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Adding Soured Beer To A Stout Recipe

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RobW

The Little Abbotsford Craftbrewery
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I'm currently putting together a recipe for a dry Irish stout and a few of the recipes talk about adding soured beer to get the appropriate tang. Anybody had experience doing this? Do you use stout or any old beer & how much? Are there any potential problems doing this?
 

Asher

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Gday Ken

Dont know much about blending sourness into a beer but If you mashing and interested in introducing the sourness then here's what I do. If youve already made your stout then this process wont work though

I've done a few sour mashes, mainly for Wits but also used this method for a recent stout too.....

What I do:
with about 5% of your grain bill. 2-3 days before mash day I do a mini mash with the grain on the stove. Then cool to around 40deg. Mix in about a teaspoon of crushed barley (this is full of lactic bacteria). Cover with some gladwrap so the wrap sits on the surface of the grain mixture to keep oxygen away from it. Put it in a warm place and let the infection set in... in a few days it will smell like larks vomit. stir this stuff into your mash when doughing in and mash on as usual.... amazingly the smell disappears as soon as you dough in...
but be warned... It smells just like day old drunken spew in carpet before that... ;-)

Asher for now....
 

RobW

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Thanks Asher

It's a partial mash & I haven't done it yet. The method I've read involves leaving an opened bottle covered with a clean cloth at room temp for about 3 days & then adding that to the boil. I might give your way a try - if only to find out what lark's vomit smells like :D
 

Asher

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Ken,

the bottle method is loosely based on the same theory. My way gaurantees a good infection every time. & you get to make it yourself...

Should work fine in a partial mash. I use 250g of base malt for a 25 litre batch. The same proportions should stand for a partial mash too. just make sure you boil the lactic mash part long and hard to kill of infection if only doing a part boil.

Asher for now
 

RobW

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Thanks Asher

I do a 60 min boil so should be OK.
How long do you do the minimash for & what temp?
 

deebee

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Lark's vomit smells like a cross between otter's spleen and wolf nipple chips.
 

jayse

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ken.
i haven't done it but the bottle type method from what i have read is best.
But what you have to do before you add it to the stout is bring it to the boil to kill the bacteria so the stout doesn't keep getting even more sour.
the bacteria will still keep going forever and the stout will just keep getting more sour if you don't boil it first.
So you add a little sterilized sour stout back to the stout.
Get the drift.
The best way is to add a known pure source of good bacteria also.
I think the guru posted the other day something about using plain vogurt.

Jayse
 

RobW

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Jayse

I've seen 2 ways to do it:

1. boil the soured beer & then add to brew as you pitch the yeast (or later)

2. add the soured beer to the main boil & proceed as usual

any pros & cons either way?
 

jayse

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They both sound good mate.
I don't know what the pros or cons are either way sorry.
But boiling it first is essential. You'll find without that the bacteria will keep going to work even in cold beer.

Jayse
 

Asher

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How long do you do the minimash for & what temp?
Just a generic 66deg for 3/4 hour or so l/g ratio of about 2.5/1

As for wether to blend beer after fermenting or sour mash by introducing lactic acid (sour mash) berfore fermentation I think it is personal preference. I choose to try and sour a beer in the beginning and I'd blend at a later date if not sour enough.

GLS uses the yogurt technique and other seeding methods such as raw grains and wild yeasts on his kegged lambics and true sour beers. For a stout I think something a little more subtle is the go

If you can get lactic acid this can be added at bottling in a measured dose to create the same affect as well...

Asher for now
 

RobW

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Asher said:
I choose to try and sour a beer in the beginning and I'd blend at a later date if not sour enough.

For a stout I think something a little more subtle is the go
Definitely agree Asher. Larks vomit here we come :p
 
J

Jovial_Monk

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Hmmm sour beer! guinness is supposed to be or was once (and some versions are now) a sour beer.

Any grain of barley or malt has lactic bacteria on it, don't bother to crush, just add some whole grains.

Some do a sour mash, sparge then boil.

You must kill the bacteria, absobloodylutely! If a yeast can attenuate a beer to (say) 1012, a bacterial infection can take it down to 99x. That is why infections cause bottle bombs


Jovial Monk
 

GMK

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Asher

How did the stout you listed above come out?
 

Darren

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Aha, Should have read this thread first. I see others have smelled the Larks vomit too!
 

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