difference.