Why Is There So Much Crap?

[PostModern]

Big breweries brew big batches, pitch huge amounts of yeast that have to bottom ferment in a fermenter that is 10 stories high. The yeast are under so much pressure (literally) that they can't possibly turn out a decent beer. Economics comes into it too, in terms of hops and ease of filtering said hop mess out of the beer, but 90% of the reason, I think you'll find, is that the yeast just can't handle the weight of the wort.

 

[johnno]

Economics???.....Hmmmmm......I don'tbuy it <_<

batron,
I reckon economics is the major factor with the megabreweries. Thats why they use cane sugar and ny old cheap crap to make the beer.
A while ago when I was reading Papazians The homebrewers companion he summed it up pretty well.
As homebrewers making all grain batches at an average of 23 litres we dont need to worry about efficiency too much. The bottom line is we can spend the extra dollar or two for that extra bit of grain in the mash to up the efficiency and not worry about breaking the bank.
Imagine if the megabreweries made AG needed to do this all year round to hit their efficiency. Making how many millions of litres of beer. How much extra grain would they need? Therefore upping the cost significantly.
It was something along those lines anyway.

cheers
johnno

 

[phantom]

I remember seeing a segment (infomercial) on a local postcards program,where they did a tour of the West End brewery at Thebarton.Home of dishwater draught.
The used yeast sludge is sold to kraft and used to make vegemite(profit at every possible point).

 

[Batz]

Hey !!!

I like vegemite !!

Coopers also sell there spent yeast for vegemite, it's got to come from some place

Batz h34r:

 

[bartron]

wow....got some good discussion going...and some good answers too.

I'll still buy the odd case of commercial here or there...mainly becasue some guests shudder at the thought of being served homebrew either becasue they've heard stories or from being served some kit+sugar concoction with the mouthfeel of an unpeeled pineapple (not my Dad though....he had a taste of my first ever brew at my sons christening. A bit gassy in my opinion. He thought it was OK. Next morning there were 7 extra empty bottles that I didn't open....750ml ones too :chug: ).

I know the tastes of a nation aren't going to change in a hurry but it interests me that at some time in the past some mass produced larger substitute became the preferred flavour...maybe becase it was mass produced that the quality declined....who knows. I will be an interesting documentary to watch on Discovery one day. Obviously the quality didn't decline too much otherwise people wouldn't drink the stuff....not en masse anyway.

The used yeast sludge is sold to kraft and used to make vegemite

I didn't know the 'yeast extract' was beer yeast....makes sense though. As for other food trivia....there is a reason why I don't eat hot dogs.

Cheers :beer:

Bartron

 

[Wortgames]

I tend to believe that the big guys have deliberately and carefully brewed their beer to have less and less character over the years. Couple that with a sub 2 degree serving temp and Joe Schmoe is quite happy drinking fizzy water if it gets him drunk.

What bothers me more is the price I pay for 'premium' Aussie beer. Don't get me wrong - I'll take a James Squire over a VB any day - but when the Squire is virtually the same price as the genuine European brew (which has been shipped halfway around the planet), I feel like a fool buying the local one that's made with Australian malt and pelletized hops when I could be drinking the one they are trying to copy.

 

[Kai]

Big breweries brew big batches, pitch huge amounts of yeast that have to bottom ferment in a fermenter that is 10 stories high. The yeast are under so much pressure (literally) that they can't possibly turn out a decent beer.

You've piqued my curiosity with that statement, PoMo. Where did you read that? Not that I'm doubting you, I'm just intrigued and want to read up on it myself.

 

[redbeard]

Big breweries brew big batches, pitch huge amounts of yeast that have to bottom ferment in a fermenter that is 10 stories high.

i know u were having a bit of fun. the tanks are more like 5 storeys high. i live near the now ex cub brewery in broadway. you can still see a couple of them in the obviously tall building towards the intersection of abercrombie & broadway. interestingly it has (very dirty) windows at the front, so u can sortof look inside. half of the roof is missing, where the've removed half the tanks. they went on a barge upto qld i think. cub/tooheys is run by accountants, to maximise profits, keep shareholders 'happy' & keep market share thru gimicks & blatant advertising.

i think they could produce very good beers if pressed, but like banks / television / newspapers / home telephony, there's a nice cosy oligopoly happening & both sides of politics are too removed / comfortable / uncaring to change it. most of the upstart breweries end up being bought out by cub or lion nathan. if they dont, they just struggle / survive becasue of the contractual arrangements breweries force on pubs ie the only beers on tap will be ......
</rant>

curiously i had a pub lunch at a different watering hole today. it had maybe 6 or 8 taps with usual new/carlton fair. one workmate & myself (both craftbrewers) went for coopers. the other two went for vb, thou they were oracle dba's & finished their beer before us. next to the fridge behind the bar, were 3 cartons of beez neez. i asked if they had any cold ones. she said, they were delivered by mistake. both coopers workmate & myself said it was a really nice beer & they should put some in the fridge. bar girl was slightly interested but not to the point of actually opening the carton. they had a reasonable selection of bottled beer but the pub wasnt interested in promoting 'new stuff' unless lion nathan told them too.

lastly, we thought our coopers had been in the fridge a couple months. we were impressed it had a best after date, rather than a best before date. just to round it off, the food was pretty average.

general question: once a cub/tooheys keg is tapped, how long before it goes stale ?
1 month ? or is this unlikely to happen given the small choice & turnover ?

cheers

 

[Sean]

Big breweries brew big batches, pitch huge amounts of yeast that have to bottom ferment in a fermenter that is 10 stories high. The yeast are under so much pressure (literally) that they can't possibly turn out a decent beer.

You've piqued my curiosity with that statement, PoMo. Where did you read that? Not that I'm doubting you, I'm just intrigued and want to read up on it myself.

[post="50631"][/post]​

I'm not convinced by this - there are some excellent beers produced in tall cylindro-conical fermenters (eg Fullers).

There's no technical reason why big brewers can't produce great beer - just look at some of the big Czech breweries. But why would they when they can produce crap cheaply and sell that instead?

 

[sosman]

The point is, homebrewers make up a poofteenth of buggerall of the market. Big brewers don't give a rats about what we think, whether it is "right" or "wrong".

There are two kinds of beer, one kind is brewed for its taste, another is brewed for profit. Yes there are shades in between but ultimately there is a compromise.

Take a look at the quality of micro brewery's beer as they get bigger and take more market share. The OG goes down, the hopping levels are reduced.

We have about as much chance of changing that as the feminists do in eliminating "exploitation of women" in advertising.

Maybe there are some parallels in the world coffee market. The lowest common denominator almost invariably wins.

 

[Sean]

We have about as much chance of changing that as the feminists do in eliminating "exploitation of women" in advertising.

[post="50655"][/post]​

Not entirely true - CAMRA has made a huge difference to the UK brewing industry.