1st Time Liquid Yeast Use

[fergi]

i am going to make a kolsch this weekend so i have got hold of my first liquid yeast,

what is the best way to approach the use of this type of yeast, do i just tip in the contents of the glass vial into the fermenter or do i have to make a starter.

after the fermentation i am going to save the trub and try cleaning the yeast for the next batch, "hopefully".

the yeast is whitelabs WLPO36.

 

[manticle]

I predominantly use Wyeast activator packs which contain 100 billion cells and are good for pitching to wort up to 1060 (19 litres).

Whitelabs recommend making a starter for wort over 1060 when using their yeast. Under that, you are probably OK.

How do I make a "starter"?

White Labs Pitchable yeast is packaged with 70 to 140 billion yeast cells, which corresponds approximately to a 1-2 liter size starter. Lag times are typically between 12-24 hours for a normal strength brew.

A yeast starter is a small volume of wort that you add to your yeast to initiate cell activity or to increase the cell count before using it to make your beer. The yeast will grow in this smaller volume, usually for 1-2 days, which then can be added to 5 gallons of wort.

While a starter is not always necessary, White Labs recommends making a starter if the Original Gravity is over 1.060, if the yeast is past its "Best Before" date, if you are pitching lager yeast at temperatures below 65F, or if a faster start is desired.

Procedure:

In a medium sauce pan, add 2 pints of water and 1/2 cup Dried Malt Extract (DME). Mix well and boil the solution for about 10 minutes to sterilize. Cover and cool the pan to room temperature in an ice bath. This will give you a wort of approximately 1.040 OG. Keeping the Original Gravity low is important because you want to keep the yeast in its growth phase, rather than its fermentation phase. The fermentation phase will create alcohol which can be toxic to yeast in high concentrations.

Pour the wort into a sanitized glass container (flask, growler, etc.) and pitch the vial of yeast. Cover the top of the container with a sanitized piece of aluminum foil so that it is flush with the container, but will still allow CO2 to escape. Vigorously shake or swirl the container to get as much oxygen dissolved in the solution as possible. Allow the starter to sit at room temperature for 12-24 hours, occasionally shaking it to keep the solution aerated.

You probably wont see any visible activity, but the yeast is busy taking up the oxygen and sugars in the solution and growing new cells. After the yeast has consumed all of the nutrients and oxygen, it will form a milky white layer on the bottom of the container. If you are not planning on pitching the yeast right away, you can store it in the refrigerator with the foil still in place. When you are ready to brew, decant off most of the clear liquid from the top, being careful not to disturb the yeast layer below. Once the yeast and your wort are at approximately the same (room) temperature, rouse the starter yeast into suspension and pitch the entire quantity into your fermenter.

Typical Starter Volumes for 5 gallons:
To activate the yeast: 1 pint (with 1/4 cup DME)
To revitalize yeast past its Best Before Date: 2 pints (with 1/2 cup DME)
To brew a high gravity beer: 2 pints (with 1/2 cup DME)
To brew a lager beer, starting fermentation 50-55F: 4 pints (with 1 cup DME)

 

[DUANNE]

you could just warm the vial up and pitch straight into the wort but it would be preferable to make a starter up first.if using just a simple starter then 2 litres should be alright and ferment it out and tip the beer off the top and pitch just the yeast. you could pitch the lot as an active starter but i personaly would not want that 'beer' in such a lightly flavoured beer as a kolsch. when the beer is finished you can just leave a little beer in the fermenter and swirl the yeast up into solution and bottle 3 or four bottlees of it from there.

edit what manticle posted. but wieghing the dme is preferable for accuracys sake. 100g per litre is about what your aiming for

 

[Brewer_010]

KISS
Keep it simple stupid

The white labs vials and wyeast are meant to be pitched directly - unless they're old. If the vial is within date just whack her in, maybe drop a teaspoon of yeast nutrient in if you're concerned about the quality of the yeast. I reckon making a starter is just a pain the arse unless you absolutely have to.

I use liquid yeast, I keep the trub after racking the beer to a keg (about 150mL), then use that yeast within a few weeks along with some nutrient. My yeast always fire, they get to high krausen inside 12 hours and its easy, no ******* about with starters and what else.

cheers

 

[manticle]

Brewer 01010 whatsist has it right. If the yeast is fresh and the brew is not stupid high gravity - pitch it in.

Starters are great (I do them for most brews) but to begin, if your brews are average gravity and the yeast is fresh, simplify the process and only complicate when you need/want to.

 

[Wolfy]

Kolsch yeast is a 'hybrid' type yeast and should almost be treated like a lager.
The last Kolsch I made was pitched at 13C and fermented at 17C, and then lagered for 3 weeks, however that did require a a large amount of healthy yeast.

IMHO can do it the 'easy way' - pitch the single pack and ferment it on the warm side, and you will likely have good results ... or you could do it the 'right way' - make a large starter (check MrMalty for a 'hybrid' yeast and see what it says), pitch it cool, ferment cool and then lager for a few weeks and hopefully produce a great beer. If it's worth the extra effort to make a starter is up to you.

 

[fergi]

ok thanks for comments there guys, few different ideas so i will see what happens.
fergi

 

[fergi]

i dont know but my yeast might be faulty, i took the yeast vial out of the fridge at 1pm yesterday,at 8 pm i poured 200 ml water with 200 ml dextrose and boiled it for a couple of minutes.

after cooling it down to 22 deg i tipped the yeast into the sterilised jar , shook the vial of yeast and poured it into the jar with the wort. tonite it is 24 hours later and it doesnt have any sign of life, it has a gladwrap cover over the jar and has been sitting in the kitchen which is 18 deg.

i have my first AG kolch sitting in a cube waiting for its yeast, i do have a us 05 yeast available but really wanted to use the proper yeast for my first kolch.

fergi

 

[manticle]

A few things.

The way you describe your process is unclear. I am presuming the boil was the water which was allowed to cool before being added to wort? the way you describe it sounds like you boiled the yeast.

Not best practice to add dex or sucrose etc to a starter.

Small amounts of yeast can ferment out without much in the way of visible signs. Is there a bit more yeast at the bottom of the vessel? Are there bubbles moving through the wort when you hold it to the light? Did the gravity drop?

Also good practice to shake the vial as much as you can remember in the first few hours.

 

[fergi]

A few things.

The way you describe your process is unclear. I am presuming the boil was the water which was allowed to cool before being added to wort? the way you describe it sounds like you boiled the yeast.

Not best practice to add dex or sucrose etc to a starter.

Small amounts of yeast can ferment out without much in the way of visible signs. Is there a bit more yeast at the bottom of the vessel? Are there bubbles moving through the wort when you hold it to the light? Did the gravity drop?

Also good practice to shake the vial as much as you can remember in the first few hours.

i didnt boil the yeast mants just the water etc, there is a bit of yeast on the bottom of the jar but no visible bubbles like when i do my coopers yeast'didnt do the gravity bit, never used to do it with the coopers yeast,

only had dextrose for my starter as i had run out dry malt, should still ferment out though, then i was going to pour off the liquid and pour the yeast into my kolch.
fergi

 

[Wolfy]

i dont know but my yeast might be faulty
...
i have my first AG kolch sitting in a cube waiting for its yeast, i do have a us 05 yeast available but really wanted to use the proper yeast for my first kolch.

The fault is more likely to be due to what you did than something with the yeast.

You took a vial of yeast that was made to pitch into 19L (5US gallons) of wort, and pitched it into a 200ml Dextrose starter, the yeast cells likely consumed all nutrients in such a small volume of wort very very quickly - which means you'd not expect to see anything at all (when reculturing Coopers yeast you start with only a small amount of yeast not the large amount of yeast in the WhiteLabs vial).
I'm quite sure the MrMalty calculator would have suggested a starter size closer to 3L or even 4L.
Dex is also a simple sugar and as such it does not provide the full range of nutrients the yeast need, likely making it 'worse' for them again.

If you're going to make a starter you need to give the yeast enough of the nutrients they need to reproduce and get healthy: a starter size in the rage of 1-4L using LDME at a rate of about 100g per L of water, else you are better 'under pitching' and simply pitching the vial directly into your wort.

If you used a no-chill cube (so things should be as sanitized as possible) try pitching the liquid yeast into a much larger volume starter (again check what MrMalty says) and use LDME this time rather than straight dex - if after another 24h you have a nice layer of white/creamy yeast on the bottom of the container and it smells/tastes fine you should be good to pitch it into your beer. However if you did not no-chill you have the choice of pitching what might not be so healthy yeast from your starter or the US05 - but I'd do that sooner than later so the wort does not sit too long before the yeast is pitched.

 

[manticle]

i didnt boil the yeast mants just the water etc, there is a bit of yeast on the bottom of the jar but no visible bubbles like when i do my coopers yeast'didnt do the gravity bit, never used to do it with the coopers yeast,

only had dextrose for my starter as i had run out dry malt, should still ferment out though, then i was going to pour off the liquid and pour the yeast into my kolch.
fergi

Probably fermented out in a jiffy.

With a brew under 1060, as suggested earlier, you should probably have pitched the lot rather than made a 200mL starter with dex.

I'd be inclined to chuck the lot in to your brew and if gravity hasn't dropped a single point in 24-36 hours, then pitch the 05. You could try and revive it with some (maybe 2 L) of your no chilled wort - if doing so, whack the cube in the fridge and if no sign in the starter (and you should be able to tell gravity this time) after 24-36 hours, pitch the 05.

Starters are good but only if you do them properly.

 

[fergi]

ok thanks guys,
as i am in the country i cant access any malt at the moment so i am going to throw it into the fermenter as is.
i will see by the morning then if there is any action.
fergi

 

[fergi]

well looks like my first kolsch with liquid yeast has turned out a disaster.

just tasted it from the fermenter /test tube.

fg is 1010 but still burping away 3 times a minute,i think it is probably wild yeast chomping through it now as the taste has a burning sensation on the tongue and the smell is not quite right.

i have just made another screwy,s red today so i reckon i will buy a new fermenter as i dont want to chance putting my red into a fermenter that could now be suspect.
i will leave the kolsch a few more days and try it again but i cant see it improving.
fergi