Black Rock Lager... Disappointed.

[jerrycashman]

Well I've just tasted my first go at a lager and have buggered it up.

This is my sixth K&K... still learning, but have done several ales / stouts and all have worked out Ok... but this Black Rock Lager is horrible!

I have rigged up a fridge with temp-mate and a heater pad and am sure my ferm. temp was 12c plus or minus 1 degree... everything was clean and sanitised... used fresh S23 and a lager booster from the LHBS... fermentation was visible within 24 hours and while I can't remember OG/FG, I did record them in my brew log and they were well within expected limits... I bottle primed with caster sugar and have left them in the fridge at 12c for 3 weeks after bottling.

The taste is just horrible and there is virtually no head...

Anyone got any clues to what might have happened?

cheers. Jerry in Canberra.

 

[levin_ae92]

As far as i know, lagers need to be left for quite some time before drinking, like 3 months or so, and in the coldest place possible

 

[.DJ.]

because lagers are crap! B)



seriously though, what about it makes it bad? thin, watery, infected, sweet, bitter?

 

[glaab]

Maybe there wasnt enough yeast to prime at 12C if it dropped out. Can you taste the caster sugar?

 

[perce84]

Need more info what ingredients did you use?

 

[Fourstar]

used fresh S23 and a lager booster from the LHBS...
The taste is just horrible and there is virtually no head...

What was in the lager booster? Dextrose and something else?!? Nothing better than backing up a kit with a kilo of DME or LME and THEN subbing the rest of your ABV with dex if you desire. (personally i used to avoid dextrose in 90% of my beers.)

You need dextrins in your beer to gain head, body adn mouthfeel, dextrose will not add any of these. All important factors in altering your taste perception too. if its thin and watery in the mouth, its flavour profile is probabaly going to match that too.

Unless of course you do want spritzy beer thats thin and watery, go with straight dextrose.

I'd be shooting for a better lager yeast too if you can get your hands on it. Maybe a liquid culture like Wyeast Bohemian Lager as a good starting point.

 

[Rod]

Jerry ,

You will need to keep them for about 3 to 4 months , preferably the cooler the better.

Then try one or two

don't toss them after 6 months they will be great

I have kept some crappy brews and after 6 months they were OK , kept them a little longer and they were great

Lager is a style that likes age IMO

ps I gave up using booster or brew enhancer

now add either light dry malt or dark or medium malt depending on the style

sometimes add liquid malt in the same way

You will get a better head with straight malt

I use dextrose to prime , I think it gives a better head too

 

[jerrycashman]

because lagers are crap! B)



seriously though, what about it makes it bad? thin, watery, infected, sweet, bitter?

Sorry... "horrible" isn't very useful is it...

It's sweet and sickly... and maybe, yes, I might be tasting the caster sugar, but almost no hop taste or bitterness... a bit of malt smell, but no taste (if that makes sense).

There is pressure in the bottle (I'm using PET) but virtually no bubbles when poured... and very clear... no yeast sediment in the bottom of the bottles that I can see (where did it go?

 

[jerrycashman]

What was in the lager booster? Dextrose and something else?!? Nothing better than backing up a kit with a kilo of DME or LME and THEN subbing the rest of your ABV with dex if you desire. (personally i used to avoid dextrose in 90% of my beers.)

You need dextrins in your beer to gain head, body adn mouthfeel, dextrose will not add any of these. All important factors in altering your taste perception too. if its thin and watery in the mouth, its flavour profile is probabaly going to match that too.

Unless of course you do want spritzy beer thats thin and watery, go with straight dextrose.

I'd be shooting for a better lager yeast too if you can get your hands on it. Maybe a liquid culture like Wyeast Bohemian Lager as a good starting point.

Sorry Fourstar, I'd have to go check my log; from memory it's about 50% LME, 50% Dex plus a little corn syrup... but I'd have to check the log notes to be sure.

Is 12c Ok for lager? That's what my research said but ask 5 home brewers that question and expect 12 answers... all very confusing

 

[boingk]

I find my ales are just starting to taste good at 3 weeks, I generally like to try them between 4 and 6 weeks though. I don't do proper lagers because of the time factor involved, but you will be wanting to keep them for at least several months.

Keep them around, try one in a month and see how it goes. You may also be exeriencing a 'low bitterness' factor due to a low carbonic bite, as they may not be fully carbonated yet.

- boingk

EDIT: Sounds a better pack to add than most. For kits I usually add 500g light malt and 300g Dextrose, plus specialty grains or hops. Bigger beers get less dextrose and more malt/vairety of malts. 12'C for most lagers is brilliant, and with S-23 it should turn out well.

 

[jerrycashman]

I find my ales are just starting to taste good at 3 weeks, I generally like to try them between 4 and 6 weeks though. I don't do proper lagers because of the time factor involved, but you will be wanting to keep them for at least several months.

Keep them around, try one in a month and see how it goes. You may also be exeriencing a 'low bitterness' factor due to a low carbonic bite, as they may not be fully carbonated yet.

- boingk

Ok.. thanks... I'll hang onto them and try again around Xmas... should I keep them in the fridge at 12c or is it Ok to pull them out and store them in the house (Canberra, gets pretty damn hot).

j.

 

[dj_yiakamon]

I mainly make lager K&Bs and i find they tend to take their time to carb up and reach their potential. I usually only ever sample one after giving it 6 weeks to condition in the bottle. Prior to that like you said the taste isnt the greatest.

Lagers i find require alot of patience. Usual turn around for my beers are something like this:
3 weeks primary
2 days rest at 18 degrees
3 weeks cold condition (after being racked)
6 weeks bottle condition

 

[Mr.Moonshine]

If it's sickly sweet You may not have left it long enough to ferment, meaning that it's not done and the bottles may explode if you leave them. How long did you ferment for?
My lagers using s-23 took at least 1-2 weeks to ferment out fully (but not properly condition), and I was pitching a full yeast cake into them. If you pitched one sachet of s-23 into a brew it's a pretty big underpitch, so it'll need longer to ferment and most likely longer to condition as well.

Cheers,

Mr.Moonshine

 

[Fourstar]

Sorry Fourstar, I'd have to go check my log; from memory it's about 50% LME, 50% Dex plus a little corn syrup... but I'd have to check the log notes to be sure.

Is 12c Ok for lager? That's what my research said but ask 5 home brewers that question and expect 12 answers... all very confusing

Thats coool mate, 12 deg is fine for a lager, 10 is optimal for clean ferment profile IMO, it just takes longer. At times ive foudn it to be 1 1/2 weeks longer. May have todo with pitching rates, temp fluctuation etc too.

 

[marksfish]

3 weeks at 12 degrees wont carbonate your lager, move the bottles to a dark place at 20 degrees for two weeks then fridge for a month then try.

 

[manticle]

As above. If you want them to carbonate they should be at a higher temp. Once carbonataed, store them cold and leave them for a month or so.