1st time Lager, yeast technique

[Drewgong]

Hope I didn’t come across argumentative, was not the intention. It is just that this question came up when talking to a mate of mine the other day and it would be good if someone with more knowledge could weigh in as to whether carbonation makes any difference. Personally I don’t think it would.

nah mate not at all. I'd love to hear from a lager expert I'd hate to wait all that time and end up with a **** beer.

 

[Moad]

I think there is an impact on the yeast, I seem to remember reading fermenting under pressure suppresses ester formation. @MHB ?

 

[labels]

There are probably two stages to lagering. In my brewing process there is definitely the two stages. The first one is while the yeast ist still active.

If you drop the temperature slowly after most (but not all) primary fermenation is complete then the yeast will still work down to 3C. Good to hold there for a few days if possible.

You can then drop down to zero or even a little below zero. At this point the yeast stops and drops out but so do polyphenols and starch haze etc leaving the beer smooth without any astringency and perfectly clear.

This takes time - several weeks, you must have patience for lagers.

 

[krz]

Just an update for everyone.
Had my first beer from this batch today, 5 days ago. The head was a bit light, but after another sampling tonight its a winner.
I'll have my mates sample it on the weekend and will provide their verdict

 

[krz]

Last update this batch!

So Last night I had a poker night, 5 guys drinking the home brew and 1 drinking canned bourbon.
We went thru the entire keg and everyone was quite impressed and of course they should have been.
The only slightly negative comment was, "its not that clear!". I went on to add, that if I would have added fish guts or gelatin, would that have made it better!

This morning, no one had a headache!!!!!
Sucessfull 1st lager brew. )
And theres no more left

 

[gaijin]

You asked about lagering under pressure a while back and I don't think it was answered - it might help you for your next batch. I've done quite a few lagers and have found that this process works for me quite well: Once the krausen begins to drop, I slowly raise the temp to an 18C d-rest for 7 days, then keg with enough dextrose to carb to 2.5 units. I then cold crash the keg slowly (3C per day max). This allows for more yeast to clean up (lager) the beer quicker.

My experience is that lagering under 2.5units of CO2 does not seem to make any difference to the speed or quality of the lager when compared to when I've lagered uncarbonated. I think pressure affect on yeast was covered in a brewsmith podcast. I have a fuzzy memory that it was indicated that you would need a pressure far higher than usually achieved with kegs and standard regulators in order to ****** yeast metabolism. A quick google says that 7atm (700kPa) ******* yeast metabolism and 3MPa kills. So does trying to hit 3MPa at home - https://goo.gl/images/eem39F

 

[Rocker1986]

I'll be trying something similar to that except the ramp down will be occurring in the fermenter. The plan is to slowly ramp the temp down over a few days to about 3-4C, leave it sit for a week or so during which time I'll add my finings, then keg it and put on gas in the kegerator to sit for a few more weeks at near 0 before I get into it. I'm interested to see if it makes any difference to my current drop to 0C after the D-rest and leave it there method.

 

[gaijin]

Yeah that's exactly what I used to do until recently. The rationale for me cold crashing in keg is to allow for more yeast in the keg to assist lagering. This seemed to promote a quicker clean-up, but that could just be me. The first few glasses were like drinking Brisbane River water, so it's a bit of a trade-off. I think I got the idea from reading something indirectly suggesting it in Chris White's Yeast (book).

 

[brewgasm]

Last update this batch!

So Last night I had a poker night, 5 guys drinking the home brew and 1 drinking canned bourbon.
We went thru the entire keg and everyone was quite impressed and of course they should have been.
The only slightly negative comment was, "its not that clear!". I went on to add, that if I would have added fish guts or gelatin, would that have made it better!

This morning, no one had a headache!!!!!
Sucessfull 1st lager brew. )
And theres no more left

Clarity is overrated, it only comes about with filtration, age or adding something that doesn't belong in beer. I focus on flavour/aroma and body/mouthfeel. They are (to me atleast) the important aspects of the beer. Good to hear that there were no hangovers and kudos to your mate who stuck to his tinnies, he took one for the team leaving more for you and the others lol

 

[Rocker1986]

I find clarity can affect my perception of the flavour. Cloudy lagers just don't taste as good as clear ones to me, even if it's the same beer.

@gaijin I would crash in the keg if I had fridge space to do it. Then again I use polyclar during the cold crash and I prefer to leave it behind in the fermenter trub.