cube expanding ?

[adryargument]

Hmmm, i have done about 10 no chill cubes so far....
I simply wash them out with tap water - i never sanitise or clean them?? They seem to disinfect themselves from the 100'C wort, once tipped sideways.

I often leave them for 2-3 weeks before use...

 

[AndrewQLD]

Hmmm, i have done about 10 no chill cubes so far....
I simply wash them out with tap water - i never sanitise or clean them?? They seem to disinfect themselves from the 100'C wort, once tipped sideways.

I often leave them for 2-3 weeks before use...

You've been lucky, and could be for a while longer to.
Don't forget though that most bacteria and yeasts in the labs are propogated using a malt base, why? because they thrive on the stuff.
The more you sanitize the less chance of an infection, but there is still a chance.

 

[GalBrew]

Perhaps if we all apply the no chill technique properly there will be fewer problems. I have never had an issue no chilling as I pour near boiling wort into the cube, push the air out, seal it up and allow the hot wort to pasteurise the sanitised cube buy periodically changing it from side to side as it cool at room temp. No fridge, no pool, no water additions, just let it do its thing.

 

[Black Devil Dog]

Into every new or recently used cube or fermenter, I thoughly wash and rinse, then I pour boiling water straight from the kettle, put the lid on and swirl the water around, leave it for about half an hour before I empty.

Anything inside there must surely be dead?

Well, just in case, I sanitise it with starsan. Then I either re-use it, or let it dry.

If I don't re-use it straight away, when it comes time to use it again, it gets another dose of boiling water followed by starsan.

Overkill? The bugs probably agree.

EDIT: Punktuation

 

[stakka82]

If you're going to dilute, do so with boiling water, and make sure there's less than 5% air in the cube once sealed. Ideally much less than that.

 

[manticle]

Hmmm, i have done about 10 no chill cubes so far....
I simply wash them out with tap water - i never sanitise or clean them?? They seem to disinfect themselves from the 100'C wort, once tipped sideways.

I often leave them for 2-3 weeks before use...

Yum

I used to work in commercial kitchens. Because the beefstock would be boiled for 12+ hours, we never washed the pot - just a quick rinse with tap water and add in some beef bones and veg and water.

I've made fried rice and never washed the pan. Just rely on the heat to cook out the bugs.

Yum

 

[Rocker1986]

My usual routine with cubes is once poured into the FV, give them a rinse out with water to get most of the crud out, then I tip some Napisan in and fill them up and let them sit a couple of days, or however long it takes me to be bothered tipping it out and thoroughly rinsing it out. When I'm ready to fill one I give it a triple rinse in hot tap water then fill it with near boiling wort, push as much air out as possible and seal it up. Never had a problem.

I daresay the culprit in this case was probably topping up half the cube with water. Though, that's a pretty bloody small batch to put into a 20 litre cube??

 

[adryargument]

Into every new or recently used cube or fermenter, I thoughly wash and rinse, then I pour boiling water straight from the kettle, put the lid on and swirl the water around, leave it for about half an hour before I empty.

Anything inside there must surely be dead?

Sorry to be a pain, but... If your 23L brew kettle wort is boiling and you fill up the cube.... surely it is doing the exact same thing as 1L from a kettle? But 23x more effectively?
When you evaluate it in the same way, you are doing the exact same thing... just doubling up on workload..?.??

As long as theres *no* large amount of air, then nothing really survives at 90+ degrees for 10+ minutes. Except botulism, in that event you may as well castrate yourself now as they live in the shitter to.

@ manticle - very easy and basic wins every time

IMO swollen cubes comes down to chilling them to quickly - why throw them in a pool etc?? The reason they are no chill is to kill bugs and make life simpler. Kick them over and go make some margaritas instead.

 

[manticle]

You really don't clean it? Do you do that with anything else in the house you cook or brew with?

I agree with making no chill simple but not so simple you decide cleaning is complicated.

I was joking about stockpots and rice for anyone silly enough to miss that.

 

[GalBrew]

Honestly, no-chilling is such an easy technique to NOT **** up. It amazes me that anyone ever does. Sanitised cube + hot wort + as little headspace as possible = stable cubed wort.

 

[syl]

I clean the cubes after use
Then I boil a kettle and chuck it in the cube and give it a good swirl then empty
I clean the cubes before use
Kettle again
Iodophor and 10L of water and let it rest for around an hour
Dump that
Cube wort with next to no air
After 10 minutes or so it goes in the pool

Isn't that how FWK's are made? They keep them for weeks/months??? I keep my cubes the same.

 

[Rocker1986]

I'm not sure if FWKs are cooled faster after the initial 10 or 15 minutes or just left to cool down to room temp on their own, but they are "no-chilled" yes. I also have cubes that I have kept for weeks/months with no issue, fermenting one at the moment actually. That's a stupid term to me anyway, no-chilling infers that the wort is left at 90 degrees the whole time. :lol:

 

[GalBrew]

I'm not sure if FWKs are cooled faster after the initial 10 or 15 minutes or just left to cool down to room temp on their own, but they are "no-chilled" yes. I also have cubes that I have kept for weeks/months with no issue, fermenting one at the moment actually. That's a stupid term to me anyway, no-chilling infers that the wort is left at 90 degrees the whole time. :lol:

I believe 'no-chill' refers to the fact that there is no active chilling of the wort. Perhaps a better description would be 'passive chilling'??

 

[pcmfisher]

Apart from bugs, I would be cleaning new cubes rather well before use anyway.
Just to get rid of any undesirables from the plastic manufacture.

 

[syl]

Apart from bugs, I would be cleaning new cubes rather well before use anyway.
Just to get rid of any undesirables from the plastic manufacture.

I heat up a batch of Oxyper to 70 degrees in the Braumeister and then cube the oxyper overnight. Clears up any plastic smells and cleans the BM all in one!

 

[rusty274]

Hey guys, sorry for the noob question. Why use a "cube"? I'm still on kits so I don't think it apples to me? Is just a way of storing wort till your ready to ferment or a safer way to bring the temp down till your ready to pitch the yeast? If someone has a link on cubing I'd like to learn some more about it? My books don't cover this topic.

 

[mosto]

Hey guys, sorry for the noob question. Why use a "cube"? I'm still on kits so I don't think it apples to me? Is just a way of storing wort till your ready to ferment or a safer way to bring the temp down till your ready to pitch the yeast? If someone has a link on cubing I'd like to learn some more about it? My books don't cover this topic.

Hi rusty, I've just commenced AG brewing and I no-chill. Traditional thinking was that you need to bring your wort down from boiling to pitching temp ASAP, to avoid infections and other undesirable problems. You do this by using a chiller, either an immersion chiller or plate chiller, as a rule. A relatively new technique is no chilling. This is where you drain your near boiling wort into a cube (basically a plastic water drum etc, usually comes in a cube shape). You fill to it almost to the brim. You then carefully squeeze the cube to expel any air out. Then you lay the cube on it's side, top etc so every internal surface has contact with near boiling wort for 15 min or so. This should kill off any nasties that may be lurking in the cube. The benfits of no chilling, for me anyway, are less cost (don't need to buy/make a chiller) and you don't have to put into fermenter straight away. With 3 kids under 6, I take any opportunity to brew when it presents itself, as I may not have a chance for a while. By no chilling, even if I don't have a spare fermenter, I can brew and store in a cube until one becomes free.

Sorry, someone else may have a useful link, but hopefully that gives you a quick run down on no chilling in cubes and the reasons behind it.

 

[Black Devil Dog]

Sorry to be a pain, but... If your 23L brew kettle wort is boiling and you fill up the cube.... surely it is doing the exact same thing as 1L from a kettle? But 23x more effectively?
When you evaluate it in the same way, you are doing the exact same thing... just doubling up on workload..?.??

As long as theres *no* large amount of air, then nothing really survives at 90+ degrees for 10+ minutes. Except botulism, in that event you may as well castrate yourself now as they live in the shitter to.

@ manticle - very easy and basic wins every time

IMO swollen cubes comes down to chilling them to quickly - why throw them in a pool etc?? The reason they are no chill is to kill bugs and make life simpler. Kick them over and go make some margaritas instead.

You are probably right, but it's not very often that I tip a cube into the fermenter and fill it back up straight away, so my cleaning regime is the same for cubes as for fermenters.

Like I also said, it might be overkill, but I'm happy to spend an extra 5 minutes doing what I do.

Creating good habits takes about the same amount of time as bad ones.

 

[NickB]

Like many pervious, my no-chill procedure is to clean with PBW or similar, then starsan. Only cubes I've lost are from leaky caps or the one the dog chewed

Cheers

 

[Rocker1986]

I believe 'no-chill' refers to the fact that there is no active chilling of the wort. Perhaps a better description would be 'passive chilling'??

Yeah, I figured that was the case. Either that or natural chilling. I was just having a bit of a joke about really, taking it as literally as it's written.