Biab Brewer Register

[Katherine]

Katie! Put your clothes back on, write something to encourage BIABrewers to participate in your Australia's Biggest Brew Day and let your fiance finish his brew properly for goodness sake!

Patch it was my brew with the 50 minute boil we ran out of f*(ng gas!

 

[PistolPatch]

My goodness! Three posts in a row on Monday night! Someone had too many beers methinks!

Paul, thanks for posting your figs - will send you a PM later in the week. reviled, we'll look forward to yours though I have no idea how I'll analyse them with your crafty hybrid brewing method!

Lloydie and Katie - LOL! Now that makes sense. Must have been a PITA running out of gas in the middle of the night. Agh!

 

[Hashie]

G'day Pat, I'd like to give details of an average brew of mine, but I don't take mid brew measurements. So if you can wait until after my next, I'll be happy to add some numbers.

As an aside, I normally have a starting volume of ~37 litres. This gives me an end volume of 25 litres (23 into cube and 2 for trub) after a 90 minute boil.

My question; would more sugars (maltose?) be harvested from the mash if I used a higher starting volume (say 40 litres) and then had a longer boil to still end up at 25 litres final volume. I'm thinking the more liquid, the greater amount of rinsing of the grain.

Cheers

 

[Katherine]

More like a BRAIN TYPO... Yeah mate 31 instead of 28..... SO....


The following figures are based on this number of brews (number):20
Desired Batch Size* (lts):27
Vessel Type (Keggle or xlt Pot):60L pot
Length of Boil (mins): 50
Grain Bill (kgs):4.575
Starting Volume of Water (lts):35
Volume at Boil Start (lts):31
Specific Gravity Reading at Start of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees): 1.032
Plato Gravity Reading at Start of Boil (refractometer sample cooled to 20 degrees):
Volume at End of Boil (lts - deduct 4% if measured at 100 degrees):28
Specific Gravity at End of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees):1.042
Plato Gravity Reading at End of Boil (refractometer sample cooled to 20 degrees):
Are you chilling? (Yes/No):no THAT IS A YES
Trub Left in Kettle (lts):4
Volume into Cube (lts):
Volume into Fermenter (lts):24
Specific Gravity Reading into Fermenter (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees): 1.042
Plato Gravity Reading into Fermenter (refractometer sample at 20 degrees):
FINAL Specific Gravity Reading after Fermentation (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees):
FINAL Plato Gravity Reading after Fermentation (refractometer sample at 20 degrees):
Fermenter Trub (lts):1
Resulting Batch Size (lts):23

Cheers mate!!

PS PP
Too cold for pantie shananagins.... Once bitten......

 

[katzke]

Hi.

My name is Tom.

I am a BIABer.

I started BIABing because I like to do things different and the American home brewing community said it would/will never work and you guys are all a bunch of swill drinking fools for thinking it does. Even gave up on my last American brewing forum when a guy claimed to know Palmer and quoted Palmer as saying something like you guys are crazy after he wrote the article in BYO abut Australian home brewing.

My wife claimed a 3rd place ribbon in our local club competition with a BIAB brewed beer in the IPA category. People liked it but said it was not quite an IPA. We could have entered it as an American Brown but though it did not quite fit.

Will not post my brewing specifics like Pat wants, as I really do not keep track. Just put in so much water for so much grain and hope the end volume is what I want. If it is more or less I adjust next time. It is home brewing after all is it not?

 

[PistolPatch]

Katzke: LOL. Have replied in the main thread. Cheers.
Katie: Thanks for the correction :icon_cheers:

G'day Pat, I'd like to give details of an average brew of mine, but I don't take mid brew measurements. So if you can wait until after my next, I'll be happy to add some numbers.

As an aside, I normally have a starting volume of ~37 litres. This gives me an end volume of 25 litres (23 into cube and 2 for trub) after a 90 minute boil.

My question; would more sugars (maltose?) be harvested from the mash if I used a higher starting volume (say 40 litres) and then had a longer boil to still end up at 25 litres final volume. I'm thinking the more liquid, the greater amount of rinsing of the grain.

Cheers

Thanks Hashie. If you have a good idea of your average starting volumes and final results, just put them in. At the top, you can say the number of brews you are basing that on. Any further brews you do that you get the urge to measure, just post them up as individual brews even if there are no mid-brew measures. A lot of us would often only take a final reading and sometimes not even that!

As to your question, I think more sugars would be harvested for sure (Thirsty did a theoretical chart on this a long time ago) but there would be disadvantages to a longer boil in convenience and perhaps even colour discrepancies. The money you would save in grain you would probably far exceed in gas I reckon. I'm pretty happy with my 38lts and 90 minute boil but am going to keep a closer eye on the measurement with my next few brews as I think I might have to use more - I leave a fair bit of trub in the kettle as I use a syphon and cut the flow as soon as it runs cloudy. (I can get a lot more if I tilt the kettle but don't bother with this much anymore. Those with taps will get more out of the kettle but probably more trub which will settle out in the cube or fermenter.

These days I am looking to make things as easy as possible and don't really worry about scoring high final efficiencies.

What size pot have you got mate?

 

[tdack]

Mate where did you get that double hoist from? did you buy it as is or make it yourself from a couple of single pulleys? I want a double pulley job but can't buy it anywhere. I currently have a single one made with a cheap awning pulley but it's clunky and can't get good control.
View attachment 23354

That's called a two-fold purchase, good old mechanical advantage.

The same can be achieved with your awning pulley, you just need another three.

I did see a pretty nifty bit of bent steel at a 4wd & camping show that allowed you to make a two or even three -fold purchase with a couple of these little thingies and a bit of rope - aussie made too, came in at about $50 for three thingies.

 

[eric8]

I do roughly the same for each brew just have a different grain bill and starting volume :icon_cheers:

The following figures are based on this number of brews (number): 1
Desired Batch Size* (lts): 22-25
Vessel Type (Keggle or xlt Pot): Keggle
Length of Mash (mins): 90
Length of Boil (mins):90
Grain Bill (kgs): 6.3
Starting Volume of Water (lts): 34
Volume at Boil Start (lts): ?
Specific Gravity Reading at Start of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees):
Plato Gravity Reading at Start of Boil (refractometer sample cooled to 20 degrees):
Volume at End of Boil (lts - deduct 4% if measured at 100 degrees): 25 maybe
Specific Gravity at End of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees):
Plato Gravity Reading at End of Boil (refractometer sample cooled to 20 degrees):
Are you chilling? (Yes/No): n
Trub Left in Kettle (lts):2-2.5 as a guess
Volume into Cube (lts):23
Volume into Fermenter (lts): 23
Specific Gravity Reading into Fermenter (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees): 1.066
Top Up Water:
Plato Gravity Reading into Fermenter (refractometer sample at 20 degrees):
FINAL Specific Gravity Reading after Fermentation (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees): 1.011
FINAL Plato Gravity Reading after Fermentation (refractometer sample at 20 degrees):
Fermenter Trub (lts): not sure, only leave a skim on yeast cake
Resulting Brew Length* (lts): 21.5
Recipe (name or link): Cascading Ale
Notes (Anything else of interest you might like to write): Tastes freakin good, all cascade flowers

 

[Hashie]

Thanks Hashie. If you have a good idea of your average starting volumes and final results, just put them in. At the top, you can say the number of brews you are basing that on. Any further brews you do that you get the urge to measure, just post them up as individual brews even if there are no mid-brew measures. A lot of us would often only take a final reading and sometimes not even that!

As to your question, I think more sugars would be harvested for sure (Thirsty did a theoretical chart on this a long time ago) but there would be disadvantages to a longer boil in convenience and perhaps even colour discrepancies. The money you would save in grain you would probably far exceed in gas I reckon. I'm pretty happy with my 38lts and 90 minute boil but am going to keep a closer eye on the measurement with my next few brews as I think I might have to use more - I leave a fair bit of trub in the kettle as I use a syphon and cut the flow as soon as it runs cloudy. (I can get a lot more if I tilt the kettle but don't bother with this much anymore. Those with taps will get more out of the kettle but probably more trub which will settle out in the cube or fermenter.

These days I am looking to make things as easy as possible and don't really worry about scoring high final efficiencies.

What size pot have you got mate?

Thanks Pat, I'm not that worried about efficiencies or saving $s, just trying to think outside the box.

A average brew of mine, based on 59 brews, would be;

Satrting volume of 35 - 37 litres (keggle)
Grain bill 4.5 kg
mash time 60 minutes
boil time 90 minutes
final volume 25 litres
Loss to trub 2 litres
No chill
Average OG 1045
Average FG 1011

My dark beers have way better efficiencies than my pales, but I'm aware that I need a ph meter to make adjustments for the pales before I can get them both working the same. Or I could just make dark beers.

 

[crundle]

This is getting quite interesting already with the figures coming in, a few more weeks of brewing data should give some fairly decent numbers to work with. I am doing another brew this weekend coming, so I will be passing on those also.

Crundle

 

[katzke]

My dark beers have way better efficiencies than my pales, but I'm aware that I need a ph meter to make adjustments for the pales before I can get them both working the same. Or I could just make dark beers.

Yes or Yes.

Be cheap and get the strips from your home brew supplier. They do not need to be maintained or calibrated and are close enough for what we do. The exception would be if you are color challenged.

Then you need to be able to make adjustments. I got a basic report from my water supplier and put together a basic profile knowing it could change with any brew session. My last very light colored brew about 4 SRM needed a few drops of acid plus the salt additions and came in at the 5.4 range depending on how you interpreted the influence of the straw colored wort.

The biggest problem is coming up with ideal levels of the elements for your style. I recommend looking at brewing classic styles as you will learn many things to help in recipe formation. He gives water recommendations and while they are not complete with your local brewing radio recommendations and a few tools you will get good results.

I use Brewater 3.0 and Palmers latest excel spread sheet (it has the malt/bitterness balance for sulfate/chloride). I added canning salt to the spread sheet. I put in my desired profile as well as my starting profile in brewater then adjust the magnesium with Epsom salts. Then gypsum or calcium chloride or both depending on the levels I am after. I just keep playing until I get the results. I do not like the auto function, as it always seems to get it different then what I do. I then put in the results into the excel sheet and see how it does. I them have a completed profile for a style. So I only need to do this once for each style I brew.

I did this because I can not brew light colored beers with out bad results. It also gives me one more thing to confuse my fellow brew club members.

 

[Hashie]

I did this because I can not brew light colored beers with out bad results. It also gives me one more thing to confuse my fellow brew club members.

Classic

Not sure if I'm ready to go down the road of profiling water, but I'm certainly ready to adjust ph for better results.

 

[malbur]

These are my last three
Hope it helps PP
The following figures are based on this number of brews (number):3
Desired Batch Size* (lts):27
Vessel Type (Keggle or xlt Pot):45L urn
Length of Boil (mins): 60
Grain Bill (kgs):4.56
Starting Volume of Water (lts):35
Volume at Boil Start (lts):32
Specific Gravity Reading at Start of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees): No reading
Plato Gravity Reading at Start of Boil (refractometer sample cooled to 20 degrees):No reading
Volume at End of Boil (lts - deduct 4% if measured at 100 degrees):28
Specific Gravity at End of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees):1.041
Plato Gravity Reading at End of Boil (refractometer sample cooled to 20 degrees):
Are you chilling? (Yes/No):yes
Trub Left in Kettle (lts):2.5
Volume into Cube (lts):25.5
Volume into Fermenter (lts):25
Specific Gravity Reading into Fermenter (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees): 1.041
Plato Gravity Reading into Fermenter (refractometer sample at 20 degrees):
FINAL Specific Gravity Reading after Fermentation (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees): 1.007
FINAL Plato Gravity Reading after Fermentation (refractometer sample at 20 degrees):
Fermenter Trub (lts):0.5
Resulting Batch Size (lts):24.5

 

[PistolPatch]

Excuse my slow thanks but I've got swine flu or something

Hashie: Thanks for posting the large average. Been a while since we chatted mate - 59 brews - whoaaa!!! Re that question of extending the boil, you might be better off extending your mash to 90 minutes as apparently thinner mashes (like BIAB) take longer to convert form what I read here. This matches my experience as well.

eric8: Great to hear from you Eric :icon_cheers: Thanks for the figs mate!

malbur: That does help. I think you're the first to whack some urn figures in. Thanks a heap and please post more as you do them.

General: As crundle said, this is getting interesting already. Another major area I'd like to see figures for is pre-boil efficiency and post-boil. A lot of what you hear says these should be identical but not everyone finds this and it is rare to see anyone post both figures. So...

I know it is a PITA but if you are able and you get swamped in a wave of enthusiasm please take some volume and gravity readings at both the immediate start of the boil* and at the immediate end of the boil. You might find it interesting. Subtract the 4% from both volumes (multiply x 0.96) and use a container that you can stop any evaporation from to get your wort sample and cool it to 15 or 20 degrees. Just throw the sample back in when done.

This would be a massive help.

Thanks a heap for all the figures to date. If I crack enough flu tablets, I'll see if I can start sending you out your efficiency figures.

Spot,
Pat

* You'll need to turn your heat off for a sec so you can get a volume reading. Also make sure the wort is agitated when you get your sample. You can do this by grabbing the sample just before you turn the heat off whilst it is still boiling. Do the same at end of boil.

 

[PistolPatch]

Have just finished putting all the above figures into a spreadsheet with efficiency conversions etc. It is already very interesting.

I have just emailed it out to those whose email addresses I already have (eric8, hashie, LloydieP, Katie and crundle.) I think it is impossible to do this via PM so can the rest of you please let me know your email address? (If for any reason this is not possible, let me know.) This way I can send you the spreadsheet each time it is updated.

We should be able to delete a few fields from the template we are using here but I'll work on that another day. For now it is fine.

Thanks a heap, this is great stuff :beerbang:

 

[eric8]

The following figures are based on this number of brews (number): 1
Desired Batch Size* (lts): 22-25
Vessel Type (Keggle or xlt Pot): Keggle
Length of Mash (mins): 90
Length of Boil (mins):90
Grain Bill (kgs): 6.3
Starting Volume of Water (lts): 34
Volume at Boil Start (lts): ?
This is for the saison i did on Sat. Why did I do it Pat? Have to try some different styles


Volume at End of Boil (lts - deduct 4% if measured at 100 degrees): 24.5 maybe
Specific Gravity at End of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees):
Plato Gravity Reading at End of Boil (refractometer sample cooled to 20 degrees):
Are you chilling? (Yes/No): n
Trub Left in Kettle (lts):1.5 -2 as a guess
Volume into Cube (lts):22
Volume into Fermenter (lts): 20 I had a big F up with something I did, stoopid is as stoopid does!
Specific Gravity Reading into Fermenter (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees): 1.066
Top Up Water:

Only dumped into fermenter yesterday, will have o wait for the rest.

Plato Gravity Reading into Fermenter (refractometer sample at 20 degrees):
FINAL Specific Gravity Reading after Fermentation (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees):
FINAL Plato Gravity Reading after Fermentation (refractometer sample at 20 degrees):
Fermenter Trub (lts):
Resulting Brew Length* (lts):
Recipe (name or link): Stoopids Saison
Notes (Anything else of interest you might like to write):

 

[PistolPatch]

Thanks Eric. My goodness - you are trying all the styles!

Now what's this, "I guess," and "maybe," stuff? You have me worried - I think I better ring you

I'll wait for another 2 or 3 brews to appear here and then email out an updated spreadsheet.

Donya,
Pat

 

[Thirsty Boy]

* You'll need to turn your heat off for a sec so you can get a volume reading. Also make sure the wort is agitated when you get your sample. You can do this by grabbing the sample just before you turn the heat off whilst it is still boiling. Do the same at end of boil.

By which time a goodly chunk of your hot break will have happened -- we have to work on our communication skills. We keep having arguments about stuff and then finding out later that we either do it the same way or mean the same thing anyway.

 

[PistolPatch]

Have simplified the template a bit so copy and paste this one below and over-write my figures with yours. Have also updated the spreadsheet to include evaporation figures etc. Will email this out shortly.

Here's one brew I did last night.

START

The following figures are based on this number of brews (number): 1
Desired Batch Size* (lts): 28
Vessel Type (Keggle or xlt Pot): 70lt stock pot
Length of Mash (mins): 120
Length of Boil (mins): 90
Grain Bill (kgs): 6004
Starting Volume of Water (lts): 38
Volume at Boil Start (lts): 33.52
Are You Using a Hydrometer, Refractometer or Both?: Both
Specific Gravity Reading at Start of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees): 1.046
Volume at End of Boil (lts - deduct 4% if measured at 100 degrees): 24.08
Specific Gravity at End of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees):1.065
Are you chilling? (Yes/No): No Chill in Kettle overnight.
Trub Left in Kettle (lts): 4.75
Volume into Cube (lts):
Volume into Fermenter (lts): 23
Top Up Water Used to Make Up Volume into Fermenter: 3.67
Specific Gravity Reading into Fermenter (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees): 1.050
FINAL Specific Gravity Reading after Fermentation (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees):
Fermenter Trub (lts): 1
Resulting Brew Length* (lts): 22
Recipe (name or link): Jamil and John Cream Ale using Hallertau and FWH
Notes (Anything else of interest you might like to write):

*Desired batch size for the above is not brew length. Batch size is what you would use in Beersmith. This (misleadingly) actually means how much wort is in your kettle at the end of the boil. Brewlength means how much beer you get from your fermenter. So, Batch Size = Brewlength + fermenter and kettle trub.

END

 

[PistolPatch]

Here's the other brew I did last night.

START

The following figures are based on this number of brews (number): 1
Desired Batch Size* (lts): 28
Vessel Type (Keggle or xlt Pot): 70lt stock pot
Length of Mash (mins): 90
Length of Boil (mins): 90
Grain Bill (kgs): 5660
Starting Volume of Water (lts): 38
Volume at Boil Start (lts): 33.37
Are You Using a Hydrometer, Refractometer or Both?: Both
Specific Gravity Reading at Start of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees): 1.043
Volume at End of Boil (lts - deduct 4% if measured at 100 degrees): 23.62
Specific Gravity at End of Boil (hydrometer sample cooled to 15 or 20 degrees):1.060
Are you chilling? (Yes/No): No Chill in Kettle overnight.
Trub Left in Kettle (lts): 5.3
Volume into Cube (lts):
Volume into Fermenter (lts): 23
Top Up Water Used to Make Up Volume into Fermenter: 4.75
Specific Gravity Reading into Fermenter (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees): 1.048
FINAL Specific Gravity Reading after Fermentation (hydrometer sample at 15 or 20 degrees):
Fermenter Trub (lts): 1
Resulting Brew Length* (lts): 22
Recipe (name or link): NRB All Amraillo Ale. Reversed Hop Schedule and FWH.
Notes (Anything else of interest you might like to write):

*Desired batch size for the above is not brew length. Batch size is what you would use in Beersmith. This (misleadingly) actually means how much wort is in your kettle at the end of the boil. Brewlength means how much beer you get from your fermenter. So, Batch Size = Brewlength + fermenter and kettle trub.

END