British Bitter Theory

[user 384]

Hi Jayse

I've started to rethink the way I make Bitters. Mainly in regards to the mash schedule. After talking a bit with TDH, I've increased my mash temps and my OG and hopefully will also have a higher FG, but the same ABV. Hopefully the higher FG will give a maltier flavour.

Cheers
MAH

 

[Gough]

G'day MAH,

What is the FG you are shooting for? Just out of interest I recently brewed 2 'Best Bitters' with very similar malt bills but fermented with different yeasts. Same ferm temps and volume of wort, and same starter size. The 1272 saw my fg finish at 1008 and the version using the 1968 ESB yeast saw it finish at 1012 - a pretty substantial difference. The version made with the 1272 was a lovely beer that is now almost all gone, and the 1968 version with the higher FG hit the bottle on Saturday, but also tasted great at that stage. Much maltier profile though. You are convinced the higher FG is preferable? Both these beers were bigger than the 'ordinary' bitter profile, but not in the 'ESB' category - high 1040s OG. Mash temp was 67 for both.

Shawn.

 

[warrenlw63]

Small hint and I will welcome all ridicule and flame-throwers.

Small amount of (British) Amber Malt will enhance the perception of "perceived maltiness" in a Bitter. I think it's linked to what people describe as "nutty or biscuity". Other than that ditto what Shawn and MAH say. Higher mash temps and/or less attenuative yeast strains will do wonders.

Never hurts to lower your IBUs a little too. Bitter is it's name, however overly-bitter is not. I prefer more late hopping to initial hopping. In other words I try and hang around the 35 IBU mark for an average 1.045+ Bitter.

Just experiment. Half the fun. :beerbang:

Warren -

 

[user 384]

Aiming for an FG around 1.015. When I was talking to TDH he said that for a number of their beers at Grumpys, they start with a higher OG, mash higher and aim for higher FG. He said that as homebrewers we are free to do this because we don't have accountants looking over our shoulders, so using more malt is not a problem. I haven't put it to the test yet, apart from Saturday's brew.

Cheers
MAH

 

[neonmeate]

i just did an ESB/brit IPA type thing with WLP002 and it finished at 1020 starting at 1066. that's what i call a high FG! i mashed at 65 and only used 250g crystal. but the rest was maris otter and 600g munich so that might account for the lower attenuation. still, even with that level of hops the sweetness is pretty dominant. i think with this yeast I might try using a bit of sugar, or adjuncts next time to lighten it up a bit.

by the way can anyone recommend a british yeast that flocculates as well as WLP002 but has better attenuation? and more interesting esters?

 

[Duff]

i just did an ESB/brit IPA type thing with WLP002 and it finished at 1020 starting at 1066. that's what i call a high FG! i mashed at 65 and only used 250g crystal. but the rest was maris otter and 600g munich so that might account for the lower attenuation. still, even with that level of hops the sweetness is pretty dominant. i think with this yeast I might try using a bit of sugar, or adjuncts next time to lighten it up a bit.

by the way can anyone recommend a british yeast that flocculates as well as WLP002 but has better attenuation? and more interesting esters?

[post="79476"][/post]​

I have the same problem with WLP002 in my bitters, just can't seem to get it low enough. 005 is an excellent versatile yeast, but in future I might try the 006 or even the new 026 release, as all seem to have higher attenuation according to the Whitelabs blog.

 

[Ross]

i just did an ESB/brit IPA type thing with WLP002 and it finished at 1020 starting at 1066. that's what i call a high FG! i mashed at 65 and only used 250g crystal. but the rest was maris otter and 600g munich so that might account for the lower attenuation. still, even with that level of hops the sweetness is pretty dominant. i think with this yeast I might try using a bit of sugar, or adjuncts next time to lighten it up a bit.

by the way can anyone recommend a british yeast that flocculates as well as WLP002 but has better attenuation? and more interesting esters?

[post="79476"][/post]​

London Ale III 1318 would be my choice - It's a lovely yeast & has what you're looking for...

 

[jayse]

Same here MAH, I look to get around 1.015, another bonus to that is you can chuck in even more hops!
With TDH's biggles i found the latest batch with the less attenuation is extremely good and a classic example of how I like it.

I agree with ross there also 1318 seems to me to be one of the 'fruitier' yeasts, a top floccer too. Iam not a huge fan of it myself but the fruitiness is nice if thats what your after.

Anyway iam off to brew up one right now, not overly happy with the latest EKG pellets i have though, they seem to be lacking quite a bit in some departs and quite perfume like.

happy mashing high
Jayse

 

[colinw]

I haven't been entirely happy with the flavour and aroma of the beers I've made with EKG pellets lately. There seems to be a "cheap perfume" character which is quite different to the earthy/peppery/spicy aroma of the beers I desire to brew. In comparison, the last time I used EKG plugs I managed to get quite close.

I'm also coming to the conclusion that EKG all the way doesn't quite do what I want, and a more assertively flavoured bittering hop like Target, Challenger or Northern Brewer provides a robustness to the flavour which is more to my taste.

cheers,
Colin

 

[user 384]

Hi Colin

I usually do a 50/50 mix of Fuggle and Golding. I really like the results with this approach. If I do a single hop brew it's usually Fuggle, however on Saturday I used 100% Golding (plugs).

Cheers
MAH

 

[Ross]

I'm also coming to the conclusion that EKG all the way doesn't quite do what I want, and a more assertively flavoured bittering hop like Target, Challenger or Northern Brewer provides a robustness to the flavour which is more to my taste.

cheers,
Colin

[post="79489"][/post]​

I have to agree Colin - I bought 2 kg of EKG plugs & did a couple of just EKG brews, definately lacked the robustness I like...

 

[warrenlw63]

Just don't resort to Progress. Yuck! :blink:

Big thumbs up to Challenger and Northdown. Both nice hops. Target also. Though it's a bit out-there as an aroma hop.

Warren -

 

[Ross]

Just don't resort to Progress. Yuck! :blink:

Big thumbs up to Challenger and Northdown. Both nice hops. Target also. Though it's a bit out-there as an aroma hop.

Warren -

[post="79506"][/post]​

Warren, I made an all progress ale - To say it was interesting is an understatement :blink:

 

[warrenlw63]

Ross.

Did you get some of that big "vegetal" character too? :unsure: I found that it took months to mellow out. Once that tang went beer was OK. Not great though.

Warren -

 

[Bilph]

I'm also coming to the conclusion that EKG all the way doesn't quite do what I want, and a more assertively flavoured bittering hop like Target, Challenger or Northern Brewer provides a robustness to the flavour which is more to my taste.

[post="79489"][/post]​

Funny old world isn't it?
I'm going back the other way and using less Target etc and more Fuggles and Goldings for bittering.
I'm a bit like MAH, I tend to have both Fuggles and Goldings together. Nicer balance than just Goldings IMHO.

 

[Ross]

Ross.

Did you get some of that big "vegetal" character too? :unsure: I found that it took months to mellow out. Once that tang went beer was OK. Not great though.

Warren -

[post="79514"][/post]​

It's a real strange one Warren - made with a lot of crystal as well - was undrinkable at first - now tastes like "turkish delight" chocolate.... :blink:

 

[neonmeate]

i agree with colin the goldings plugs are much spicier than the pellets. nice old speckled hen-adnams sort of flavour, peppery and earthy.

thanks for sugggesting 1318, i did do a few beers with that last year, i liked it, but it doesn't clear quite as well as WLP002. i'm thinkin i might have to give 1099 a go next, apparently it's a good flocculator although possibly sort of boring flavourwise.

 

[roach]

... i'm thinkin i might have to give 1099 a go next, apparently it's a good flocculator although possibly sort of boring flavourwise.

[post="79530"][/post]​

if you are going for 1099, then may as well use safale s-04 which is equally as boring, but drops out with a bang. also less hassle with the dried stuff if unprepared.

 

[Sean]

Ross.

Did you get some of that big "vegetal" character too? :unsure: I found that it took months to mellow out. Once that tang went beer was OK. Not great though.

Warren -

[post="79514"][/post]​

It's a real strange one Warren - made with a lot of crystal as well - was undrinkable at first - now tastes like "turkish delight" chocolate.... :blink:

[post="79525"][/post]​

I've got a strong (6%) dark mild in the fridge brewed from Progess, and it's shaping up very nicely.

I presume "Turkish Delight" means rose flavour - I've had that in a couple of UK brewpub beers made with extreme levels of Goldings.

 

[Sean]

I'm also coming to the conclusion that EKG all the way doesn't quite do what I want, and a more assertively flavoured bittering hop like Target, Challenger or Northern Brewer provides a robustness to the flavour which is more to my taste.

[post="79489"][/post]​

Funny old world isn't it?
I'm going back the other way and using less Target etc and more Fuggles and Goldings for bittering.
I'm a bit like MAH, I tend to have both Fuggles and Goldings together. Nicer balance than just Goldings IMHO.

[post="79521"][/post]​

Very few classic English Bitters use a single hop variety - the vast majority use two or three. Single variety beers are a relatively new thing (though, of course, there are exceptions). Even just using Pride of Ringwood for bitterness and traditional hop for aroma works well.