Coopers Lager overcooked the baby.

[livo]

I've finally realised something that I knew a decade ago. I never knew why. Coopers Lager is a bitter, not a lager. I've got one in with the Diamond yeast at the moment but I doubt it will make the difference I'm looking for. I now have my first one out of temperature controlled fermentation using the supplied yeast and it is just trying too hard. It isn't the yeast. It is simply over-hopped with who knows what . Way too bitter, not nice and just overdone. Not a pleasant drink no matter what side you butter your bread.

A decade ago I realised that the Mexican Cerveza / Lager at 50/50 made a nice drinking beer. I did it both ways by making each and pouring into the glass and also by making a double fermentation with approximately 50% of each can in each FV.

If my next batch of Coopers Lager with Diamond yeast in 13'C fermentation is the same, I'll be reverting back to old ways I think.

 

[Feldon]

At the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear,
A brewer lies here,
Who tried to hustle the yeast.

(with apologies to Rudyard Kipling)

 

[Paleman]

I've finally realised something that I knew a decade ago. I never knew why. Coopers Lager is a bitter, not a lager. I've got one in with the Diamond yeast at the moment but I doubt it will make the difference I'm looking for. I now have my first one out of temperature controlled fermentation using the supplied yeast and it is just trying too hard. It isn't the yeast. It is simply over-hopped with who knows what . Way too bitter, not nice and just overdone. Not a pleasant drink no matter what side you butter your bread.

A decade ago I realised that the Mexican Cerveza / Lager at 50/50 made a nice drinking beer. I did it both ways by making each and pouring into the glass and also by making a double fermentation with approximately 50% of each can in each FV.

If my next batch of Coopers Lager with Diamond yeast in 13'C fermentation is the same, I'll be reverting back to old ways I think.

They're all overly bitter. Its the iso hop they use i think. When i started all grain and bittering beers to my taste it becomes very apparent.

 

[livo]

I found that the Mexican Cerveza isn't too bad on it's own and when done in 50/50 it mellows the lager to a tolerable level and is actually an enjoyable drink.
I've only recently done the Canadian Blonde for the first time and I didn't mind that so it may be another option to mellow the lager or just drink on it's own and avoid the hassle.
I used to drink VB and Melbourne Bitter so I don't mind a bitter beer but it just seems to be way too much. I think the Draught is a never again for me. I don't like it at all so far but I may be a bit hasty as I haven't really done much with it and I had to dump the first batch. I've got another conditioning in the bottle now but early sample isn't that good. I still have another 2 cans so I'll play around with it.
Other than watering these can kits down and adding extra un-hopped malt into larger fermentations I can't see other remedies and I don't know how far I'd have to spread it out to get it to where I'd like it.
I read somewhere that you can use only part of the opened cans, cover the rest in clingwrap and store it in the fridge for up to 2 weeks, so that may be an option to experiment with. It won't cost much and it is really only time and testing to see what happens.

 

[terminal2k]

I think the Draught is a never again for me

I did a side by side batch of Coopers draught and woolies draught. I expected to like the Coopers one more, but couldn't get into it. the woolies one on the other hand was smooth and easy to drink. Probably my best beer in the 10 or so batches I've done so far. Wish I still had some left. I'll be putting another one down as soon as I have a spare fermenter

 

[yankinoz]

terminal2k--

I'm not a kit brewer, but got curious:, who makes Woolies kits? On checking the web site, it seems Woolies' kits are 99% Australian made, and their offerings parallel those of Coopers. Therefore, given the size of the potential market and cost of going into the production of malt extracts, I suspect they're the same. Does anyone on this site know?

If so, that does not fault your experiment, but I'm wondering if the kits may have been different ages. That could make a big difference.

P.S. Another thought crossed my mind: the one percent that is not Aussie-made could be imported yeast instead of the Mauribrew yeasts Coopers uses. That could make a difference. But if I were to bet, I'd take the kits being the same except for the labels.

 

[livo]

Yankinoz, there is a lot of conjecture and debate on the HB forums about this and there is no apparent clear answer. It is probable that a major manufacturer produces them (Coopers, Morgans) but who knows? I've read a lot of stuff on this topic going back 20 odd years, so if it isn't yet known we probably never will. It is highly unlikely that the supermarkets produce it themselves, and you'd think somebody in the supply chain would have spilled the beans by now.

There is a pretty clear view though that they are *****, or at least the yeast is. Some say that you can make a good brew out of them by playing around with additional grain infusions, hops, different yeast, doing short low volume boils, etc, while others adopt the view that you simply can't polish a turd. There's lots of Youtube stuff out there on the Home Brand Lager. I particularly like Poor Choice Homebrewing. I have just bought 4 cans of it which I intend on experimenting with. At only $8.35 a can, you can't expect a lot but then again it is only time and fermenter occupancy so it can't hurt.

I've got some decent yeast now so I'll check that out first. When I take my first Coopers Lager off the Lallemand Diamond yeast this weekend or early next week, I'll just immediately drop a can on it to see what happens with just a change of yeast.

Some say that they are not full malt extract but contain syrup and almost definitely hop concentrate. The label does not indicate that but their are malt extracts and MALT EXTRACTS (apparently). Even Coopers offers different classes of brew in ranges that vary in price and you would assume quality, Original, International and the Thomas Cooper range plus a few other malt extract products.

I'll also use a can to do a test of the use of only partial cans and fridge storage of remainders before I go and waste any Coopers.

It would be good to hear from anybody who has jiggled with them to make a decent drink on the cheap and easy though.

 

[yankinoz]

Yankinoz, there is a lot of conjecture and debate on the HB forums about this and there is no apparent clear answer. It is probable that a major manufacturer produces them (Coopers, Morgans) but who knows? I've read a lot of stuff on this topic going back 20 odd years, so if it isn't yet known we probably never will. It is highly unlikely that the supermarkets produce it themselves, and you'd think somebody in the supply chain would have spilled the beans by now.

There is a pretty clear view though that they are *****, or at least the yeast is. Some say that you can make a good brew out of them by playing around with additional grain infusions, hops, different yeast, doing short low volume boils, etc, while others adopt the view that you simply can't polish a turd. There's lots of Youtube stuff out there on the Home Brand Lager. I particularly like Poor Choice Homebrewing. I have just bought 4 cans of it which I intend on experimenting with. At only $8.35 a can, you can't expect a lot but then again it is only time and fermenter occupancy so it can't hurt.

I've got some decent yeast now so I'll check that out first. When I take my first Coopers Lager off the Lallemand Diamond yeast this weekend or early next week, I'll just immediately drop a can on it to see what happens with just a change of yeast.

Some say that they are not full malt extract but contain syrup and almost definitely hop concentrate. The label does not indicate that but their are malt extracts and MALT EXTRACTS (apparently). Even Coopers offers different classes of brew in ranges that vary in price and you would assume quality, Original, International and the Thomas Cooper range plus a few other malt extract products.

I'll also use a can to do a test of the use of only partial cans and fridge storage of remainders before I go and waste any Coopers.

It would be good to hear from anybody who has jiggled with them to make a decent drink on the cheap and easy though.

I overlooked Morgans. All the same, someone in Australia makes them for Woolies. You're right, it's unusual that the secret hasn't leaked. Follow the trucks.

 

[Eddy Monsoon]

Maybe this helps ?

I recently enquired about the availability of one of the Coopers Mr Beer extracts that was out-of-stock at the time

https://www.diybeer.com/au/mr-beer-unhopped-malt-extract-robust.html
got this by reply

"The Robust is currently being produced and we are hoping to have this available by the end of the year. However, as this isn’t packaged by Coopers we cant provide a guaranteed back in stock date."

 

[terminal2k]

If so, that does not fault your experiment, but I'm wondering if the kits may have been different ages. That could make a big difference.

I didn't check the use by dates when I brewed them,so it's possible the coopers one was old. It's also possible the coopers would have gotten better with more time in the bottle, but what I was looking for was a simple beer to smash out to just drink