#1007 And Sulphur

[sink cut]

Hi guys,

Currently using #1007 for the first time in an Alt beer and as Wyeast mentions I am getting a bit of sulphur. The smell was quite obvious during fermentation but what is annoying me is that it is still present during Cold conditioning in the fermenter.

I know I can get rid of this by bubbleing large amounts of CO2 through the beer but I'd rather not go that far as I have noticed this can introduce other undesirable flavours.

Has anyone else noticed #1007 leaving sulphur in conditioning beer, and has it gone away by itself?

 

[manticle]

Used 1007 a couple of times and never had any sulphur.

My understanding of sulphur in ferment is that time heals all. I have heard of people using copper to remove sulphur from ciders - can't vouch for it or even tell you why it may or may not work (preumably some kind of electrochemical reaction)

 

[stuart13]

Has anyone else noticed #1007 leaving sulphur in conditioning beer, and has it gone away by itself?

Used it a couple of times at 13 - 14c. Stank of sulphur while fermenting. Slight smell after conditioning in secondary. Cleaned up after a few weeks in the bottle...

 

[hoohaaman]

Always get sulphur with wy 1007 at lower temps.After CC(I CC alts 3 weeks Min.) never a problem.

 

[sink cut]

Always get sulphur with wy 1007 at lower temps.After CC(I CC alts 3 weeks Min.) never a problem.

Good to hear.... I'll just go easy on it. (although its backing up my CC fidge :unsure: , I have another 60L batch waiting in line and another planned for the weekend)

 

[sink cut]

2 days on, and the rotten eggs smell is all gone.

 

[MHB]

Used 1007 a couple of times and never had any sulphur.

My understanding of sulphur in ferment is that time heals all. I have heard of people using copper to remove sulphur from ciders - can't vouch for it or even tell you why it may or may not work (preumably some kind of electrochemical reaction)

The old wives tale about whipping eggs in a copper bowl is actually true. Copper catalyses protein condensation, unfortunately this means it speeds up the formation of haze, the permanent sort.
There is argument that a bit of copper in the kettle might encourage break formation but the rule of thumb in brewing is "no copper downstream of the kettle".

MHB

 

[Kai]

Hi guys,

Currently using #1007 for the first time in an Alt beer and as Wyeast mentions I am getting a bit of sulphur. The smell was quite obvious during fermentation but what is annoying me is that it is still present during Cold conditioning in the fermenter.

I know I can get rid of this by bubbleing large amounts of CO2 through the beer but I'd rather not go that far as I have noticed this can introduce other undesirable flavours.

Slightly off topic, but I am interested in the comment that sparging with CO2 introduces undesirable flavours. What sort of flavours are you talking about? Bubbling CO2 through should technically only be stripping flavours out, not adding new ones.

 

[manticle]

The old wives tale about whipping eggs in a copper bowl is actually true. Copper catalyses protein condensation, unfortunately this means it speeds up the formation of haze, the permanent sort.
There is argument that a bit of copper in the kettle might encourage break formation but the rule of thumb in brewing is "no copper downstream of the kettle".

MHB

Pretty sure I remember someone here (maybe Komodo?) using a bit of clean sanitised copper in his fermenter full of sulphur smelling cider. He reported it clearing up quick smart. Might be in an early thread I started about the use of campden tablets.

Sorry for ignorance but by 'downstream of the kettle' you mean vessels before and including the kettle may contain copper but not fermenting vessels etc or do you mean actual positioning of the copper inside the kettle?

 

[sink cut]

Slightly off topic, but I am interested in the comment that sparging with CO2 introduces undesirable flavours. What sort of flavours are you talking about? Bubbling CO2 through should technically only be stripping flavours out, not adding new ones.

I find fresh CO2 in a beer always creates "Soda Water" type flavour which has a slight unpleasant bitterness to it and hides the nicer bitterness and flavours that you might actually have in your beer. Usually this flavour is greatly reduced about 2-3 days after initial carbonation and all but gone after about 7 days. Fo me its the main reason clear beer still needs at least 1-2 weeks in the keg before any good. If you ever have to recarbonate your beer (eg in a PET with a fizz cap) you get that same taste again. (dissapointing when out for dinner)

Recently I had a beer with A LOT of Sulphur in the Keg. I got rid of the sulphur quickly by pumping a Shite load of CO2 through the spear while letting the pressure out though the saftey valve. Even though after this the beer was not carbonated it did have the same old Fresh CO2 flavour x10. This time the unpleasant bitterness remained in the beer for about a month. It was very strage because it was only very lightly carbonated but had the fresh C02 flavour from hell, for a LONG time.

A big reason I dispense my beer with a nitrogen mix is because I cannot stand this fresh CO2 flavour. Using nitrogen and keeping the pressure high you can have beers with different carbonation leveles being dispensed at the same Pressure without having to worry about fresh Co2 being added to you beer.

 

[Kai]

Interesting. I've never noticed that but I do love soda water.

I will go as far as saying that I can taste a force-carbed beer that is freshly bottled, perhaps that's something similar.

 

[MHB]

Sorry for ignorance but by 'downstream of the kettle' you mean vessels before and including the kettle may contain copper but not fermenting vessels etc or do you mean actual positioning of the copper inside the kettle?

Downstream is used in terms of process.

No copper in contact with the beer after the kettle is the rule. Copper ions are a catalytic for protein condensation; beer is acidic enough to etch ions from any metallic copper or brass. These go into solution and there accelerate the formation of permanent haze. In the kettle the copper ions get bound up with the protein and drop out in the break material so immersion chillers and the like aren't a problem.

I can't comment on the use of copper in cider making, but suspect that cider isn't prone to haze formation in the same way that beer is.

MHB

 

[manticle]

Makes sense. Cheers

 

[Kai]

Downstream is used in terms of process.

No copper in contact with the beer after the kettle is the rule. Copper ions are a catalytic for protein condensation; beer is acidic enough to etch ions from any metallic copper or brass. These go into solution and there accelerate the formation of permanent haze. In the kettle the copper ions get bound up with the protein and drop out in the break material so immersion chillers and the like aren't a problem.

I can't comment on the use of copper in cider making, but suspect that cider isn't prone to haze formation in the same way that beer is.

MHB

Dropping a copper coin into a rotten-egg beer works pretty well, but it pays to remember you end up drinking all the skank from the surface of the coin! Makes your onesies and twosies nice and shiny though.

 

[MHB]

Where do I find a shudder emoticon.
M