Why Move To Ag

[Nishy]

I've done a few kits brews and have just noticed this forum. Can anybody tell me why should I move to all grain brewing? Does the beer taste better? is it cheaper? and what is involved? i.e do I still use my kit fermenter?

Cheers

a very interested Daryl

 

[white.grant]

Oh boy.

Tasting better is a good place to start. You can still use your fermenter, you might want another one or two before your through. And this is the right place to learn, welcome.

grant

 

[goatherder]

In my experience the beer tastes better, the ingredients are cheaper (but not the setup costs) and yes, you still use your kit fermenter. But, the quality of your beer will still be utterly dependent on your sanitation and yeast handling skills. Bad sanitation or poor yeast treatment will give you bad beer, no matter what the method of brewing.

As for what is involved, keep reading this forum and howtobrew.com.

 

[mika]

More Gadgets in AG

 

[matti]

Try a Fresh wort kit to see the difference in flavour.
Then learn how to
welcome to the obsession

 

[Sparky]

Mate! Try a partial first. You should be able to use most of the gear found in the kitchen. Not much cost to take that step. Once you taste the partial you'll be itching to go all grain and have a better feel of the process and the gear you need.

Did one partial and went all grain and have never looked back.

Cheers

 

[himzol]

Theres also the benefit of total control over colour, bitterness and alcohol content.

 

[Back Yard Brewer]

Have made more AG's this year than K&K. Current score stands at 7 to 2. Never thought that would happen. I jumped straight into the darkside from K&K. More flavour, more control, more fun, more everything. But like someone else said, try one of those fresh wort kits first, then you will realise what you are missing.

BYB

 

[dicko]

Theres also the benefit of total control over colour, bitterness and alcohol content.

hi himzo,

You dont need to do AG to achieve those results.

What I suggest is that you do some basic research into AG brewing and a good start is to read "How to Brew"
by JJ Palmer.
The longest journey always starts with the first step.
If you study, understand, then, master AG brewing, the investment in equipment and knowledge will be well worth it.

Good luck with your brewing,

Cheers

My apologies - should have directed this reply to Nishy with reference to himzo

 

[Nishy]

wow thanks guys, I see there is much enthusiasm around this type of beer making, think I will check it out.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Cheers

Daryl

 

[itguy1953]

I've done a few kits brews and have just noticed this forum. Can anybody tell me why should I move to all grain brewing? Does the beer taste better? is it cheaper? and what is involved? i.e do I still use my kit fermenter?

Cheers

a very interested Daryl

I suggest that you look for a local home brewers club and go along to meetings. They will introduce you to lots of different AG brews, and you will start to desire to get the same control over your brews that other members do. You can also find a few freinds at the club, and ask them if you can help them with their next AG brew. They might offer you some wort for your assistance.

With kits, you get the colour and bitterness from the kit, and you have limited control over this, unless you add further grains in a partial, and add isohops for extra bitterness. Most kits have enough bitterness to balance the beer if you add up to 650g of LME, and the rest of the sugar as Dextrose. If you use more LME, you will find your beer underbittered, and you will need to add extra bitterness (normally done via isohops).

Something to watch will AG is the cost of the kit to get started. I have been doing kits so far, and I recently bought an AG system from another club member for $250, which is really cheap for what I got. I am planning to do my first AG very soon.

On cost, AG can be cheaper, but it all depends on how you buy your grain. If you can participate in a bulk buy (occassionally organised on the forum), you can get a 25Kg of base grain really cheap. Then you can buy speciality grains at inflated prices at you LHBS. If you buy all of your grain from your LHBS, your ingredients will work out far more expensive than the K&K alternative.

Another thing to watch out for is the time involved. With K&K I canget a brew in the fermenter within half an hour. With AG, you need to allow several hours, as you need to extract the sugars from the grain first (up to 2 hours), and then boil the wort for an hour or so with hops, then chillthe wort ready for yeast pitching.

Then there is the clean up. Yes, you end up with a better result, but it does come at a cost...in time.

Nevertheless, I am keen to get started with AG, and I am brewing up all of my kit stock at the moment, and building up an inventory of K&K beer, to keep me going over summer. Then I will treat my AG brews as premium ones, and drink them slowly, especially if I do not have the time to make more AG brews. At least I will have the K&K stock to fall back on.

Barry

 

[mikelinz]

The best way to get into AG is join a club that runs Brew Days. You get to see different setups and techniques and experience some really great brews (some HB shops run them too ie Grain and Grape)

If you add your location to your profile then ppl can suggest clubs etc

BIAB (brew in a bag) is a good low cost way to have a go at AG info http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=11694 and you could probably do small batches in your existing brew pot

 

[Screwtop]

I've done a few kits brews and have just noticed this forum. Can anybody tell me why should I move to all grain brewing? Does the beer taste better? is it cheaper? and what is involved? i.e do I still use my kit fermenter?

Cheers

a very interested Daryl

There's only one real way to be convinced. Taste it! There is no way you will continue spending time and money on making beer that doesn't taste as good.

Make contact with an Ag brewer close to you, to see what you are missing!

 

[stevenk]

hey boys on a serious note here im doing K&K for now but on a good avg what amount of money are we talking about setting everything you need up for AG.
and how much CASH MONEY does a brew (23L) end up costing allowing grains hopps ETC.

cheers steve.

 

[MVZOOM]

hey boys on a serious note here im doing K&K for now but on a good avg what amount of money are we talking about setting everything you need up for AG.
and how much CASH MONEY does a brew (23L) end up costing allowing grains hopps ETC.

cheers steve.

OK. Here we go. My AG setup cost for BIAB:

- Immersion Heater - $79
- Boiler / mashtun - Donated by a fellow AHB'er (thanks
- Bag for BIAB - about $10 all up
- Stirrer - $8
- Refrac - $80 - not necessary
- Probe Thermo - $36 via bulk buy

Now, I'm dutch. That's kind of close to Scottish - so I tend to buy bulk, in bulk buys. Or organise bulk buys....

Per 22l Batch:

- 5kg base malts / Wheat malt - $2 per kg (max) - $10
- $2 for specialty malts (crystal / choc etc)
- Hops, lets say 80g per brew, bought in bulk - $5 (max)
- Electricity for immersion heater - 90mins @ whatever rate = not much

Then your yeast cost.

So - $17 per 22L batch, circa $200 to setup if you can wangle a boiler from somewhere.

Very good beer. Very good indeed. Makes you start questioning the relevance of Lion Nathan.

Cheers - Mike

 

[stevenk]

GOD thats a whole lot cheaper then what i thought hahaha.

i no a few boilers and i no a pressure welder so i should have no probs with that.

i may have to do a few more kit beers then start trying a few AG'S

ive see na few vids of AG brewing looks alot funner then adding goo to water and from what people say the results are worth $200 is F'all. lol.

 

[Duff]

Why move to AG?

Because you are not a real brewer unless you brew AG.


(I'm surprised no one had mentioned that yet.........)

 

[MVZOOM]

GOD thats a whole lot cheaper then what i thought hahaha.

i no a few boilers and i no a pressure welder so i should have no probs with that.

i may have to do a few more kit beers then start trying a few AG'S

ive see na few vids of AG brewing looks alot funner then adding goo to water and from what people say the results are worth $200 is F'all. lol.

The other thing is, now I've done 25-30 of them, I can do em with my eyes closed. Seriously, there's no mystery and I'm not a smart guy.

I can't tell you how good a fresh, hoppy APA is via AG. You will not get this from a kit - ever. I have had some amazing kit beers and the best of them match commercial 'lagers'. How good is a Heineken brewed in AU? About 1/2 as good as a normal AG.

Cheers - Mike

 

[afromaiko]

Now, I'm dutch. That's kind of close to Scottish - so I tend to buy bulk, in bulk buys. Or organise bulk buys....

Per 22l Batch:

- 5kg base malts / Wheat malt - $2 per kg (max) - $10
- $2 for specialty malts (crystal / choc etc)
- Hops, lets say 80g per brew, bought in bulk - $5 (max)

Then your yeast cost.

So - $17 per 22L batch, circa $200 to setup if you can wangle a boiler from somewhere.

Unless you buy in bulk (ie: 25kg sacks) you aren't going to get a recipe together for this cheap. Buying only enough grain for one brew at a time will usually cost you $20 - $25. The hops are roughly $5 - $9 a brew, then you'll need a dried yeast which is about $4.

So you can see could quite easily add up to $35 for one batch. (Add to this about $10 for shipping if internet ordering.) That said, a good K&K or extract recipe will be the same cost anyway, especially those Brewcraft kits. Your all grain brew will be a million times better than any of those.

AG is pretty straightforward, it just takes more time. If you get into it a serious way then consider going in for a grain bulk buy with others here on the forum. In order to get their grain so cheap they need to purchase something like a minimum of 20 x 25kg sacks, so everyone chucks in and grabs a couple of bags each. But then you'll also need a grain mill

 

[himzol]

hi himzo,

You dont need to do AG to achieve those results.

What I suggest is that you do some basic research into AG brewing and a good start is to read "How to Brew"
by JJ Palmer.
The longest journey always starts with the first step.
If you study, understand, then, master AG brewing, the investment in equipment and knowledge will be well worth it.

Good luck with your brewing,

Cheers

My apologies - should have directed this reply to Nishy with reference to himzo

Hi Dicko,

Yep your quite right, you don't have to do AG to get the same results, but it's not anywhere near as much fun. You know what I mean... Do I need a protein rest?, Do I do a step infusion or decoction, what will be my strike temp, what water profile...etc.etc. Ahhhh It's a great slide to be slipping down.

FWIW been an AG brewer now for about two years went straight from K&K, still do the odd extract brew when pushed for time though.

H.