Are Cascade Kits Really Crap?

[uniiqueuser]

Recently (just before joining this forum) I bought perhaps 2 dozen Cascade kits because they were going for a song at a local Coles store.

Since then I have read a few posts about Cascade kits and there seems to be some controversy over the quality of these kits.

I have made a few brews with both Coles and Woolworths home brand kits - but most generic products come from brand name manufacturers anyway, especially if they are made in Australia (they just change the wrapper in most cases). These tend to turn out all right if I let them mellow in the bottles for at least a couple of months. :icon_cheers:

Question is, are these kits really as bad as some people make out? Is this beer going to be first that I chuck away (definitely a cold day in hell) or are these the opinions of those brewers who have made the effort to go the extra hard yards and have over indulged their pallettes (which is not a bad thing to do)?

 

[thylacine]

URL below is a search technique for accessing AHB info. Enter the text below via Google. Type what you are searching for in between the brackets.

site:aussiehomebrewer.com "cascade"

 

[j1gsaw]

Its a case of diffrent strokes for diffrent folks mate, (reminds me of a porno i saw , hahaha)
The cascade kits from my experience were very ordinary, however, i didnt introduce any grains or fancier hops when i did my batch etc.
They could perhaps be made into a so-so drinking swill.

The yeast supplied with the cans is bloody ********* i reckon, takes forever to ferment out. Id use a better yeast with them.
Cheers

 

[technocat]

As been said above most kits are pretty ordinary if not downright boring unless you add decent quality yeast and hops of your choice. If you follow the instructions on on the can they will all taste the same regardless of what style it tells you it is on the front of the can. As far as Cascade is concerned I think their crown has slipped somewhat over the years probably due to takeovers and marketing pressure.

 

[mfdu]

my 2 cents.

i just did an experiment with the cascade yeast. using two sachets of their 'bohemian yeast", i built a 1 liter starter @ 20 degrees.

i then kept the brew at between 10 and 12 degrees throughout the ferment.
(brew was spicy ghost with 1kg LDME, 200g white sugar and added Pride of Ringwood hops)

this has resulted in a much much better brew - the cascade yeast that comes with (eg the porter) really benefited from
a) not being under-pitched (a 7 gram packet generally just isn't sufficient)
B) being kept at a significant;y lower temperature.

also, whilst i'd pick Coopers or Morgans over Cascade kits, there is far less isohop twang than the "homebrand" kits i've used.

 

[jonocarroll]

Question is, are these kits really as bad as some people make out?

Not all of them - the chocolate mahogany porter, with a little choc grain and perhaps some different hops makes a damn fine drink, even with the kit yeast.

A lot of the issues come from the 'spicy ghost' kit, the yeast for which just isn't suitable for the high-temperature ferments that people usually get away with; you'll get heaps of fusel alcohols and some horrible flavours.

If you don't like the taste of the straight kits, try adding nicer things to them, using them in more sophisticated brewing methods, or if need be, give them to another new brewer.

Oh, and searching the site for 'cascade' will probably be in vain - being the name of a hop, a brewery, and an infamous kit. Good luck with that.

 

[daemon]

I tried a few when I was doing kits and had very mixed results. Certainly the yeast was a big problem but even using a good yeast they were still fairly average. Considering they're more expensive than the Coopers, you'd be better off going for the Morgans range or similar (not in supermarkets).

Based on the look of the tins they certainly seem like a good product but it seems they spent all their money on the marketing instead of the product

 

[Midnight Brew]

hey hey

The first batch that I ever had the failed was a cascade golden harvest lager kit, I'm not clear on what happened but it didn't ferment and I had temperature control but that being said, a couple of months later I successfully made the same recipe and it wasnt a bad beer. I think like all home brewing, never know unless you try it first. Great things come from trial and error.

Dicko

 

[Yeastie Beastie]

Question is, are these kits really as bad as some people make out? Is this beer going to be first that I chuck away (definitely a cold day in hell) or are these the opinions of those brewers who have made the effort to go the extra hard yards and have over indulged their pallettes (which is not a bad thing to do)?

I tried the "beer with attitude" here (linky) and found it to be not too bad but did definitely benefit by being in the bottle longer.

 

[Wonderwoman]

I've had bad luck with the cascade spicy ghost kit... basically the yeast was dead, I had to add an extra packet and the resulting beer tasted like sulfur. Personally I wouldn't use them again, however, I have a friend who uses the cascade golden harvest kit to make a very tasty golden ale. He's made at least 5 batches of it. I'm not sure of his exact recipe, but I know he definitely chucks out the kit yeast.

so if you replace the kit yeast and use other quality ingredients, you can make some very nice beer out of cascade kits.

 

[WarmBeer]

Cascade Choc Mahogonny Porter + 1kg DDME + 300g Choc grain + 15g Fuggles@15mins + S-04 = Winnar

Treat the kits as a quick and easy base you can add to, rather than an all-in-one brew, and you'll be on the road to making decent beer.

 

[HoppingMad]

h34r: Beware the ghost...

...heed the warning...!

Only kit I've ever thrown out 15 years of homebrewing.

Supermarket kits should have stable supermarket yeasts - otherwise they should be sold in a LHBS where the vendor can advise you on it.

Or proper instructions.

What are Cascade thinking?

Hopper.

 

[technocat]

Treat the kits as a quick and easy base you can add to, rather than an all-in-one brew, and you'll be on the road to making decent beer.
[/quote]

Yep that's about the bottom line

 

[jonocarroll]

h34r: Beware the ghost...

A recent discussion between two brewers;

Brewer1: I'm making a Cascade Spicy Ghost. Any tips?
Brewer2: Yeah, add some maltodextrin.
Brewer1: Why's that?
Brewer2: It's got no body...

ba boom boom cha! <_<

 

[krusty_oz]

I brewed a Cascade Golden Harvest Lager in late May (brought on special), added 1kg of Coopers BE2 and 12g Hersbrucker hops (steeped for 10min then added to wort), made up to 21L and fermented at 20C over 2 weeks. Bottled 4 weeks ago and had a tallie tonight. Came out ok and goes well with food but I think it might have been better dry hopped.

 

[gone brewing]

Hey Lager Drinker, looks like we'll be finding out together. I haven't ever used Cascade homebrew kits before but when I saw them going really cheap at Coles I also bought a couple to try. The kit yeast is going in the bin.

WarmBeer's recipe sounds good. I did something similar with the choc mahogany porter and it should be good.

I also got the pale ale kit and I will make an American Pale Ale out of it. You could also go for this style with the lager or draught kits. My plan is to add hops by the bucket load, more LME, crystal grain and ferment it with US-05. Cheers!

 

[dhal4]

All good advice. My first brew was a cascade kit (imperial voyage pale ale) but ditched the included yeast and used US05 ale yeast with half and half malt extract/dextrose and 40g cascade hops (20g for bittering and 20g for flavouring/aroma). Left to bottle condition for two months and turned out very good indeed. even the other halfs sister was impressed and she doesnt even like beer !!

so really like most kit and bit brews used as a base can be very reasonable. It all comes down to ingredient quality.

Cheers

Dan

 

[manticle]

I reckon you could tweak them with a few extra bits and pieces - finishing hops, grain steepings, better yeast etc and ferment with a special care and they'll probably be crackers.

 

[uniiqueuser]

Thanks people.

I might dust off the 23 ltr fermenter and have a crack at these kits with a better yeast and maybe some additions. If these as successful I will upscale the same methods to my 44 gallon megabrews, which have only ever been straight K&K until now.

 

[discoloop]

I've used the pale kit with the supplied yeast a couple of times with mediocre results. Made a cracker of a porter once, though...... Cascade Porter kit, Amber LME, about half a kilo of various yummy grains, a whole bunch of willamette and a yeast culture from a coopers 6 pack. One of my top 5 brews ever but the kit really wouldn't have contributed much....