Water Chemistry - Please Read This

[manticle]

I'm not convinced by the recent water analysis you mention though Haysie (from this thread). It took a week to get to the US - my understanding is that tests need to be done ASAP to have any relevance.

I go off the 2010 water analysis from Melbourne water which Wolfy posted. My water comes from two reservoirs so I take a median average for the relevant values.

Starting from scratch with RO water and building your own profile is probably a great idea though. A few years away for me yet I think.

 

[michael_aussie]

This is the one I think Ferg! Is very good albeit very old i.e if you line the water profile up against hmmm? somebody recently had a Melbourne water analysis done, they are chalk n cheese pardon the pun. These days with all the rains, increased dam levels, water being pumped all over the state I would imagine its difficult to say one size fits all.
If I was to get seriously into water treatment, my starting point would be R/O water.

ty for the link to the article.
Some hard-core chemistry to digest there.
A whole new area of brewing that I was blind to variables.... ty again.

 

[jasonharley]

You can fairly cheaply gain an understanding of water chem. Firstly, Ca and Mg water test kits that give you a reasonable degree of accuracy (+/- 10 ppm). You can also test for pH (obviously) so you have most of the parameters that you need to know your water. Supplemented by monthly water quality reports from the local water authority you can make some broad assumptions on the correlates of other parameters. All this can be as cheap as $80 to set up.

5 eyes

 

[Bribie G]

If I'm pushing a particular style I'll use RO water and salts per EZwater spreadsheet - and a good teaspoon of the brown yeast nutrient (not the white) to provide anything that has been stripped out such as boron, zinc in particular, arsenic, unobtanium etc etc.

However as I spent $250 on the unit, if it's a keg filler / quaffer and I'm happy with middle of the road malt vs hops (e.g. my Mid Atlantic Red) I'll use either half and half town water or just town water with some extra calcium as an insurance to prolong its life between filter changes.

Without the RO unit I wouldn't even attempt something like a pale continental lager using Bribie Island water.

 

[manticle]

Do you treat your town water in any way besides extra Ca bribie? eg boil to remove temporary hardness and free chlorine, sodium met to remove chloramines (if required) etc?

 

[Bribie G]

Not yet, when I use town water direct I get it out of the HWS and it's just about at strike temperature - the chlorine has been taken care of already. Before I got the RO, every beer that ever won anything in a comp was made on HWS liqour h34r:

 

[Dave70]

My H2o comes direct from the sky via a coluor bond roof and stored in a 100,000L concrete tank.
Whats that word on tank water?

 

[Kieren]

My H2o comes direct from the sky via a coluor bond roof and stored in a 100,000L concrete tank.
Whats that word on tank water?

Rain water is considered to be void of ions for the purposes of brewing. It may differ slightly from region to region but as long as you don't live near Fukushima or are prone to acid rain you will be fine. Treat it as deionised water.

 

[michael_aussie]

Rain water is considered to be void of ions for the purposes of brewing. It may differ slightly from region to region but as long as you don't live near Fukushima or are prone to acid rain you will be fine. Treat it as deionised water.

would the industrial areas (Newcastle, Latrobe Valley) have any extras?? I always understood that the power stations caused slightly acidic rain??

would the concrete tank add anything to the water??

 

[Kieren]

would the industrial areas (Newcastle, Latrobe Valley) have any extras?? I always understood that the power stations caused slightly acidic rain??

would the concrete tank add anything to the water??

These q's are beyond my limited knowledge. My suggestion would be to get it tested. Do you drink your rainwater? If you think it's safe to drink then it's safe to brew. As for ion content - not sure.

 

[Steve@PMF82]

in my experience, rainwater in concrete tanks will leach some minerals over time, making the water a little harder and a bit more alkaline.

 

[bear09]

Barrett and smith pathologists in Penrith can do just about any water test you need, at one point they even helped me get my water tested for radiation. <_<
regards,
Norto

How much was it?

Did it have all the required detail that brewing water calculations require?

Cheers.

 

[vic45]

bear09, I had two samples tested at Ecowise in Geelong, they have branches in Melbourne as well.

Cost $ 70 each, analysis covers all you need. You tell them what you want listed.

Cheers

 

[bear09]

bear09, I had two samples tested at Ecowise in Geelong, they have branches in Melbourne as well.

Cost $ 70 each, analysis covers all you need. You tell them what you want listed.

Cheers

Awesome - thanks man.

 

[Wolfy]

If I'm pushing a particular style I'll use RO water and salts per EZwater spreadsheet - and a good teaspoon of the brown yeast nutrient (not the white) to provide anything that has been stripped out such as boron, zinc in particular, arsenic, unobtanium etc etc.

...

Without the RO unit I wouldn't even attempt something like a pale continental lager using Bribie Island water.

Given the low concentration of salts in Melbourne water, I generally treat it the same as RO/distilled water, it has the advantage that one can easily build most any water-profile, but the disadvantage that if you do nothing your beer is likely not to be as good as it could.

 

[colonel]

I've been wondering about that.
We've been drinking tank water for decades, with no problems, even though it's got a lot of possum/bird shit in it.
But do those greeblies have any effect on the brew?
Bacteria, wild yeasts etc?

These q's are beyond my limited knowledge. My suggestion would be to get it tested. Do you drink your rainwater? If you think it's safe to drink then it's safe to brew. As for ion content - not sure.

 

[Superoo]

QUOTE>
"But do those greeblies have any effect on the brew?
Bacteria, wild yeasts etc?"

I would imagine they are all 'NUKED' when you boil for at least an hour.

I use rainwater too, and cant say its ever caused a problem.
I use starsan so that I dont have to rinse anything and all has been OK for 48 brews so far.

 

[Superoo]

I have never looked at the water side closely, but would like to after reading this thread.

When you wise people do your PH measurements, roughly how much would the PH drop pre and post mash, without using additives for PH corection.

Say when doing a light Ale with no dark grains and using clean rainwater ?

cheers

Edit : reworded

 

[big78sam]

I really need to look at this again.

All I had was calcium chloride and used it for a while until I tested my mash PH and it was 4.9. I just had "aim for 5.2" in my head along with "CaCl lowers PH" so stopped using it. Reading the 'Key Concepts' again carefully (a PH of 4.9 is fine) and this thread I'm going to look at this carefully now...

 

[felten]

I've been wondering about that.
We've been drinking tank water for decades, with no problems, even though it's got a lot of possum/bird shit in it.
But do those greeblies have any effect on the brew?
Bacteria, wild yeasts etc?

All vegetative bacteria will be killed in your typical 60m+ boil, spores of some kinds can survive the boil but probably not from beer spoilers (like botulism). Fermenting/finished beer is a pretty inhospitable place for most organisms.