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Ag Pilsner Recipe

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wee stu

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OK, for my next (ie 2nd) venture into AG brewing I plan to do a Czech style pilsner

What the brew cupboard holds for this is:

Weyerman Pilsner Malt (lots of it)
Saaz Hops
Wyeast 2208 (Bavarian)

by the time of brewing I'll also have
either wyeast 2124 (Bohemian) or, hopefully 2278 (Czech Pilsner)
A fresh supply of lovely soft Adelaide Hills rainwater.

The question is, do I have what it takes?

Is the single hop and grain schedule enough?
Do I need to supplement the water to better approach the style?

Some of you experienced guys must have done some ripper pilsners, what are the secrets?
 

Darren

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I would go with the czech pils yeast.
You will need lots of saaz to get to 35+ IBU
 

GMK

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Wee Stu

You should be able to make a good pilsner with what you have.
My only suggestion is to get another bittering hop as you might needs heaps of saaz -as Saaz is around 4.5%- to get the IBUs up.

Hope this helps
 

Darren

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GMK said:
My only suggestion is to get another bittering hop as you might needs heaps of saaz -as Saaz is around 4.5%- to get the IBUs up.
The last batch of saaz I bought was only 2.2% AA.
I agree, you can add another bittering hop. Wouldn't go over 25 with it though.
Ringwoods have no place in a pils (Flame suit)
The last batch of saaz I bought was 2.2% AA.
Can anyone get hold of NZ saaz pellets?
 

jayse

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Hi Stu,
Hope it all goes well, Some little tid bits of addvice i'll chuck your way is first. Darren is the king when it comes to these beers. B) :chug: (sorry for the name dropping)
Second the designing great beers book is priceless when it comes to the infomation your after here. It pretty well contains everything you need to have a bash at any style in great detial.

Looking at your recipe ideas with the saaz at only 2.5%a.a you'll be looking at around 150g all up so if you have plenty and don't mind using them go for it otherwise the choice i would go with would be use some northern brewer for some or all of the 60minute addition. Although this does not seem to be that common with most of the pilsners i have referenced.

with the water i can't really comment to much but will add a general comment and that is calcium chloride is what you would use to add some extra calcium to the water. It will also had chloride which is said to add to the 'roundness' on the palate.
I guess to make another sweeping not so not it all statement is just add as little as 1g as looking at the pilzen water the calcium level is only 7ppm which is much lower than the recomended 50ppm. Anyway 1 g should give you around 14ppm.
Half a gram will give you 7ppm according to my calcs.

Just going over some stuff i have in print and it seems these use a fair amount of finishing hops. I have been using just 28g at 15mins for the beers i have been making around this general style but for a boh pils iam lead to believe another 20-30g at the very end is not uncommon.

Good luck with it.
Cheers Jayse
 

wee stu

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Cheers guys.

Darren, Goliath is advertising his saaz at 4%, I'll run that through beersmith or promash and look at hop volumes from there, at 4% it could be feasible cost wise.

Jayse - I was veering towards northern brewer for bittering because higher aa% and halertau origins. Maybe a bit more in keeping with the germanic than Czech pilseners? And Daniels is high on my to buy list
 

Darren

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jayse said:
Hi Stu,
Hope it all goes well, Some little tid bits of addvice i'll chuck your way is first. Darren is the king when it comes to these beers. B) :chug: (sorry for the name dropping)
Now Pedro is the KING of pils!
 

THE DRUNK ARAB

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Darren said:
Now Pedro is the KING of pils!
Quiet Darren, his head is big enough as it is!!!!!! ;)

BTW Wee Stu, 5% of carapils wouldn't go astray in your Pils recipe to add a slight sweetness. Also mash lower for a drier beer (64C).

C&B
TDA
 

Jazman

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if i was u i would just use the saaz to se how the single hops went also fwh would be good i would use carapils as well
 

MAH

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I'm not sold on the use of CaraPils in a Pilsner. A Czech Pils is supposed to be between 1.044 and 1.056, medium in body. An all malt beer with an OG in this range, particularly at the upper end should have enough body to classify as medium, without the need for dextrins from a crystal malt. Also the use of CaraPils to add some sweetness seems contray to the character of this beer, which should be crisp with a lingering bitterness.

If you want extra body or extra sweetness for a Pilsner, the same results could be achieved with a slightly higher mash temp, but why do it if it doesn't fit with the style of beer.

My vote is to drop the CaraPils.

Also a 100% Pils malt beer will not give you the colour you want for a Czech Pils (6-10EBC). Depending on your efficiency and therefore amount of malt you have to use, 100% pils malt for a 1.044 beer will leave just under or over 6EBC. If you went up to 1.056 you still would be just around 7EBC. Using a slightly darker grain like Vienna will help with this. A 70/30 - Pils/Vienna of 1.054, would give you a beer of about 8EBC, bang in the middle of the colour range. The Vienna will have a further bonus of adding malt complexity to the beer, which is useful particularly if you are doing a single infusion mash.

Cheers
MAH
 

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THE DRUNK ARAB said:
Darren said:
Now Pedro is the KING of pils!
Quiet Darren, his head is big enough as it is!!!!!! ;)
Did someone call?

My comments on Pils
Go for 38 to 40 IBU
Use 4-5% carapils, 7% munich light
For 23 litres (all saaz)
50g First Wort
40g @ 45
35g @ 30
30g @ 15
30g @ flame ouot (possibly even go to 35)
Use Wyeast 2278 - czech pils yeast
Ferment at 11-12 which means you need a really good and big starter
Ferment will take 3 or 4 weeks and it will be two more months before it becomes good drinking.

Cheers
Pedro
Still the king of Pils!
 

jayse

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Pedro said:
THE DRUNK ARAB said:
Darren said:
Now Pedro is the KING of pils!
Quiet Darren, his head is big enough as it is!!!!!! ;)
Did someone call?

Cheers
Pedro
Still the king of Pils!
Sorry do i get a thousand lashings for miss quoting the royal chain of command? :blink: :eek:


The alpha acid for the hops in your recipe pedro are they around 2.8%?
That is what i calculated for 38ibu.

Jayse
 

Gulf Brewery

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Hi Jayse

2.8% sounds about right. These were plugs

Cheers
Pedro
 

Darren

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I think mine are 2.8 too (just guessed 2.2)
 

wee stu

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I phoned broken legged Dave at Goliath and he said his saaz pellets are 4% - but maybe this a bit high, and he did sound in a lot of pain.

Not sure what my plugs are or if I have enough in hand - will have to check at home.

All this could change things around a bit - thankfully beer smith should help me sort it out.
 

jayse

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Stu.
Here's what pedro's recipe adjusted to 4% a.a saaz could look like.


Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 23.00 Wort Size (L): 23.00
Total Grain (kg): 5.15
Anticipated OG: 1.050 Plato: 12.42
Anticipated EBC: 7.8
Anticipated IBU: 38.6
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 60 Minutes



Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
87.4 4.50 kg. Weyermann Pilsner Germany 317.42 4
4.9 0.25 kg. Weyermann Carapils (Carafoam) Germany 309.07 3
7.8 0.40 kg. Weyermann Munich I Germany 317.42 15




Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
30.00 g. Czech Saaz Pellet 4.00 15.4 First WH
25.00 g. Czech Saaz Pellet 4.00 12.8 45 min.
20.00 g. Czech Saaz Pellet 4.00 5.8 30 min.
30.00 g. Czech Saaz Pellet 4.00 4.6 15 min.
30.00 g. Czech Saaz Pellet 4.00 0.0 0 min.
 

Linz

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and this one
 

dreamboat

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It is a strange occurrence Linz - I would suspect that a little over-indulgence in alcohol may have contributed.

Dreamboat
 

wee stu

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Thanks for all the help guys.

Pilsner postponed for a week or two until I get my hands on the Czech Pilsner yeast.

Will be AG number 3 now, did an Aussie Amber with all POR hopping at the weekend.

......and Linz, I really don't know what to say :D
 

chiller

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Hi Stu,

My Saaz pellets are 4% and they are the genuine article. Harvested by bikini clad university students.

If you can get some NZ Saaz at 7.5 - 8.5% they can be used for a SMALL part of the boil bittering. But nothing compares to the genuine hop used throughout.

Steve
 
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