A Beer Accompaniment

[FNQ Bunyip]

another use for the old fermenting fridge when it dies. A mashmaster temp controll on a small fan heater (last longer than a hair dryer) . I've seen a couple up here doing bannanas and mangos.

All the meat I ate as billtong in africa was just air dryed. and I never had any ill afects. However I've never done it that way here just used the dehydrater.. We have 2 "narra" dehydraters one has a mashmaster fitted as the thermo bruntout last year, so now its digital

:beer:

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Biltong is air dried salted cured meats

Jerky is cooked over smoke. It uses the same curing/salting technique as biltong


A butcher told me that he makes his biltong using a small box with a light in it and a small fan to draw warm air over the meat to dry it out.

 

[Hopsta]

I love beef jerky and biltong but its pretty expensive at $3 for a little packet, making your own is a great idea providing it can be done in a safe way.

Im about to go and buy a food dehydrator after reading this!

So i just need to get this straight, if i dehydrate the meat at 55*C for 12 hours this is enough to get rid off all the nasties and preserve it? or must you add salt aswell?

Things like soy souce, wistochere, vinegar, chilli etc... these all act like a natural preservative aswell correct?


EDIT - Anyone know where to get a cheap food dehydrator in syd? just did a quick search $130 for a hillmark one.... bit steep. Ebays not much better.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Yes, you need salt.

Sugar ( Honey ) is also a preservative

Vinigar will actually cold cook the meat. This is why you dont use vinigar on fish as it will cook it

 

[Kai]

Well, I've done some research and it appears Safety Steve is very correct in what he says. The meat must be cooked to kill any nasties. I read a particularly good page that is copy writtten so here is the link About a bloke poisoned by some bugs after eating some cougar jerky he made. The author goes to great lengths to explain the neccessity to heat the meat to kill the germs, it is a good read. Seems like 160F for a few hrs does the trick, that is what I'l lbe doing to mine tomorrow.

cheers

Browndog

The cougar case is a parasitic infection usually only found here in pork (as the article mentions). It's also worth pointing out that you can pick up a parasite (if one is present) from ordinary beef simply by eating your steak rare, something I sure as heck am never going to give up.

Bacterial causes of food poisoning are a fair concern, but it's worth remembering that bacteria are typically only present on the surfaces of the meat (which is why cooking a steak rare is ok and doing a hamburger the same is not). I don't know exactly how effective a short salting then a quick vinegar rinse / pickle is, but if the meat is clean to begin with then you are lessening the risk of food poisoning by reducing the water content, water activity and pH. I wouldn't be using meat that had been sitting in the fridge for a few days or on the back seat of the car for a few hours and I wouldn't be feeding this stuff to the young, the old or the immuno-compromised (unless I didn't like them) but I do not think it is terribly dangerous.

 

[tangent]

(which is why cooking a steak rare is ok and doing a hamburger the same is not)

steak tatare is ground and eaten raw

salting is a method of curing, it's all in the salt and vinegar. like gravalax of salmon salt and vodka

 

[browndog]

Well here is the finshed product, chewing on it now as I post

It seemed quite well dried when I took it down this arvo, but I chucked it in the oven at 100C for 15 min to kill the bugs, turned out with a nice terriaki flavour but lacking the chilli I was looking for, a few quick turns of the chilli grinder over the lot and it is not too bad at all and less than 1/2 the price my butcher sells it.

cheers

Browndog

 

[Darren]

hey,
Rare steak = BSE (bovine spongiform encaphalitis) Also known as mad cow disease.

Takes 30+ years to minifest its symptoms. No reported BSE in Australia so far yet. (BTW, I love steak tartare but worry each time I eat it, not only from the meat but raw eggs (salmonella))

Hanging some meat to dry is just asking for problems unles you killed and dressed it your self. God only knows what happened to it in the "butchery"

If you are doing it yourself, pasteurisation is advisable. There are thousands of cases per year of "home poisoning" with poorly cured meat.

The risk is real and lifethreatening especially in the young/old/immunocompromised.

Beware!


cheers
Darren

 

[bindi]

I only eat seafood, true for 16 years, and a beer ,any beer goes great with my all time fav , Cajun Fish :super: spicy , Google it if you don't know.
Fish like Snapper,Pearl perch, Barra and even Nile perch done this style is GREAT, and not forgeting wild prawns, not farmed.
Cooking it now.

 

[Kai]

hey,
Rare steak = BSE (bovine spongiform encaphalitis) Also known as mad cow disease.

Takes 30+ years to minifest its symptoms. No reported BSE in Australia so far yet. (BTW, I love steak tartare but worry each time I eat it, not only from the meat but raw eggs (salmonella))

Salmonella would only be an issue with poorly cleaned eggs as there have been no instance of enteral salmonella in australia... yet.

CJD I worry about almost as much as I do being hit by a beer truck tomorrow.

 

[Darren]

Salmonella would only be an issue with poorly cleaned eggs as there have been no instance of enteral salmonella in australia... yet.

CJD I worry about almost as much as I do being hit by a beer truck tomorrow.

Kai,

Is that what they taught you at Tafe? Watch out for that truck!!!!

http://www.foodscience.afisc.csiro.au/eggquality.htm

From the CSIRO site:
Egg safety
Eggs, like other protein foods such as meat, fish and poultry, may be contaminated with microbes which can, if allowed to grow, cause food poisoning. There have been many documented outbreaks of Salmonella food poisoning from poorly handled eggs.

Salmonella is easy to destroy in cooking. Any food cooked uniformly to a temperature of 72°C will be free of Salmonella. The problem is that we often eat eggs raw or only lightly cooked. Such foods, along with shell eggs, should be treated as though they were contaminated.

Safety Tips
A few simple steps will significantly reduce the risk of food poisoning from egg dishes.

Buy your eggs from supermarkets or shops which store them in the refrigerator or at least in a cool area of the store. Refrigerate your eggs immediately on arriving home - treat them like you treat your milk.
If you make dishes in which the eggs are only lightly cooked, such as some sauces, serve the food immediately or refrigerate. Don't let it stand around at room temperature.
Any souffles, egg nogs etc., containing raw eggs must be kept in the refrigerator until just before they are eaten. Avoid giving young children, the elderly and people with impaired immune systems foods containing raw or lightly cooked eggs.
Observe good personal hygiene when preparing food; always thoroughly wash your hands before starting to prepare food and after handling raw foods.

google: egg, salmonella sofia australia or

An outbreak of Salmonella Typhimurium PT135 gastroenteritis associated with a minimally cooked dessert containing raw eggs

if you have doubts

Also, I didn't say CjD as i am not eating human brains, I said BSE. Maybe google the difference too!

And sure fly blown meat is safe?

cheers

Darren

 

[Kai]

Darren,

I can't contract BSE as my brain is not bovine.

The reference to enteral salmonella was to salmonella infection within the chicken's oviducts and hence, within the egg yolk itself -- a condition that is as far as I konw nonexistent in australia and why raw egg products are a safer venture here than overseas. Hence my saying that if the exterior of the egg is clean and without cracks, the risk is not too high and you can enjoy your tartare. I know I'll enjoy my egg nog this chrissy.

And while my food microbiology subjects were at TAFE, the content and lecturers were from university. And no, I wouldn't eat fly-blown meat.

 

[AndrewQLD]

Sadly, the more "cleaner" our food products become the less chance our bodies have to fight off these bugs. With the way our foods are processed now our stomachs natural bacteria can not cope with the odd occurance of the bacteria mentioned in this thread. We have cleaned our food to the point where we are now susceptable to the slightest infections where once a side off beef could be left to hang for considerable time with no adverse affects because our bodies had a natural capacity to fight them off.

Our bodies are becoming a cleaner growing enviroment for the bad bugs while the good bugs (that fight the bad ones) are slowly dying off.

But I will still make my own sausages and cheese and beer in the hope of negating the effects of our sterile enviroment.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[TidalPete]

Sadly, the more "cleaner" our food products become the less chance our bodies have to fight off these bugs. With the way our foods are processed now our stomachs natural bacteria can not cope with the odd occurance of the bacteria mentioned in this thread. We have cleaned our food to the point where we are now susceptable to the slightest infections where once a side off beef could be left to hang for considerable time with no adverse affects because our bodies had a natural capacity to fight them off.

Our bodies are becoming a cleaner growing enviroment for the bad bugs while the good bugs (that fight the bad ones) are slowly dying off.

But I will still make my own sausages and cheese and beer in the hope of negating the effects of our sterile enviroment.

Cheers
Andrew

Very well said Andrew. I am with you 110% on this. :beerbang:

:beer:

 

[Darren]

Darren,

I can't contract BSE as my brain is not bovine.

The reference to enteral salmonella was to salmonella infection within the chicken's oviducts and hence, within the egg yolk itself -- a condition that is as far as I konw nonexistent in australia and why raw egg products are a safer venture here than overseas. Hence my saying that if the exterior of the egg is clean and without cracks, the risk is not too high and you can enjoy your tartare. I know I'll enjoy my egg nog this chrissy.

And while my food microbiology subjects were at TAFE, the content and lecturers were from university. And no, I wouldn't eat fly-blown meat.

Kai,

Prion (CjD vCJD BSE) disease is not species inhibited.

As for the salmonella, yes, cracked, or poorly cleaned eggs are a problem. Chickens and ducks (birds in general) are absolutely covered with salmonella sp. Did you google salmonella, Australia, egg?

As for no risk with meat hung to dry and not pasteurised, that is just plain silly.

cheers

Darren

 

[AndrewQLD]

Very well said Andrew. I am with you 110% on this. :beerbang:

:beer:

I agree with you agreeing with me Pete, as I have said before "we make a great team".

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Kai]

Kai,

Prion (CjD vCJD BSE) disease is not species inhibited.

I'm aware.

As for the salmonella, yes, cracked, or poorly cleaned eggs are a problem. Chickens and ducks (birds in general) are absolutely covered with salmonella sp. Did you google salmonella, Australia, egg?

Nope.

As for no risk with meat hung to dry and not pasteurised, that is just plain silly.

cheers

Darren

Silly is thinking I intimated there is no risk.

 

[Screwtop]

Kai,

Is that what they taught you at Tafe? Watch out for that truck!!!!

http://www.foodscience.afisc.csiro.au/eggquality.htm

From the CSIRO site:
Egg safety
Eggs, like other protein foods such as meat, fish and poultry, may be contaminated with microbes which can, if allowed to grow, cause food poisoning. There have been many documented outbreaks of Salmonella food poisoning from poorly handled eggs.

Salmonella is easy to destroy in cooking. Any food cooked uniformly to a temperature of 72°C will be free of Salmonella. The problem is that we often eat eggs raw or only lightly cooked. Such foods, along with shell eggs, should be treated as though they were contaminated.

Safety Tips
A few simple steps will significantly reduce the risk of food poisoning from egg dishes.

Buy your eggs from supermarkets or shops which store them in the refrigerator or at least in a cool area of the store. Refrigerate your eggs immediately on arriving home - treat them like you treat your milk.
If you make dishes in which the eggs are only lightly cooked, such as some sauces, serve the food immediately or refrigerate. Don't let it stand around at room temperature.
Any souffles, egg nogs etc., containing raw eggs must be kept in the refrigerator until just before they are eaten. Avoid giving young children, the elderly and people with impaired immune systems foods containing raw or lightly cooked eggs.
Observe good personal hygiene when preparing food; always thoroughly wash your hands before starting to prepare food and after handling raw foods.

google: egg, salmonella sofia australia or

An outbreak of Salmonella Typhimurium PT135 gastroenteritis associated with a minimally cooked dessert containing raw eggs

if you have doubts

Also, I didn't say CjD as i am not eating human brains, I said BSE. Maybe google the difference too!

And sure fly blown meat is safe?

cheers

Darren

I'm voting 100% with the info above, purely because Darren finally posted a positive response!

Thanks Darren!

 

[Kai]

As for the salmonella, yes, cracked, or poorly cleaned eggs are a problem. Chickens and ducks (birds in general) are absolutely covered with salmonella sp. Did you google salmonella, Australia, egg?

Apologies for replying to the same quote twice, but I did just google this and the first line I found was "Australian egg industry is untroubled by the strains of Salmonella Enteritidis that have caused human
illness abroad."

You probably found it yourself, it was the point of my first post concerning raw egg products and why they are less of a risk here than they are overseas. Not arguing anything else about it, though I suspect any professional opinion about raw egg will be the same as mine and the same as mine about biltong; avoiding the young, the old and the immunoblahblah.

Merry xmas, daz. You're welcome to drop around for some parasitic O157:H7 dried meats and a few botulistic ales. I'll even whip you up some egg nog.

 

[AndrewQLD]

Apologies for replying to the same quote twice, but I did just google this and the first line I found was "Australian egg industry is untroubled by the strains of Salmonella Enteritidis that have caused human
illness abroad."

You probably found it yourself, it was the point of my first post concerning raw egg products and why they are less of a risk here than they are overseas. Not arguing anything else about it, though I suspect any professional opinion about raw egg will be the same as mine and the same as mine about biltong; avoiding the young, the old and the immunoblahblah.

Merry xmas, daz. You're welcome to drop around for some parasitic O157:H7 dried meats and a few botulistic ales. I'll even whip you up some egg nog.

Yeeha, I am now untroubled by my indulgence in Batz's home grown eggs and my own cultured brewers yeasts, home made sausages and home made cheese. Thanks kai, I will have one egg nog slightly underdone.

Cheers
Andrew