HI all, im looking into putting together a wheat or wit beer for ordering ingredients soon to put down after my next DR smurtos batch as my 4th BIAB AG. I love hoegarden and have tried a few german wheats as well and like them very much, being tasty and refreshing.What would be the easiest to brew close to style without stuffing around too much with corriander and raw wheat for a new brewer etc etc.Im keen to fork out for the correct wyeast ( not the super frothy fermenting variety if possible) for either style and have a couple of kilos of malted BB wheat on the way as well as my 14 odd kgs of Tf Fm Ale malt left ( and can order some pilsener or other if needed) but just need to be swayed and pointed in the right direction for the easiest to brew with a basic tasty recipe and fermenting temps.As per many posts will use hellertua pellets less than 20 IBUs if German style. Looking for 24 odd litres of 1044 ish OG to bottle and swill on warmish days.Ive brewed 2 BIABs so far and have gained a fartoonth of confidence in my setup and procedures to start exprimenting :icon_cheers: . Dying to taste my first ever AG i brewed, ready to serve this Friday night can't wait! Cheers guys :icon_drunk:
Beginners Wheat
- Thread starter stixjew
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seamad
beer dog
To get true hefe/wit flavours you really need to do a step mash, which is a bit of faffing about.
From memory may not need a step mash with toneys dunkelweizen
From memory may not need a step mash with toneys dunkelweizen
Silo Ted
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Nick JD
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What I've found leads to a great hefeweizen.
- Weyermann Pilsner malt. It does make a difference to the final taste.
- More wheat doesn't equal better flavour. Even 30% is enough. 50/50 at most.
- Must be a noble hop.
- Use spec malts. While the general concensus is for a simple grain bill, a lot of commercial hefes have big malt backbones. Try a Schneider Weiss - pretty sure it's got a small amount of smoked malt. Malt in a hefe (while not being dark enough to be a dunkle) really compliments the esters.
- Step mashes help a lot. The Acid Rest in the 40s and the Dex Rest in the low 70s make a difference to the retention of phenolics and the body. They are very easy to do with BIAB - mash in with bugger all water and just keep adding add boiling water to raise the temp to each step.
- 3068 is worth the krausen-monster issues.
- Go for 1.055 at least for your OG. Most great hefes are all above 5% - this is a big part of their character and the higher OG is critical for body, head retention, flavour and most importantly the alcohol carries those esters and phenolics to your nose.
Belgian Wits are much harder to get right. Tackle them next.
- Weyermann Pilsner malt. It does make a difference to the final taste.
- More wheat doesn't equal better flavour. Even 30% is enough. 50/50 at most.
- Must be a noble hop.
- Use spec malts. While the general concensus is for a simple grain bill, a lot of commercial hefes have big malt backbones. Try a Schneider Weiss - pretty sure it's got a small amount of smoked malt. Malt in a hefe (while not being dark enough to be a dunkle) really compliments the esters.
- Step mashes help a lot. The Acid Rest in the 40s and the Dex Rest in the low 70s make a difference to the retention of phenolics and the body. They are very easy to do with BIAB - mash in with bugger all water and just keep adding add boiling water to raise the temp to each step.
- 3068 is worth the krausen-monster issues.
- Go for 1.055 at least for your OG. Most great hefes are all above 5% - this is a big part of their character and the higher OG is critical for body, head retention, flavour and most importantly the alcohol carries those esters and phenolics to your nose.
Belgian Wits are much harder to get right. Tackle them next.
seamad
beer dog
+1 nickjd
All good points, however, for a newish brewer, there is nothing wrong with 50/50 Pils/wheat, single infusion mash and WB06. Sure, it aint erdinger etc, but it will make a good starting point.
For witbiers, i did a simple wit, with pils/wheat, some flour ( yep flour, 500g in a 20 litre batch ), dried orange peel, coriander and WY 3944. Turned out freaking sensational. No harder than a UK ale. Next time, i might do a step mash, but honestly, the KISS approach made a bloody good beer.
For witbiers, i did a simple wit, with pils/wheat, some flour ( yep flour, 500g in a 20 litre batch ), dried orange peel, coriander and WY 3944. Turned out freaking sensational. No harder than a UK ale. Next time, i might do a step mash, but honestly, the KISS approach made a bloody good beer.
bowie in space
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tell us more about the flour
I threw in 500g of plain flour in the mash. Got a little drop in eff, maybe a few %, but that was it. Taste wise i was very happy. That was maybe 18 months ago. If i did it again, i'd maybe do an acid rest with all malt. But it worked, and it worked well. I had visitors from europe, and they were most impressed. I too thought it was pretty bloody good.
Thanks for the replies, some great advice and plans for future brews.So i think im leaning towards the easier of the two (if there is one) and will go with something along the lines of this? Pease advise if retard status detected or other,lol
55% weyerman pilsener
5%smoked malt
40% wheat malt
hallertua to 18 ibu
step mash
biab
40 something celsius for how long?
(65 or not for how long?)
70 something for how long ?
60 min boil
ferment 21 deg with 3068 for two weeks (is 3333 or 3638 nto as good taste wise?)
make sure above 5% at least or OG 1050 plus .5% for bottling?
Phew its all getting more techo now, but im sure it's worth it, thanks again for the help guys if this brew is o.k ill aim for a wit in another brew or two! Stinging for it.
55% weyerman pilsener
5%smoked malt
40% wheat malt
hallertua to 18 ibu
step mash
biab
40 something celsius for how long?
(65 or not for how long?)
70 something for how long ?
60 min boil
ferment 21 deg with 3068 for two weeks (is 3333 or 3638 nto as good taste wise?)
make sure above 5% at least or OG 1050 plus .5% for bottling?
Phew its all getting more techo now, but im sure it's worth it, thanks again for the help guys if this brew is o.k ill aim for a wit in another brew or two! Stinging for it.
Smoked malt in a wit would be disastrous IMHO, 55pils 45 wheat would be fine. You don't have to step mash, 65c for an hour single infusion would work fine. I've only used 3944 in a wit so can't comment on your yeast. 3944 worked great though.
Nick JD
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There's wits and then there's hefes. Belgium vs Germany.
But yeah, a teaspoon of smoked malt is what I was on about - an only in one of the commercial hefes - could even be a tiny bit of burning in a decoction mash. I'd leave it out, I was mentioning it as an example of there being spec malts (caramalts and melanoidins) in hefes.
Have a read through this (all the time realising that if you plan to apply heat to the pot it must be SLOW and LOW, while STIRRING like an crack-smoking monkey). IMO, you'd be better to do your first hefe with a single (isothermal) temperature mash at 66C - but tackle the step mash if you like.
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...st&p=794964
Bada Bing Brewery
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Swinging Beef
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If drinking my brews, other people's home brews and many craft brewers wheat beers has taught me anything, is that they MUST be the hardest beer style to get right, because so many of them fall short of expectations.
Hoegaarden
Shoefferhoffer
Schniederweiss
Titje
Franziskaaner
Redback
If it doesnt taste much like any of these, you got it wrong.
With only 10-20IBU, moderate alcohol levels and limited specialty grains, there is no where to hide.
Wheat beers are pretty much ALL about yeast handling.
I agree with pretty much all the preceeding advice from other forum members, too.
DO use a giant starter of a propper wheat yeast
DO use a very simple grain and hop bill
DO keep everything simple and clean.
Hoegaarden
Shoefferhoffer
Schniederweiss
Titje
Franziskaaner
Redback
If it doesnt taste much like any of these, you got it wrong.
With only 10-20IBU, moderate alcohol levels and limited specialty grains, there is no where to hide.
Wheat beers are pretty much ALL about yeast handling.
I agree with pretty much all the preceeding advice from other forum members, too.
DO use a giant starter of a propper wheat yeast
DO use a very simple grain and hop bill
DO keep everything simple and clean.
Malted
Humdinger
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Some generic food for thought.
Yeast is the hero of a wheat beer and how you deal with it can have big effects.
Generally speaking if you brew at the upper end of the wheat yeast temperature range (quoted by manufacturer) you will get more banana flavours (esters) and brew at the lower end of the temp for that yeast you will get more clove flavours (phenols).
Of the advice above and the three do's, note this: "Over pitching can result in a near complete loss of banana character. Decreasing the ester level will allow a higher clove character to be perceived." WYEAST link It is not neccessarily a bad thing, just depends on whether you want banana flavour or not; personally I like it.
It also depends on the yeasts; Wyeast 3944 Belgian Witbeer by its nature does not produce many esters (banana flavour). So some yeasts lean more towards banana, some more to cloves and some are balanced but you can push most of them one way or the other with temperature and/or yeast pitching rates.
Tartness.
Who doesn't like a good tart? Some wheat beers are meant to be slightly tart. Some yeasts will make it tart, some folks use raw (unmalted) wheat as a component in the mash to add a certain flavour to the beer and add a bit of tartness to the brew. Slightly tart (or minimally sour) can be percieved as refreshing when drinking on a hot day. The alternative to raw wheat is Torrified Wheat, which is raw wheat that has been popped like popcorn; it has a faster conversion and a higher yield than raw wheat and is generally easier to work with; it may not give the same flavour.
Cloudiness.
Most wheat beers are somewhat cloudy. Some folks add a few tablespoons of good old milled plain flour to make sure their brew has the right cloudiness. My missus thinks my wheat beer looks like a urininary tract infection.
Yeast is the hero of a wheat beer and how you deal with it can have big effects.
Generally speaking if you brew at the upper end of the wheat yeast temperature range (quoted by manufacturer) you will get more banana flavours (esters) and brew at the lower end of the temp for that yeast you will get more clove flavours (phenols).
Of the advice above and the three do's, note this: "Over pitching can result in a near complete loss of banana character. Decreasing the ester level will allow a higher clove character to be perceived." WYEAST link It is not neccessarily a bad thing, just depends on whether you want banana flavour or not; personally I like it.
It also depends on the yeasts; Wyeast 3944 Belgian Witbeer by its nature does not produce many esters (banana flavour). So some yeasts lean more towards banana, some more to cloves and some are balanced but you can push most of them one way or the other with temperature and/or yeast pitching rates.
Tartness.
Who doesn't like a good tart? Some wheat beers are meant to be slightly tart. Some yeasts will make it tart, some folks use raw (unmalted) wheat as a component in the mash to add a certain flavour to the beer and add a bit of tartness to the brew. Slightly tart (or minimally sour) can be percieved as refreshing when drinking on a hot day. The alternative to raw wheat is Torrified Wheat, which is raw wheat that has been popped like popcorn; it has a faster conversion and a higher yield than raw wheat and is generally easier to work with; it may not give the same flavour.
Cloudiness.
Most wheat beers are somewhat cloudy. Some folks add a few tablespoons of good old milled plain flour to make sure their brew has the right cloudiness. My missus thinks my wheat beer looks like a urininary tract infection.
Silo Ted
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Exactly !
seamad
beer dog
With the wit allow for a lower effeciency than normal because of the raw wheat. If your normal effeciency is@75% then work out quantities with@60-65%.
If SG is too high can always add water for more beer!
It is a great drop
If SG is too high can always add water for more beer!
It is a great drop
seamad
beer dog
With the wit allow for a lower effeciency than normal because of the raw wheat. If your normal effeciency is@75% then work out quantities with@60-65%.
If SG is too high can always add water for more beer!
It is a great drop
If SG is too high can always add water for more beer!
It is a great drop
seamad
beer dog
With the wit allow for a lower effeciency than normal because of the raw wheat. If your normal effeciency is@75% then work out quantities with@60-65%.
If SG is too high can always add water for more beer!
It is a great drop
If SG is too high can always add water for more beer!
It is a great drop
