A Guide To All-grain Brewing In A Bag

[boingk]

I got truely woefull effeciency on the wheat beer yesterday. Today I pitched the yeast and took an OG and got 1043 and for only 21.5L in the fermenter.
Was expecting 25L at 1050
Mucking with Beersmith gives me 50% effeciency.

Welcome to my domain, first 2 brews have been in the 50's...will see if the acidity imparted by crystal, choc and patent grain for my stout will help my efficiency any. Interesting stuff, also read through Palmers and got an acidity/hardness table thingo which looks good.

Great one except for the home brewing science part. I like science and believe that BIAB does break the rules but not the science. Much easier to believe the science is right and the rules are wrong. Besides any home brew rule BIAB proves wrong will not be the first one shown to be wrong.

Somone here has a tagline which sums it up beautifully. Goes something like 'Rules are for the guidance of wise men, and the adherence of fools'. Love it.

- boingk

 

[eamonnfoley]

Hi, I've been having a crack at BIAB. My first BIAB brew was not infected, but noticably harsh tasting with little hop/malt flavour and severe bitterness. I havent found any holes in my brewing technique yet (discussed in other threads), but im concerned about my water. My tap water yesterday had a PH of 7.7. And it also seems to have a bit of chlorine (Maylands WA).

Could this have a significant effect on brewing a APA ? I'm planning on using some acidulated malt in the next BIAB I do, maybe 2-3%. Might try and boil off the chlorine before I start also.

Mind you, I had a slighlty different rough flavour (again not infected) with a extract brew I did as part of the troubleshooting exercise. I'm now thinking maybe this is a chlorine thing, as I believe PH doesnt affect extract brews noticeably. Any ideas?

Cheers, Foles.

 

[Bribie G]

Foles - At the risk of sending your power bill through the roof, bringing your strike water to boiling should drive off the chlorine, then let it cool back down to your 68 degrees whatever. If you think it could be a pH thing, the sponsors sell a PH stabilizer for the mash water that stabilises it to 5.2.

I've just ordered a six dollar pack of it as a trial.

I can't see that BIAB as such would affect the bitterness unless you have been heavily into grains with tannins, such as using lots of crystal malt and doing some sort of mash out at a high temperature, e.g. kettles of boiling water.

With an American using lots of crystals maybe you could try adding to the mash towards the end as they only need steeping, not the full mash.

Do you no chill as well? There's a lot of discussion on the NC threads about unwanted bittering that could eventuate with high hop beers like Americans.

 

[SpillsMostOfIt]

I stopped worrying about pH since I bought a tub of this: Five Star 5.2 Stabiliser which conforms to my previously stated position of adopted/enforced simplicity.

Chlorine is a different matter. I used to filter my water through a carbon filter on its way to the mash tun, now I just use rainwater. You could test the chlorine theory by purchasing some water from the supermarket or the local servo (tip: look for big containers, you will need too many 600ml bottles to fit in a bike pannier...) or Brita filtering your mash water.

Sound the Egg Sucking Lesson Alert:

Is it possible that you are introducing the flavour via your cleaning regime or something like that?

 

[eamonnfoley]

Foles - At the risk of sending your power bill through the roof, bringing your strike water to boiling should drive off the chlorine, then let it cool back down to your 68 degrees whatever. If you think it could be a pH thing, the sponsors sell a PH stabilizer for the mash water that stabilises it to 5.2.

I've just ordered a six dollar pack of it as a trial.

I can't see that BIAB as such would affect the bitterness unless you have been heavily into grains with tannins, such as using lots of crystal malt and doing some sort of mash out at a high temperature, e.g. kettles of boiling water.

With an American using lots of crystals maybe you could try adding to the mash towards the end as they only need steeping, not the full mash.

Do you no chill as well? There's a lot of discussion on the NC threads about unwanted bittering that could eventuate with high hop beers like Americans.

Thanks for the tips. I guess in planning for my next attempt - I'd like to think (hoping) that PH &/or chlorine can actually lead to the non-infection problems I am describing! There is a medicinal twang in my beers also.

 

[eamonnfoley]

I stopped worrying about pH since I bought a tub of this: Five Star 5.2 Stabiliser which conforms to my previously stated position of adopted/enforced simplicity.

Chlorine is a different matter. I used to filter my water through a carbon filter on its way to the mash tun, now I just use rainwater. You could test the chlorine theory by purchasing some water from the supermarket or the local servo (tip: look for big containers, you will need too many 600ml bottles to fit in a bike pannier...) or Brita filtering your mash water.

Sound the Egg Sucking Lesson Alert:

Is it possible that you are introducing the flavour via your cleaning regime or something like that?

That 5.2 stuff looks good indeed. Will have to order some. The cleaning regime hopefully isnt a problem. I thoroughly rinse off my sterilising solution (Chlorinated Tri-sodium Phosphate, http://www.homebru.com.au/index.php?main_p...products_id=617), then use Iodophor to sanitise. I also use boiling water in my fermenters beforehand. Maybe I should try a different cleaning product?

I dont no chill either. But have problems getting the wort down to pitching temp after using my plate chiller (gets to about 40C or so in one take). Takes a hour or two in ice water after the chilling, especially in hot weather.

 

[SpillsMostOfIt]

Does any of this shed any light?

http://www.howtobrew.com/section4/chapter21-2.html

 

[eamonnfoley]

Does any of this shed any light?

http://www.howtobrew.com/section4/chapter21-2.html

only thing that comes close is medicinal. My 3 approaches for next brew:

1) careful with cleaning product - rinse with boiling water.
2) correct ph
3) try to boil off chlorine before brewing. May even take the time to filter all my brewing water with my brita jug.

thanks!

 

[Pollux]

Right, well that was an entertaining afternoon, I read this ENTIRE thread, plus many of the threads linked from it......

I feel I am now prepared to go with my first BIAB within 2 weeks, just a matter of waiting for finances to order my urn and then my ingredients...

On that topic, any comments on this list?

Amarillo 100gr*2
Cascade 100gr*1
Galaxy 100gr*1
Williamette 100gr*1
Nelson Sauvin 100gr*1


JW Ale Malt 18kg
JW Wheat Malt 12kg
JW Crystal Malt Pale 3kg

Safbrew T-58*2
Safale US-05*3

I have learnt from my extract brewing that I like beer with 1/4 Wheat and a combo of Cascade and Amarillo, I also plan on knocking out some Belgians hence the T-58......

To me it seems a reasonable collection of ingredients for getting myself started, I plan do brewing 20L batches with 4kg of base malt.

 

[boingk]

Pollux - I'd throw some chocolate and munich malts in there, but that really depends on what you want to brew and like to drink. Otherwise I think its a good selection. Also, I'd budget using perhaps a bit more than 4kg base malt as your efficiency may not be that great first time around ( as I know all too well <_< ).

See how things go, anyway - and remember to check your kettle efficiency before you start the hopping regime. I didn't do this, and assumed a 70% efficiency. Got 50%. Over-hopped beer, but thats not a worry as it seems to be alright judging from the gravity samples I've liberated, haha.

Good luck! - boingk

PS: Why not just start a bit of a yeast bank for a few different popular yeasts? I find small jars or those petri dish-like caviar containers with lids to be excellent at containing a bit of slurry in the fridge. Rinsing this to culture, and rinsing again, will let you make a larger master culture which you can let settle and then drain the liquid off. Transfer slurry to small container with minimal headspace and store in fridge. Make starters with a small amount from this master slurry and you're set!

 

[Pollux]

I actually have some yeast from previous batches stored in the fridge in stubbies right now, but I like the idea of having some extra on hand if needed (i.e. slow starter or worse yet a dud one).

Interesting points, I might toss in some choc and/or munich just for some variety, although I want to up hold the rule of K.I.S.S. (Keep it simple stupid).

In terms of efficiency, that means either planning for a 90 min boil to give me time to chill a sample to test before hopping, or maybe getting a refract...mmmm, another toy

 

[Damian44]

I got truely woefull effeciency on the wheat beer yesterday. Today I pitched the yeast and took an OG and got 1043 and for only 21.5L in the fermenter.
Was expecting 25L at 1050
Mucking with Beersmith gives me 50% effeciency.

And just to top this off, I pithed US-05 yeast instead of the dry wheat yeast I just got last week

I should have had a coffee first to wake up

EDIT: On reflection, this is the first mash that I havent stirred often. I just dumped the grain in stirred to wet it all and left it for an hour.
All the other BIAB partials I have stirred a lot and got the efficiencies I wanted.
Just a clumbsy attempt really :angry:

A dodgy thermometer will give you bad efficency. As i found out. You need a back up thermometer thats reliable.

http://appslabs.com.au/index.php?main_page...amp;cPath=400_6

These have a calibration check feature. I ordered the Dip thermometer so i could check the temp at the bottom of pot, but they sent me the wrong one (cheaper) and i kept it.

 

[Mantis]

A dodgy thermometer will give you bad efficency. As i found out. You need a back up thermometer thats reliable.

http://appslabs.com.au/index.php?main_page...amp;cPath=400_6

These have a calibration check feature. I ordered the Dip thermometer so i could check the temp at the bottom of pot, but they sent me the wrong one (cheaper) and i kept it.

I think you may be spot on here Damian.

Today I took the wifes coffee frother, and my meat thermometers out to the shed.

Got the water up to 65 with my brewing/normal thermometer then dipped the other two in. They both read lower so I kept the heat on and in the end, the normal one read 70 and the other two 67.

So my previous mashes would have been at 63C

Will be interesting to see how much difference this makes

I owe you a beer.
:beer:

 

[Mantis]

Well, it made no difference. Got the mash temps right and also did a mashout by raising the temp to 70 while stirring for 10min.
I am now thinking that is the fault of my milling. My first AG hit the correct OG for 75% efficiency and was done with premilled grain from one of the sponsors.

 

[Pollux]

LOL, my wife has just offered to knit me a giant tea cosy for my Urn to help hold mash temps.....

I plan on fitting a yoga mat as insulation around the outside of the urn, but this would provide an extra layer, and hell, it is getting her hobby to merge with mine....

I wonder if it would actually work, she will be knitting in pure wool, opinions?

 

[Bribie G]

LOL, my wife has just offered to knit me a giant tea cosy for my Urn to help hold mash temps.....

I plan on fitting a yoga mat as insulation around the outside of the urn, but this would provide an extra layer, and hell, it is getting her hobby to merge with mine....

I wonder if it would actually work, she will be knitting in pure wool, opinions?

2 degrees drop over an hour, usually.

Maybe she should knit you some leg warmers for that Sydney Winter weather

 

[Fantoman]

Well, I will finally be making the move from Extract + Spec grain to full AG BIAB.

Like BribieG I have gone the urn option (ordered from Craftbrewer last night). Also ordered the grain to do Dr Smurto's Golden Ale as my cherry popper :icon_drool2: (already have a pack of Amarillo in the freezer)...

I am hoping that the urn will arrive by Friday so I can put the brew down this weekend... just have to go to spotlight to get some Voile - will probably start with the peg to the side of the pot option as the wife doesn't have a sowing machine (will eventually borrow her sisters machine when we have a chance).

It seems like a simple enough process but I guess I will find out first hand soon enough...

Will report back once it is done to let you all know how it all went! :beer:

 

[Pollux]

My urn and ingredients are ordered...

Both Ross @ craftbrewer and Pat @ absolute HB are certain I will have my supplies by the weekend....

Bag is sewn.

All I need is to go pick up my NC jerries, and some other bits and pieces and I am set....

 

[Pollux]

Maybe she should knit you some leg warmers for that Sydney Winter weather

She has already knitted me a hat for my recently shaved head....

It's so funny to look at photos of me from 2 weeks ago compared to now...

 

[Fantoman]

So Pollux, it looks like it is you and me FTW this weekend!