Brewers With Solar Power
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Florian
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8 cents, ouch, but better than nothing I guess. Still makes sense going solar especially up where you are Andrew.
When I was in Germany over new years I visited an old school mate of mine, he's taken over his parents farm and and built a few funny looking 'sheds' to house his 1 Megawatt system. I'm not sure what size panels he has but if he had 200w ones like I have he'd have 5000 panels. Just nuts.
Yob, don't pull the trigger too quickly unless you're in a real rush. Get absolute every aspect of your system right from the start.
When I was researching I had 4 of the majors out to quote, ended up going back and forth with one of them and almost pulled the trigger, then went onto forums... We all know how that ends...
Spent 2 hours on the phone on a Sunday afternoon to a local installer and went around to his place the next day. He's taken the approach to believe absolutely nothing that is written in product brochures. As a result he has a 'wall of death' where he has installed about every inverter there is and is literally trying to kill each one of them by overloading it by stupidly large margins and doing other silly things to them. There aren't many that survive the ordeal, but one that did is the Trannergy which he distributes in Australia and actually was quite involved with in the development process. I see he now sells Schneider inverters so I assume they hold up to it as well.
Don't get me wrong, the Sunnyboy is a fantastic inverter, but it costs way too much for what it does compared to others, at least back then. I was 100% sold on it for ages until I eventually changed my mind. Especially if you're trying to over load as much as possible the Sunnyboy is not up for it. But if you're not wanting to over load too much and are happy to pay a little extra for a top of the line German product then all is good. It's definitely a flash unit that offers loads of bells and whistles.
Same goes for panels. Back then he sold panels by ET Solar after he had visited the factory in China a few times. He'd done tests on how long the EVA (the white plastic sheeting under the actual cells) holds up over the years in the sun, he's driven his forklift into panels while in operation to deliberately try to set them on fire and all sorts of other tests. Back then the ET panels where top of the rank and dirt cheap compared to Schott (which again I 100% was convinced I needed), LG and other big names.
All I'm saying is this: Don't believe the marketing hype, everyone is trying to place their product as the best, competition is fierce. Do your own research on the little technical details or find someone you can trust who does it for you and whose trustworthiness is backed by lots of other knowledgable people.
And don't pay more than you need to, after all we're doing this to safe money, unlike a shiny brewery where it may be justified to fork out extra for the bling factor.
When I was in Germany over new years I visited an old school mate of mine, he's taken over his parents farm and and built a few funny looking 'sheds' to house his 1 Megawatt system. I'm not sure what size panels he has but if he had 200w ones like I have he'd have 5000 panels. Just nuts.
Yob, don't pull the trigger too quickly unless you're in a real rush. Get absolute every aspect of your system right from the start.
When I was researching I had 4 of the majors out to quote, ended up going back and forth with one of them and almost pulled the trigger, then went onto forums... We all know how that ends...
Spent 2 hours on the phone on a Sunday afternoon to a local installer and went around to his place the next day. He's taken the approach to believe absolutely nothing that is written in product brochures. As a result he has a 'wall of death' where he has installed about every inverter there is and is literally trying to kill each one of them by overloading it by stupidly large margins and doing other silly things to them. There aren't many that survive the ordeal, but one that did is the Trannergy which he distributes in Australia and actually was quite involved with in the development process. I see he now sells Schneider inverters so I assume they hold up to it as well.
Don't get me wrong, the Sunnyboy is a fantastic inverter, but it costs way too much for what it does compared to others, at least back then. I was 100% sold on it for ages until I eventually changed my mind. Especially if you're trying to over load as much as possible the Sunnyboy is not up for it. But if you're not wanting to over load too much and are happy to pay a little extra for a top of the line German product then all is good. It's definitely a flash unit that offers loads of bells and whistles.
Same goes for panels. Back then he sold panels by ET Solar after he had visited the factory in China a few times. He'd done tests on how long the EVA (the white plastic sheeting under the actual cells) holds up over the years in the sun, he's driven his forklift into panels while in operation to deliberately try to set them on fire and all sorts of other tests. Back then the ET panels where top of the rank and dirt cheap compared to Schott (which again I 100% was convinced I needed), LG and other big names.
All I'm saying is this: Don't believe the marketing hype, everyone is trying to place their product as the best, competition is fierce. Do your own research on the little technical details or find someone you can trust who does it for you and whose trustworthiness is backed by lots of other knowledgable people.
And don't pay more than you need to, after all we're doing this to safe money, unlike a shiny brewery where it may be justified to fork out extra for the bling factor.
Yob
Hop to it
Good words mate, appreciate it.
I actually work with a bloke on a Greenstar type job, deals with this stuff (commercially) every day, has left me to sort it out, but has offered gread advice on how it all works as well, certainly been a learning curve to get to grips with it all.. what really doesnt help is the flooded market with so many new names (that may well be old names for a reason) on the block.
There's more to it than just the Inverter and the panels, space, aspect, tilt frames, frames of the panels, the list goes on and becomes all consuming. Between him and much forum browsing, you get to know the tide (reminds me of somewhere.. not sure where.. or how I started on AG
)
He also gave me a well handy spreadsheet, (find attached for future fun in the sun lovers) he said to keep in mind the distance start to start of the panels should not be less than (usually) 1800? (will confirm that number).. anyay.. it does stuff, youll sort it out.
It's an interesting journey and with a split in the back pocket of between $6.9k and $10k its well worth the research to get to know what is right for you.
Just to be clear, for me, Im a single story, flat roof, facing North East.. and plenty of roof space, I can look at this "grid" setup as a first step, the other half of this will be a battery system.. there is time for that though.. one step at a time.
B)
View attachment PV calculations Jesse.xlsx
I actually work with a bloke on a Greenstar type job, deals with this stuff (commercially) every day, has left me to sort it out, but has offered gread advice on how it all works as well, certainly been a learning curve to get to grips with it all.. what really doesnt help is the flooded market with so many new names (that may well be old names for a reason) on the block.
There's more to it than just the Inverter and the panels, space, aspect, tilt frames, frames of the panels, the list goes on and becomes all consuming. Between him and much forum browsing, you get to know the tide (reminds me of somewhere.. not sure where.. or how I started on AG
)He also gave me a well handy spreadsheet, (find attached for future fun in the sun lovers) he said to keep in mind the distance start to start of the panels should not be less than (usually) 1800? (will confirm that number).. anyay.. it does stuff, youll sort it out.
It's an interesting journey and with a split in the back pocket of between $6.9k and $10k its well worth the research to get to know what is right for you.
Just to be clear, for me, Im a single story, flat roof, facing North East.. and plenty of roof space, I can look at this "grid" setup as a first step, the other half of this will be a battery system.. there is time for that though.. one step at a time.
B)
View attachment PV calculations Jesse.xlsx
AndrewQLD said:First day with the solar power connected, very happy it was cranking out 5 Kw for most of the day.
Photo 7-03-2015 12 15 44 pm (1).jpg
Can I check my understanding of these systems
5.00kw is from the panels.
but post inverter into the grid it is 3182w (ie, approx 240v * 13.0amp) due to the losses within the inverter?
or is it losses from the inverter + current usage in the house.
Florian
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Kev, I'm guessing that Andrew took that photo pretty early in the day (9 or 10am?) and that it doesn't show what Andrew expressed in his post.
3182w is what the inverter puts out at that actual moment, consequently that number fluctuates constantly. 16.46 kwh is what he has output so far for the day, that number would have probably been between 30 and 40 kwh at the end of the day.
energy use in the household is not reflected on the inverter, only on the meter. efficiency for this inverter will be somewhere around 98% from memory, so not much loss at all.
you can see from the graph that during the last hour the output was at or pretty close to 5kwh which then would have continued for another few hours if the weather didn't change, that's what Andrew was referring to.
anyone on PV Output?
3182w is what the inverter puts out at that actual moment, consequently that number fluctuates constantly. 16.46 kwh is what he has output so far for the day, that number would have probably been between 30 and 40 kwh at the end of the day.
energy use in the household is not reflected on the inverter, only on the meter. efficiency for this inverter will be somewhere around 98% from memory, so not much loss at all.
you can see from the graph that during the last hour the output was at or pretty close to 5kwh which then would have continued for another few hours if the weather didn't change, that's what Andrew was referring to.
anyone on PV Output?
AndrewQLD
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Too much technical stuff there for me Kev, that's why I like pretty graghs Florian is spot on, the output at the end of the day was 38 Kw and the photo was taken early in the day when it first peaked at 5Kw.
As yet Ergon hasn't installed their new meter so the old one was rolling backwards for most of the day, had 2 aircons going as well at one point and still the meter slooowly rolled back.
Florian is spot on, the output at the end of the day was 38 Kw and the photo was taken early in the day when it first peaked at 5Kw.As yet Ergon hasn't installed their new meter so the old one was rolling backwards for most of the day, had 2 aircons going as well at one point and still the meter slooowly rolled back.
Notwithstanding comments by others on the issues (real or imaginary) associated with solar trackers it is worth having a look at this site to see what the benefits (increased output) could be by tracking the sun.
For example if you input say a Melbourne location for a 5kW system the annual Kilowatt output for a fixed roof installation works out at around 5189kWh/year where as if the same system used a two axis tracker the output would be around 8577kWh/year or some 3388kWh/year improvement or a 65% improvement!!!!
Now agreed it depends on your location and the more northerly your location the lower the improvement as the difference between summer and winter is significantly less
http://pvwatts.nrel.gov/pvwatts.php
No particular barrow to push Just suggesting to give this technology a serious look and I acknowledge that you need to have the space to ground mount such a system in your yard.
Cheers
Wobbly
For example if you input say a Melbourne location for a 5kW system the annual Kilowatt output for a fixed roof installation works out at around 5189kWh/year where as if the same system used a two axis tracker the output would be around 8577kWh/year or some 3388kWh/year improvement or a 65% improvement!!!!
Now agreed it depends on your location and the more northerly your location the lower the improvement as the difference between summer and winter is significantly less
http://pvwatts.nrel.gov/pvwatts.php
No particular barrow to push Just suggesting to give this technology a serious look and I acknowledge that you need to have the space to ground mount such a system in your yard.
Cheers
Wobbly
Years ago it may have been a viable option, but last I heard, with the panels getting cheaper all the time you're better off putting the money toward more panels.wobbly said:
We're completely off grid and I've thought about it - so the batteries get an early morning feed (and late arvo too). More beneficial to get a constant charge over a longer period. But for grid feed, you're certainly better off harvesting bulk during the middle of the day with extra panels.
wide eyed and legless
Well-Known Member
When I bought my system, about 2009 it cost me $21,000 for a 4Kw system and that was besides the $8000 government rebate, the solar hot water was $2,000 plus also without counting in the government rebate. I knew I wouldn't end up out of pocket in the long term but it is really a gamble when you take on a long term investment though with the odds stacked in your favour.
I get my 66 cents FIT until 2024 my credit goes toward the winter gas bill so all in all the energy household bills are out of the equation in the cost of running a house.(someone needs to come up with something to reduce the rates now)
I too did all the research, at the time the BP panels were the best along with a Sunny Boy inverter, now BP is out of the market but is honouring any warranty calls, so you can wonder whether all the research does pay off, as long as you get a decent name brand with good solid warranty behind it that should be enough.
I reckon in the next 10 years the Home Hydrogen fuel cell will be the way to go where hopefully it will be able to top up a hydrogen fuel cell for the car, progress in this field is gathering momentum so with this and battery technology we will soon all be efficiently producing our own power.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-12-09/japan-promotes-home-fuel-cell-on-path-to-hydrogen-society
I get my 66 cents FIT until 2024 my credit goes toward the winter gas bill so all in all the energy household bills are out of the equation in the cost of running a house.(someone needs to come up with something to reduce the rates now)
I too did all the research, at the time the BP panels were the best along with a Sunny Boy inverter, now BP is out of the market but is honouring any warranty calls, so you can wonder whether all the research does pay off, as long as you get a decent name brand with good solid warranty behind it that should be enough.
I reckon in the next 10 years the Home Hydrogen fuel cell will be the way to go where hopefully it will be able to top up a hydrogen fuel cell for the car, progress in this field is gathering momentum so with this and battery technology we will soon all be efficiently producing our own power.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-12-09/japan-promotes-home-fuel-cell-on-path-to-hydrogen-society
Yob
Hop to it
21.81 kwh made today.
average house consumption is about 28 or something so will be interested to see what impact this has on the next quater account.. I wish I had battery storage, no way we are using all of it during the day even with the changes weve made (ie dishwasher happens at day now etc..)
anyway, pretty pleasing stuff
Take that energy companies :super:
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Yob, can I ask what type of solar contract you're on? We get the 68 cent tariff for what we produce but pay 32 cents for peak and 18 cents for off peak usage. We do all our washing during off peak as the dish washer and washing machine use a lot of power.
Yob
Hop to it
Who is that with mate? We haven't sorted out our contracts yet
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We use Red Energy for gas and power. I'll check the usage tariffs, but last time I looked they were 32 and 18.
Just checked the most recent bill. 28 cents peak and 12.65 cents off peak, plus GST. FIT is 66.2 cents.
Just checked the most recent bill. 28 cents peak and 12.65 cents off peak, plus GST. FIT is 66.2 cents.
Yob
Hop to it
Sweet, we're with Red, I'll shoot you a pm about which plan and other assorted questions.
I'm assuming you signed this up some time ago?
Nice one
I'm assuming you signed this up some time ago?
Nice one
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August 2012, when we moved to our current home.
Florian
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if you haven't done so already try the quick wash cycle on your dishwasher.razz said:
On the 31 minute cycle ours cleans 97% as good as on the two and a half hour cycle. The other 3% I wipe off with a kitchen towel.
A similar principle applies to the washing machine.
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Thanks Florian for the tip. It's no big deal that we wash the way we do. No kids and i'm up at 5:30 six days for bootcamp so the dish washer goes on and finished before 7am. Weekends the washing machine is doing 4-5 loads and it's off peak.
WarmerBeer
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Ditch that gas burner, go with a dual-element kettle, and suddenly brewing during daylight hours becomes almost free.Yob said:Solar.jpg
21.81 kwh made today.
average house consumption is about 28 or something so will be interested to see what impact this has on the next quater account.. I wish I had battery storage, no way we are using all of it during the day even with the changes weve made (ie dishwasher happens at day now etc..)
anyway, pretty pleasing stuff
Take that energy companies :super:
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