Coopers Pale Ale Clone Hows It Look?

[AndrewQLD]

Hi all,

I am attempting a Coopers pale ale clone for a friend and was hoping to get some critique. Most of the information for this recipe has come from a couple of books I have, " Amber and Black" ( which has a photo of a whiteboard at the coopers brewery with grain listings and amounts for all of their brews and kits) and also " the ultimate beer encyclopedia).
Also, I know the sugar content looks high, but after working the figures back from the final ABV it appears that about 18-20% of sugar is used by Coopers and this seems to be whta I have heard from other sources as well.

Any comments would be appreciated.
Regards
Andrew

BeerSmith Recipe Printout - www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Coopers Pale Ale Clone
Brewer: Andrew Clark
Asst Brewer:
Style: Australian Pale Ale
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 23.00 L
Boil Size: 28.84 L
Estimated OG: 1.043 SG
Estimated Color: 7.5 EBC
Estimated IBU: 26.5 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.00 kg Pale Malt, Traditional Ale (Joe White) (5Grain 79.6 %
0.10 kg Wheat Malt, Malt Craft (Joe White) (3.5 EGrain 2.7 %
0.02 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L (157.6 EBC) Grain 0.5 %
23.00 gm Pride Of Ringwood [10.00%] (60 min) Hops 26.5 IBU
1.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
0.65 kg Cane (Beet) Sugar (0.0 EBC) Sugar 17.2 %
1 Pkgs Coopers Pale Ale (Coopers Bottle) [StartYeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 3.12 kg
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temp Step Time
Mash In Add 9.36 L of water at 73.2 C 65.6 C 60 min

 

[Gough]

Hi Andrew,

I brewed an experimental Aust Ale style in January which leaned a little more toward the Sparkling Ale style. I used no sugar but mashed cool -64*- in the hope of extra attenuation and less body/higher alcohol etc. I'm very happy with the results, but without the sugar + extra malt it does still have more 'body' than the original. My only thought looking at your recipe is the high IBU, particularly for the lighter Pale Ale. I targeted 24 IBU with an OG of 1048 (all POR) and I reckon it is pretty close to the Sparkling in bitterness. Maybe over 26 IBU in the Pale Ale is a touch bitter?

My ingredients:
4.60 kg JWM Export Pilsner (3.9 EBC) Grain 95.8 %
0.15 kg JWM Wheat Malt (3.9 EBC) Grain 3.1 %
0.05 kg TF Crystal (145.8 EBC) Grain 1.0 %
15.00 gm Pride of Ringwood [10.00%] (60 min) Hops 18.1 IBU
10.00 gm Pride of Ringwood [10.00%] (15 min) Hops 6.0 IBU
0.50 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs Coopers Pale Ale Culture (Coopers) [Starter 1500 ml] Yeast-Ale

OG 1048
FG 1005



Just a thought given my recent brew. Yours looks a more authentic recipe than mine, just thought the IBU's might be a bit high given my recent experience.

Shawn.

 

[AndrewQLD]

Hi Shawn,

According to the two books I have they both agree on 26 IBU as being the target for this beer, They also say that that the sparkling ale is 26 ibu's as well but with a higher ABV of 5.8% as opposed to 4.5% for the pale ale.

Your final gravity is excellent and what that beer is supposed to finish at according to Dr Cooper in an online interview that I read the excerpts of from the craftbrewers website.


Thanks for the comments.
Andrew

 

[Gough]

Thanks for the info Andrew. I was aiming at a 1008-1010 finish bringing my beer in between the two Cooper's Ales but the yeast just kept on giving! 1005 is the lowest finish I've had since my really early K+K days. I guess now I can say I was definitely planning on getting exactly right all along It isn't a bad beer so I'm happy... Good luck with yours,

Shawn.

 

[Dunkel_Boy]

I actually thought the paley was a bit more simple that that... ie 100% Schooner pale ale malt, with POR used all the way through. Gravities you can figure out, and 26IBUs doesn't sound that far-fetched.
Sparkling ale definitely has some crystal in it, I guess you're only adding 20g, but seems a little strange still...

Oh, by the way, 64C sounds like a good mash temp.

 

[Weizguy]

It isn't a bad beer so I'm happy...

[post="47355"][/post]​

Gotta agree, Gough. Not bad at all. A bit strong to be a quaffer, but you could sure knock back a couple of longnecks before your head spins round and your tatse buds become saturated with that maltiness.
A bit of sugar would have made it a bit thinner (and more Aussie), but that was prob not what U were aiming for.
BTW, good to see U make urself available to young Lucas next mash day. Mighty neighbourly. :super:
Did U get to Paddy's last week. I'm still hoping to go there on Friday (Newcastle Show holiday), and maybe catch up with Gerard @ Paddy's. :beer:
Seth out

 

[Gough]

THanks Weiz. I was mainly experimenting to see if I could get something approaching the Coopers style without added sugar. Was aiming for an ABV between the Pale and the Sparkling (around 5% or thereabouts) and tried a cooler mash to keep it closish to style. Ended up with even higher attenuation than I expected and an ABV of 5.6% which is a bees dick off the Sparkling Ale in strength. I'm happy with the beer and will brew it again, but you're right, if I'm going to do a clone brew I'll need to use some sugar. That was the experimental bit - an Aussie style Ale without sugar - now there's a thought...

Haven't heard from Lucas yet but he seems like a nice bloke. Hope he gives me a yell soon. Didn't make it to Paddy's. No money and too close to the new arrival to stray too far from home I think Let me know how you get on - I'd love to be there...

Shawn

 

[Sean]

I'm currently drinking an approximate clone I made a couple of months ago which was simply Powells Pale Malt, a single infusion of Pride of Ringwood at the start of the boil and coopers yeast from a bottle. Possibly the simplest beer I've ever brewed, extreamly drinkable, and pretty close to style. A small amount of sugar would get it a bit closer, but even without the Coopers yeast got it down to 1008.

 

[Gough]

How is the Powells's Malt? Yet to use it but was thinking of giving some a go when my next bag runs out.

Shawn.

 

[warrenlw63]

Haven't tried it myself yet. However you certainly can't argue with the price. $35 for a 25kg bag.

Good value IMO.

Warren -

 

[SteveSA]

Hi Andrew

In my spare time I've been playing with a recipe lately too for CPA. FWIW your's and mine are very similar - so I think you're around the mark
Mine is a touch darker (+2 EBC), has a tiny bit more crystal, wheat and sugar. But the differences are minimal. I agree with 26 IBUs.

I have left my usual whirlfloc addition out though... just to cloud it up out of the tap.

Regards
Steve

 

[AndrewQLD]

Steve,
How long before you taste the CPA, Have you brewed it yet? and if so are you happy with it.

Sean,
From what I have read the coopers yeast is extremely Attenuative I am hoping to get this beer down as low as 1.005 if possible to match the original.

Dunkelboy,
CPA definately has a very small amount of crystal, according to the Coopers white board listing, the amounts for a 46 hl brew are:
4600 pale malt, 40 crystal and 200 wheat,
Regards
Andrew

 

[mje1980]

4600 pale malt
40 crystal
200 wheat

What do these numbers refer to???, could somebody please explain??? tah, i thought it may be kilos, but is this true??

 

[warrenlw63]

I reckon if you strip a few zeros it's pretty close to what you'd want for your average 23 litre batch. Sounds close enough to a Coopers PA to me.

4.6kg pale
40g crystal (probably light)
200g wheat

Warren -

 

[AndrewQLD]

That is kilo weights. Don't forget that at that stage they were brew 46 hl which is 46000 lt of beer.

 

[Gough]

Oh well, my guesses as to quantities weren't too far off then by the sounds of it. 10 grams more crystal in mine and 50 grams less wheat. I get 70% efficiency and ended up with a beer that is very drinkable, quite similar to the Sparkling Ale in colour and overall flavour, but with a little more body and malt sweetness. Was a fair way from the lighter bodied, drier, lower alcohol Pale Ale though. The sugar obviously makes a major difference.

Thanks again for the info Andrew. I'll have to keep an eye out for those books you referred to. I've been really getting a lot out of the Daniels 'Designing Great Beers' lately - a really comprehensive, well researched read. Gotta love this hobby...

Shawn.

 

[Sean]

How is the Powells's Malt? Yet to use it but was thinking of giving some a go when my next bag runs out.

Shawn.

[post="47445"][/post]​

There were a few bits of stalk in it (not much), which had me slightly concerned, but I've had no problems using it and made some terrific beer. I don't get too paranoid about efficiency so I can't comment from that perspective, but IMHO it's close to the English floor malted malt (Tucker's) that I'm used to using (much closer than Joe Whites) and far cheaper than Fawcetts, so I can't see myself using anything else for the foreseeable future.

 

[SteveSA]

Hi Andrew

I haven't brewed it yet but intend getting to it next weekend. I'll let you know how it goes.

Steve

 

[AndrewQLD]

Hi Guys,

Well I finally cracked the keg of Coopers Pale Ale Clone that I posted the recipe for at the beginning of this thread, and I have to say what a graet beer :beer: .
Crisp and dry with a nice subdued malt flavour, no hop flavour or aroma to speak of, but a nice bitter finish that lingers in the mouth.
I carbonated this beer to 90 kpa so it is nice and bubbly (as it should be) and leaves a nice tingle on the tongue.
What suprised me the most was the great head that laces the glass right to the end, all this with 20% sugar and a final gravity of 1.005.
I had to use a Dry English Ale liquid yeast culture because my coopers starter did not kick on so flavour is not as authentic as one would hope, but the colour and bitterness is spot on.
This brew is now going to be one of the standard brews in the house as everyone loved it and it is easy to knock back quite a few :blink: .

I will try to culture another starter from a commercial bottle to see the difference, but I am more than happy with this drop .

Cheers
andrew

 

[Dunkel_Boy]

Hey, great to hear!
Sounds tempting.