Acetobacter

[hoohaaman]

Tipped 30lt today,wasn't bad,but was there.I dont waste time with bad beers these days.
Had 3 fermenters sitting next to each other,all sat there for a month,only one infected.The one that was recultured from a slant.

Think I will make slants per brew,rather then one slant mutiple brews.Was careful under the flame ect.

Anyway I know why Zwickel does heaps of the same strain for single use.

Cheers,oh and i hate vinegar

 

[~MikE]

it wouldn't be an infected slant, i'm guessing you're getting infected from slant to liquid, but having one slant per batch would start your first starter with lots more cells and should fix this...

 

[Airgead]

it wouldn't be an infected slant, i'm guessing you're getting infected from slant to liquid, but having one slant per batch would start your first starter with lots more cells and should fix this...

Yep... I always use a full slant for each batch. Like Mike said - the more cells you start with the less chance of an infection in your starter. I usually make up 5-10 of each strain at a time so I always have one on hand. Agar is cheap and it doesn't take much longer to make 10 slants than it takes to make 1 or 2 so its good insurance.

Cheers
Dave

 

[hoohaaman]

it wouldn't be an infected slant, i'm guessing you're getting infected from slant to liquid, but having one slant per batch would start your first starter with lots more cells and should fix this...

MikE,I know it wasn't an infected slant.Rather my process.Most likely slant to liquid,as you say.I have recultured off the same slant again today,just for a test.Could have sucked in after primary had finished,it was there for a month with a good head space.


In future I will make slants for single use.

Airgead,your right,if making slants 10 are as easy as 2.They dont take much room in the fridge, at 60-100 compared to stubbies/coke bottles.

Cheers guys

 

[hoohaaman]

Up to 100lt down the sink now.I can't find this damn bug.It's not yeast.Split batches with dry are infected as well.Which tells me cold side of kettle transfer.

Changed all transfer tubes,new fermenters,still there.Only common ground is the plate chiller.I boiled the sucker for over a hour,would this kill acetobacter? or other bugs?OR does it need to be flushed through beer in/beer out?

My brewing has come to a stop because of this problem ,no beer left,and those in primary prolly infected as well.Lagers,so 3 weeks to taste and smell the cursed acetic.

Everything that contacts wort has been put in a strong bleach bath,rinsed then sanitized with iodophor.I no-chilled tonight for the first time,to check if a chill plate problem.

Fresh eyes most welcome.



Cheers

 

[newguy]

Can you take the plate chiller apart? If not, find some caustic (NaOH) and hook up a pump to recirculate the caustic through the chiller for ~60 minutes, then let it soak (no pump) for another 60 minutes.

That aside, it's very good practice to replace all your vinyl hoses, racking canes, etc. every year.

 

[hoohaaman]

Fast approaching giving up plate chiller.

I'll never give up making beer.Although this infection has me questioning things]

I'll never give up brewing,just give up drinking B)]

Thanks Newguy

 

[trogdor]

I feel you pain. I've just gone through exactly the same thing (it had me questioning things to). Lost 3 in a row

I ended up writing a list of everything that comes in contact with the beer and went through one by one cleaning/sanatising or replacing everything on the list. It seems like a simple fix but writing everything down really helped keep a track of everything that needed to be done (jeez I sound like I should be wearing tweed or a beige cardigan).

Also in the meantime, in my desperation I went back to mixing up a K&K (coz I can't f**K that up!), just to get something to drink again.

Look at the bright side, at least you've given your liver a break!!!

Hope you get it sorted :icon_cheers:

Trav

 

[hoohaaman]

Good point Trogdor,i'll do a list as well.Where do you think the bug was?In your setup?

 

[trogdor]

It ended up being a $2 bit of hose that had some crap in it - lesson learned!

 

[Weizguy]

MikE,I know it wasn't an infected slant.Rather my process.Most likely slant to liquid,as you say.I have recultured off the same slant again today,just for a test.Could have sucked in after primary had finished,it was there for a month with a good head space.


In future I will make slants for single use.

Airgead,your right,if making slants 10 are as easy as 2.They dont take much room in the fridge, at 60-100 compared to stubbies/coke bottles.

Cheers guys

Maybe the headspace is the issue, and the bug is coming from the air. See this post from Zwickel, and Tony's pics above it.

I have mentioned previously that this acetobacter tends to be more prevalent (at my house) in beer that's been left for a while, and if the ambient temp gets too warm as well. Do you get this problem in Winter? Do you have little flies in the house? They are lousy with acetobacter.

I recently made a K&K beer that was crustier than Tony's. I have come to hate the vinegar as well.

 

[hoohaaman]

Hi Les,thanks for links.I don't think head space is the issue,as it has happened with near full fermenters as well.

The first infection was mid august so temps were cool.It had a 30mm pellicle on top which was dark and custard like.I was away for month so didn't see it develop.I thought it would be safe in primary with the cool temps.

I put it down to an infection from wild yeast entering after positive pressure from co2 subsided,and moved on.Have not brewed a clean batch since.

I have seen the odd small fly around,but pretty sure it is something post boil.I have stopped brewing for now,to strip down everything to clean and sanitise.Have decided to change my chemicals to the Five Star line up.

The PBW sure did remove some crap from the chiller,will probably run caustic through as well and see if that gets anymore.

Cheers guys thanks for your suggestions :icon_cheers:

 

[hoohaaman]

At last finally drinking some clean beers,free from infection.YAY

Never found where the infection was,but my guess was the plate chiller.For future readers with this problem,I pulled entire brewery apart cleaned with PBW and sanitised with star san.Hot and cold side of kettle.

I thought I was pretty good with sanitation,but upon reading more and listening to people like Charlie Tally of Five Star,realized I was pretty slack.

While it was a frustrating time,I learnt some very important information, that general reading regarding sanitation doesn't cover.This I will take away as a positive from the bad experience.

I would urge anyone who brews to get hold of Charlie Tally's interview on the Brewing network podcast archive.
http://www.thebrewingnetwork.com/membersar...ive03-19-06.mp3

It certainly helped me realize the mistakes I was making.

Cheers

 

[afromaiko]

Do you have little flies in the house?

I think these are fungus gnats or drain flies. If you have potted plants inside they love the moist soil and lay their eggs in it so take it easy between watering and let at least the top few inch of soil dry out thoroughly. They also like to live in your drains too and you can kill them off with a dose of boiling water tipped down the plug hole. I see them about sometimes and wonder what will happen if they decide to do a kamikaze into my filling fermenter so try to keep it covered when possible.