Would You Pay For Ag Tutoring

[Effect]

Its a skewed audience here though. Almost by definition, the people reading this thread are the sort of people who are happy to go trawling through internet forums in order to get the information they need. I'm that sort of person, but i know a hell of a lot of people who aren't. I can think of plenty of people who, if faced with an internet forum of this type on any given topic like cooking, brewing, quilt making or whatever would throw their hands in the air and start looking for a class to go to.

<snip>

Disclosure - I'm qualified as both a brewer and an adult educator... So the thought of offering something like this has crossed my mind and i might even do it one day. So i guess i have a pre-disposition to thinking that formal classes in this stuff might be a good idea.

Ok TB. I agree with you a lot on what you are saying.

Were someone interested in learning how to cook or quilt, there are courses out there or one night classes. I remember my parents going to some of these (as my dad likes wine/food and my mum is a quilter). These courses/classes/learning experiences (or whatever you would like to call them) whether or not they were held at a quilting supply shop, restaurant, TAFE, community hall or whatever, the one thing that they all had in common was reputation. The teachers (or whatever you want to call the people who were providing the education) were recognised teachers or had been teaching for numerous years and follow a curriculum of sorts when teaching. They have earnt respect in their field of expertise. For instance, the chef teaching the wine/food pairing night has been working in the industry for numerous years, has his qualifications - which for me means that he has knowledge about what he is teaching from both extensive experience and through study.

I think brewing courses for those that aren't the type of person that enjoys forums and reading up on the process online or in a book is a great idea. The mash course held at the regency tafe is an example of this. I don't know much about the course that I have seen advertised on this forum before in sydney (I think it is run by vince or something), but from what I remember it is held at a microbrewery, is hands on and the person teaching you is from the industry, has experience in the field and has qualifications.

When I see homebrew shop owners hosting brew days to teach people on how to brew, I think that is also a great thing as well. The more the merrier. The more potential customers they will have, the more likely they will stay in business. The easier it is for me to acquire all grain brewing products. However, I disagree when a homebrew shop owner wants $300 (from a minimum of two students) to teach basically what any experienced homebrewer could.

IMO, and please don't take this the wrong way, homebrew shop owners are just very experienced home brewers that have a **** load of grain and hops. Too much that they have to open a shop and start selling it as their SWMBO is starting to get cranky about no space in the freezer because of the hops and can't park their car in the garage any more because of the pallets of grain. An experienced home brewer (with too much grain or not) shouldn't be asking for $150 per student to be taught the basics of brewing.

:icon_cheers:

 

[eamonnfoley]

My thoughts on this:

1) Internet gives more bad info than good info. You'll be ok if you can figure out what the good sources are: ie. how to brew, braukaiser, the brewing network (brew strong) etc. Use them as a basis and dont rely on random advice on forums.
2) You can usually get AG demos at good home brew shops. Or local homebrewers who are usually very friendly.
3) As long as the course isnt exorbitant in price, it may be worthwhile. My feeling is beginners brewing classes should be offered as a cheap and easy thing much like a basic cooking class. People are a little skeptical of expensive brewing courses offered by "consultants". I would feel much better about handing my money over to a university or TAFE.

 

[komodo]

TB has hit it!
How many times do we get a new person join the forums say "oh I've been mash brewing for 15 years but I've come across a new problem/idea/want to sell my gear etc." These guys arent on forums as a general rule.
Many of them dont want to sit down at a PC every night trawling forums for the information they need and they arent interested in the social side of forums/clubs.
A course is the ideal place for them to learn more.
Now advertising on AHB for courses is probably not really knowing your audience - then again the person looking for such a course may have joined AHB for exactly that reason - to find where they can do a course.

 

[HoppingMad]

The biggest problem with Tutoring is you are getting just one opinion on how to make beer from one guy at the front. As the OP pointed out, the best guidance he got was when he got more than one opinion. Why? Because there's more than one way to make the stuff.

If I got every AHB person in a giant warehouse with all their gear, going through their entire process, what would I find? What would I learn? And how can you teach that? All those complex variables? You can't. Particularly in a night or weekend course that runs over a handful of hours. It's impossible.

For a quick fix for the time poor beginner, tutorials are the way to go. For those that want to learn the variables and go deeper, you need to join a club, meet up with other AHB'ers, attend caseswaps or be involved in some sort community.

One of the biggest gaps in tutorials is that attendees aren't in many cases being judged on beers that they create after implementing what they've learned. They're just sitting in an auditorium/tafe lab/LHBS Shed and parting with cash to take in theory. You might get spoon-fed through a beer making process on someone else's gear but how much are attendees really doing themselves at many of these things?

IMHO The best way to learn is by doing it yourself, getting feedback once you've produced a beer, and sampling other people's beer and hearing their experiences. Doing this you will find your learning grows way more than sitting through a course. Because it's practical knowledge grown out of hard experience.

Hopper.

 

[ekul]

The biggest problem with Tutoring is you are getting just one opinion on how to make beer from one guy at the front. As the OP pointed out, the best guidance he got was when he got more than one opinion. Why? Because there's more than one way to make the stuff.

This is why brewdays are so good to attend. I had done one AG brew at home and then the locals found me and asked me over for a brewday. That brewday they had three systems running. There was a side by side (50L and 40L pots) biab rig, a 100L triple batcher BIAB rig and a 50L herms system. The boys also did chill and nochill. This was really helpful because it meant i could see where i wanted to go with my brewing, there's more than one way to mash a grain and all that.

Also, tasting the beer really gave me a boost of enthusiasm. I knew home brew could be ok and drinkable, but i didn't know that it was possible to make beer far superior to anything i had ever tasted before. To be honest i was very dubious of all the people on here sayig how great their beers were, as i wasn't making anything to write home about. But after tasting those beers at the brewday i done hook line and sinker!

I keep in contact with local brewers and we discuss at length the different things we try, this constant learning helps me brew better beer, and i don't think you could put a price on that. I also do not think that kind of learning experience could be structured into a 5 hour session.

 

[bignath]

This is why brewdays are so good to attend. I had done one AG brew at home and then the locals found me and asked me over for a brewday. That brewday they had three systems running. There was a side by side (50L and 40L pots) biab rig, a 100L triple batcher BIAB rig and a 50L herms system. The boys also did chill and nochill. This was really helpful because it meant i could see where i wanted to go with my brewing, there's more than one way to mash a grain and all that.

Also, tasting the beer really gave me a boost of enthusiasm. I knew home brew could be ok and drinkable, but i didn't know that it was possible to make beer far superior to anything i had ever tasted before. To be honest i was very dubious of all the people on here sayig how great their beers were, as i wasn't making anything to write home about. But after tasting those beers at the brewday i done hook line and sinker!

I keep in contact with local brewers and we discuss at length the different things we try, this constant learning helps me brew better beer, and i don't think you could put a price on that. I also do not think that kind of learning experience could be structured into a 5 hour session.

Good post ekul. :icon_cheers:

 

[AndrewQLD]

Dear ekul,

I have finally tracked you down.
In regards to your outstanding invoice of $450.00 for three brew day training sessions, according to my records this account is overdue by 9 mths, kindly pay by EFT within the next seven days.

Kind regards

The Bundy Brewers

 

[1975sandman]

I would have to agree - finding information on the interweb and attemding brew days at your LHBS are a great way to learn about brewing.

The only problem up here is that there are no brew days at the LHBS (only 1 anyway) and definately no paying courses to attend so I am trying to learn through what I can gather here in AHB and from other interweb sources.

Hopefully have the 3V all grain setup going soon..............

 

[bradsbrew]

Dear ekul,

I have finally tracked you down.
In regards to your outstanding invoice of $450.00 for three brew day training sessions, according to my records this account is overdue by 9 mths, kindly pay by EFT within the next seven days.

Kind regards

The Bundy Brewers

Kev dropped the GST and gave him a cash price. :lol: and you cant put a price on the sweat Kev puts into a brew..............

 

[AndrewQLD]

Kev dropped the GST and gave him a cash price. :lol: and you cant put a price on the sweat Kev puts into a brew..............

That's a fact!

 

[raven19]

Now that's the pot calling the kettle black, I've always thought Raven might of been the brewing love child of JM & GMK......... but he does AG not lambic K&K's

If only I could get that lucky! :blink: :lol:

But at the case swap Raven did have a sour on tap...

The Funky Sour Berliner!

Did you get taught by someone from the brewing industry with qualifications etc? i.e. A professional brewer? Would you also say that this course would be worthwhile for an experienced homebrewer? Did you get a certificate of completion of the course that is recognised (by TAFE and other reputable educational providers).

I am assuming that the answer would be yes to all those questions...

Yes (Stephen Nelson from Brew Boys ran the course).
Yes, nice certificate, and a heap of reference notes, etc.
Yes, worthwhile definately - however a brew day at a fellow AG brewers place would have been just as enlightening on the production component. The course had a heap more theory in it, 3 x evening sessions dedicated to brewing science. 3 x day sessions to brew and bottle. All spread out over 1 month. $400 ish from memory, however Tafe had a subsidy from the Govt as its a 'food course'! - so I think we only paid half that amount.